ESA/JSA sanctions

Mr_Falling_Star

I am normally pretty good with Benefit queries but here is on that I don't know the answer to!

Mr A gets stressed out by work and walks out, he goes and claims ESA from the Jobcentre.

Four weeks later he feels better and claims JSA. Will he be sanctioned for walking out?

Its only a theoretical question but one someone has asked me and I don't know what to say.

Thanks in advance

allen35

Mr_Falling_Star wrote: »

I am normally pretty good with Benefit queries but here is on that I don't know the answer to!

Mr A gets stressed out by work and walks out, he goes and claims ESA from the Jobcentre.

Four weeks later he feels better and claims JSA. Will he be sanctioned for walking out?

Its only a theoretical question but one someone has asked me and I don't know what to say.

Thanks in advance

Hope this helps:

Voluntarily leaving work

Voluntarily leaving work means voluntarily leaving work as an employee. It can include leaving a job for health reasons, volunteering for early retirement, leaving because of a family move, and any other reason where a client leaves a job which continues to exist. The client will have to fill in a form indicating her/his reasons for leaving. Her/his case will usually then be referred to a decision maker who will write to the client's employer to ask for a statement. The client is entitled to comment on statements made about her/him, so s/he will usually be able to see a copy of the employer's statement.

Losing a job because of misconduct

If a client loses her/his job because of misconduct, s/he may be able to argue there was no misconduct. For example, if s/he was unable to do her/his job as quickly as others in spite of her/his efforts, this would not be misconduct. When a client claims JSA, the DWP should ask her/his employer about the circumstances in which s/he left work.

The sanction decision
Where a decision maker is considering whether the client left a job voluntarily or lost it due to misconduct, or whether to impose one of the [URL="file:///C:/Program%20Files/AdviserNet%20CD/AdviserNet%20EW%20files/09060010_EWSNI_JOBSEEKER_S_ALLO.HTM#sanctions"]sanctions[/URL], the client will receive JSA until a decision is reached. If the client disagrees with the decision, s/he can [URL="file:///C:/Program%20Files/AdviserNet%20CD/AdviserNet%20EW%20files/09060010_EWSNI_JOBSEEKER_S_ALLO.HTM#challenging_a_jobseeker's_allowance_decision"]challenge[/URL] it.

Mr_Falling_Star

Thanks mate !

allen35

Not quite sure if it will apply though Mr F due to claiming ESA due to sickness which was probably backed up by his GP.

He may not be questioned but there are workers from DWP who post on here to confirm if voluntarily left work applies.

cit_k

NOt even sure why someone in that position would be able to get away with not being sanctioned (or risking a sanction) at ESA stage.

They left their job of their own free will, instead of going on the sick, getting fired due to being on the sick to long, whatever.

And they recovered in 4 weeks, so not that ill really if a month off did the trick. Should have stayed in the job and took legal advice/went on sick officially.

Walking out, they deserve a sanction imo...

dookar

allen35 wrote: »

Not quite sure if it will apply though Mr F due to claiming ESA due to sickness which was probably backed up by his GP.

He may not be questioned but there are workers from DWP who post on here to confirm if voluntarily left work applies.

It will still apply. A claim to ESA will be accepted as strong evidence, but as mentioned one must question why the person could not remain in employment if they were to recover so quickly.

Lots more info needed

melbi_uk

I resigned from work due to ill health because I was off more than I was in for over 12 months. I knew it was costing my employer a lot of money as he had to use an agency to keep covering for me.

I thought a 3/4 months off I'd recover and be able to go back to work (luckily my employer told me he would have no problem taking me back when I felt better).

As it happened I didn't improve so 3 months later I went onto ESA. They back paid me the 3 months too.

I was actually off work sick for 1 month when I resigned.

cassieB57

A sanction may be imposed if the DM thinks Mr A left voluntarily without just cause, but the days when he was incapable of work would then be deducted from the length of the sanction. He would be given the chance to give his reasons for leaving which the DM will take into account.

allen35

melbi_uk wrote: »

I resigned from work due to ill health because I was off more than I was in for over 12 months. I knew it was costing my employer a lot of money as he had to use an agency to keep covering for me.

I thought a 3/4 months off I'd recover and be able to go back to work (luckily my employer told me he would have no problem taking me back when I felt better).

As it happened I didn't improve so 3 months later I went onto ESA. They back paid me the 3 months too.

I was actually off work sick for 1 month when I resigned.

Hi Mel

Mr A has stopped his claim to ESA after 4 weeks though and applied for JSA, as Cassie mentions this will probably be looked at by a DM to see if voluntarily left work without good reason.

melbi_uk

allen35 wrote: »

Hi Mel

Mr A has stopped his claim to ESA after 4 weeks though and applied for JSA, as Cassie mentions this will probably be looked at by a DM to see if voluntarily left work without good reason.

Thanks allen, I can see now why there might be a problem. Surely the OP's GP would have had to issue sick (fit) notes for the 4 weeks he claimed ESA? So now he is feeling better would JS not be able to check this?

But yes, now I understand what others are saying, why quit work if only ill for 4 weeks, seems very drastic measures.

I know when I started claiming ESA the lady who dealt with me from the DWP mentioned she could see I had been putting sick notes in for some time while working and told me there would be no problem claiming ESA.

I wonder now if maybe the person is looking at the option of coming off ESA onto JSA but wants to know if he could claim JSA. Is JSA more than ESA? If not, then I wonder why he would want to move so quickly onto JSA?

Surely if you feel so ill as to resign then 4 weeks on ESA isn't going to make you instantly better??

Like I mentioned, when I resigned on the grounds of ill health, I wanted to give myself some stress free time in the hope it would help my anxiety and depression, so I stopped getting sick notes off my GP (still saw him every other week though) thinking that after a rest I would be well enough to work again.

As it happens, I wasn't and it was my GP that gave me the number to claim ESA along with a sick note for them.

Mmmm, perhaps something isn't quite right when you look at it that way.

But I'd like to think he was/is doing the right thing and not claiming ESA under false pretences by coming off that and on to JSA.

We don't know the type off illness he resigned for do we?

Sorry, I'm gong on too much again :o

melbi_uk

......Sorry........

And he walked out so gave no notice???? He could have worked his notice while off sick as I did (recommended by Occupational Health)