Train fine issued despite valid ticket

Billicks

Hi all,

Just wondered if you thought there's any room for appeal in this.

I added funds to my Oyster card specifically for this journey (Wimbledon to Tooting - just two stops!), and touched the card against the reader on the platform so it beeped.

It was then checked on the train, and for some reason that beep hadn't registered and was then issued with a £20 fine, which I naturally contested with him.

He advised that he had to issue it and the only thing to do was to appeal (within 20 days). I've recently received a letter back to say this had (surprise surprise) been unsuccessful and that it now has to be paid.

Does anyone have any advice on this? It is just ludicrous that I've done everything required to legally board that train and yet a £2 journey is costing me £20!

fivetide

did it take the fee off the card?

Can you show that you topped up and what the balance was just prior to the journey and the balance now to show you 'paid'?

Not sure how Oysters clocks these things?

Alternatively if a barrier opened for you then maybe you are on cctv and can ask them to review?

5t.

geordieracer

did you check to see if the beep you heard was one of acceptance and not one of rejection? Im guessing the inspector used his portable reader to check your oyster and this came back with you not touching in correctly at the start of your journey.

Fivetide - It matters not whether they have topped p or not - what matters is if the reader accepted the way in which the card was presented to it. Many people believe they can hover over the reader and it has accepted it and take off the correct amount when it needs to be placed on it.

Op - go to a ticket counter and ask for a run down of your journeys on your card - if you done everything correctly as you say you have and the reader did accept it then it will show as an incomplete journey from your starting station. If not then it has not gone correctly and unfortunately you have not presented a valid ticket for your journey.

mind you if your card is registered with them then this would've shown when they investigated your appeal - or if the inspector took down your oyster card number on your PF.

wealdroam

Have a look at this unofficial Oyster website.

Lots of info there. Maybe ask for help there too.

Billicks

Cheers for replying fivetide.

I scanned in a printout of the history on the Oyster for the appeal - this shows me adding the funds prior to boarding the train, and also 'finishing' the journey.

However, the problem is that it didn't register me touching the card on the reader to start the journey - despite it beeping (both myself and my fiancee heard this).

Re the barriers, they were open at the front of the station so I walked straight through and then used the reader on the actual platform - ironically to be sure that it'd recognise it was for an overground journey (Wimbledon has underground lines too).

I guess they must have CCTV on the platforms too though.

geordieracer

Billicks wrote: »

Cheers for replying fivetide.

I scanned in a printout of the history on the Oyster for the appeal - this shows me adding the funds prior to boarding the train, and also 'finishing' the journey.

However, the problem is that it didn't register me touching the card on the reader to start the journey - despite it beeping (both myself and my fiancee heard this).

Re the barriers, they were open at the front of the station so I walked straight through and then used the reader on the actual platform - ironically to be sure that it'd recognise it was for an overground journey (Wimbledon has underground lines too).

I guess they must have CCTV on the platforms too though.

And thats the problem. Adding funds makes no odds really. Its because you didnt touch in and even though it beeped im guessing it was the non acceptance beep so you didnt have a valid ticket.

sorry

Billicks

geordieracer wrote: »

And thats the problem. Adding funds makes no odds really. Its because you didnt touch in and even though it beeped im guessing it was the non acceptance beep so you didnt have a valid ticket.

sorry

Do you know in what other instances it would beep? Other than having insufficient funds?

geordieracer

Billicks wrote: »

Do you know in what other instances it would beep? Other than having insufficient funds?

yes when it hasnt picked up the RFD signal correctly - by it not being presented clearly to the reader.

sorry to say this and it is going to sound harsh - but in the eyes of the inspector and the appeals people - the journey was not started - no matter whether you say it has beeped or not. And with you admitting that the barriers were open - did you mention this on yoru appeal - makes no odds as the ticekt was not validated before the start of your journey

Billicks

geordieracer wrote: »

yes when it hasnt picked up the RFD signal correctly - by it not being presented clearly to the reader

Balls.

Ok, well cheers for your help anyway. Looks like I have to bite the bullet with this one then. Very frustrating.

wealdroam

Billicks wrote: »

Wimbledon has underground lines too.

There are also trams there.

Have another look at that website I linked to earlier.

In particular, this page specifically about Wimbledon and the complicated Oyster arrangements there.

geordieracer

Billicks wrote: »

Balls.

Ok, well cheers for your help anyway. Looks like I have to bite the bullet with this one then. Very frustrating.

aye it is.. when i used to use pre pay i always looked at the display to make sure that it showed the debit as i embarrassingly got caught on the tram with a none valid journey.. lucky i had the cash to pay straight away.

but always beware