Vendor is pulling out. Can I get compensation for survey and legal fees?

JQ.

I'm having not having a go, the questions below are genuine interest :

So who decides on what properties are worth?

Surveyors should rely on market evidence to assess the value of the property based on comparable transactions of similar properties. In England comparables are based on what Joe Public agrees to pay for properties, as a result generally of extended markert research and then detailed negotiations - a willing seller and a willing buyer.

In Scotland it would appear, that Jo Public pays what they are informed it is worth by a Surveyor. So all the evidence is created by Surveyors, as everyone decides what a property is worth based on a pre-existing report available to both sides of the transaction. That surely makes negotiation difficult, as both sides are told what it's worth by the Surveyor from the outset - they're not using their own judgement.

It would appear house values in Scotland are therefore not created in a open market place, where buyers and sellers negotiate prices but where they are told the value of the property by a Surveyor and that essentially dictates values.

Lori007

Unfortunately with our system you will be unable to reclaim monies spent although hopefully your Solcitors fees will be low or, if you decide not to proceed with this sale and retain the Solicitors they might agree not to charge anything as long as you use them for the next purchase. Could you look at something just outside of London? I have a few friends who travel approx 1 hr just so that they could buy a large house for similar or less money then you would use for a flat in London plus it gave them a much larger area to choose from. On a slightly different note, I have some friends whose purchasers threatened to pull out on day of exchange unless they accepted £12000 less! They were so angry they told the buyers where to go and took their house of the market for a year. When they placed it back on they got some lovely people and have now moved on. In the meantime, some people who lived down the road from them came knocking on their door one evening, somewhat drunk, since the same people who had gazumped them had just done the same to them but they were not able to pull out since he was moving for work reasons and had to accept the loss. Plus the exchange was due one week before completion so they had already packed pretty much everything up! Some people are despicable! Anyway, hope it all works out for you - I'm sure it will in the end.

kingstreet

adouglasmhor wrote: »

You obviously are a bit out of date with your info, maybe you should check before posting.

So obviously out of date that I did actually concede that in post #26 and thanked those concerned for correcting me. Your guidance is also warmly welcomed.

To any forumites aggrieved by my poor understanding and incorrect assertion, I most humbly apologise.

shortchanged_2

I think what has been highlighted from this discussion so far that probably the house buying process in England and Wales really could do with some reform.

What the answers are I don't really know. Maybe it is something that government could look into because as it stands far too many people are unfairly left out of pocket.

adouglasmhor

kingstreet wrote: »

So obviously out of date that I did actually concede that in post #26 and thanked those concerned for correcting me. Your guidance is also warmly welcomed.

To any forumites aggrieved by my poor understanding and incorrect assertion, I most humbly apologise.

Sorry I missed your earlier post.

kingstreet

adouglasmhor wrote: »

Sorry I missed your earlier post.

No worries. I was brought up to admit when you're wrong and not continue digging the hole you're burying yourself in!

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

bris wrote: »

HAMISH there is not as many differences in our system as you think. Although the seller has to get a valuation as part of the report the lenders are still insisting (a lender will not accept a survey after a month as they say it's outdated to get round the law) on their own reports so this part is flawed for a start.

False.

Mortgage lenders, or at least the main high street banks, are accepting home report values from local surveyors on their panel for up to 90 days.

I have heard of a few cases cases with online lenders, or English lenders that don't have a presence locally, requiring another survey. And also of cases where the local banks won't accept surveys from the cheap national providers as they're not on the local panel.....

But if you're dealing with a major high street bank and a reputable surveyor on the local panel, then the system works as described.

The gazumping and gazundering happens as much here as it does in England and until missives are concluded the buyer or seller is free to walk away at any point. The system in Scotland would not have helped the OP in this case because he could have still pulled out as missives would not have been exchanged.

Sorry, but you're wrong again.

The formal offer acceptance process is the exchange of missives in Scotland. No offer is legally binding until it's accepted formally as part of the exchange of missives between your solicitor and the solicitor of the vendor, however this is a quick process and is usually done within a week or two.

From that point on, the offer is binding, and gazumping/gazundering simply cannot happen.

In the case of the OP, there is no way they would have got so far down the process without knowing for sure their offer had been accepted and was legally binding.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

JQ. wrote: »

I'm having not having a go, the questions below are genuine interest :

So who decides on what properties are worth?

A willing buyer and a willing seller.

There is nothing to state a seller must sell for the HR valuation, nor that a buyer must buy for the HR valuation.... Just as in England there is nothing to say that a buyer and seller must sell for the banks mortgage valuation.

alanmilstein

The Home Information Pack that was a requirement (for a short time) in England and Wales was originally going to have a proper condition survey included. By law the surveyor who carried out the survey would have been liable to the seller, the buyer and the lender i.e. the fact that it was a seller paid-for survey would not have mattered. It would still have been reliable.

As has been stated in this thread already, the HIP was the first stage of a reformation of the house buying/selling process in England and Wales which possibly would have avoided some of the issues that cause such strife.

Through a process of ignorance, vested interests and Government ineptitude the HIP became a debacle and died an unloved death. It's pretty certain that the experience will make any Government in the forseeable future stay well clear of tinkering in the machinations of the property market.

So, when you experience the frustration of failed conveyancing chains and lost costs, please appreciate that there are those of us that have a genuine interest in reforming the process, but the likes of the RICS, the National Association of Estate Agents, and others effectively scuppered the HIP and any chances of reform.

JQ.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

A willing buyer and a willing seller.

There is nothing to state a seller must sell for the HR valuation, nor that a buyer must buy for the HR valuation....

Yes, but I'll bet not many people deviate from that value. If an expert tells me my house is worth £100k , why on earth would I sell it for £75,000?

If both the vendor and purchaser were represented by their own Surveyors who negtiated the price, I could understand it. But as it stands it still looks tome that Sale Prices are dictated by a 3rd party.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Just as in England there is nothing to say that a buyer and seller must sell for the banks mortgage valuation.

Yes but by the time that is produced a price has already been agreed. And that sale price was agreed openly between them, without their opinions being influenced by an expert paid for by the vendor. Plus only one side gets to see the mortgage valuation, unless the buyers try to chip.