Unable to pay funeral costs at triple fees.

themull1

paupers grave is a bit old fashioned. could he not be buried without the headstone, and do something else for his memory instead? plant a tree, or money for a park bench with his details on it?

Deep_Ocean

Yes we could. But the point is really that we want everything done properly. We don't want his grave to be one without a headstone, and we don't want to be the family who don't pay their dues. My query really is whether we should actually have to pay £7,000 when residents who have only lived there for 5 minutes would only have to pay £3,000. If we have to pay £7,000, then thats it, we will have to take out credit cards and loans etc. But it doesn't seem fair that it was his church where he would go every Christmas, where he was baptised and confirmed. Yet he has to pay more than double of somebody who has lived there for 5 minutes. All of his family live in this village, most were born there and my nan has been there for 50 years. It doesn't seem right.

mumcoll

The Authority where I live (Wales) also charges more for people non-resident in the County. Awful if, as in your case, he only moved out of the area to be housed. Not able to live in his own village, then not able to be buried there either.

As for the way your Nan was treated, she can officially complain about the officer who she feels was rude to her. There will be Complaints Policy and her complaint will be investigated. Wrong that she has to be going through all this when she is grieving for her son.

Oldernotwiser

Deep_Ocean wrote: »

It would have been but it’s a bit late now!!!

We were given the single rate fees when we were speaking to the funeral directors. It wasn’t until the funeral had been announced in the paper that my Nan received a letter saying that she would have to pay triple fees. We have the original invoice of around £3,000 and then the second invoice of around £7,000. If we had realised this at the beginning we may have opted for a cremation, but the original invoice states £3,000ish and we would have all chipped in together to get that money. By the time we received the revised figure we had already made all the arrangements and put the notification in the paper.

Unless the burial has already taken place it's not really too late.

AsknAnswer2

I am sorry about your loss, and about what your Nan is going through.

Surcharges for non resident burial plots is something that most local authorities (but not all) do. How much the surcharge is varies from one area to the next. As it is the right of the local authority to set the fees for burial plots, including any surcharges they wish to apply, there is not much you can do in the way of forcing them not to apply them. I don't understand why the CAB have advised an appeal. There is no right of appeal against what a local authority charge.

Do they perhaps mean an appeal against the funeral payment decision from the DWP? If so, yes that does carry a right of appeal however the legislation which applies to this payment is clear in that only the fees which are "necessary" can be paid out of this public fund for burial costs. It is unlikely that a tribunal would consider it necessary for him to be buried in an area where he was no longer resident, if his resident area carried a lower cost. They will view that as that is a choice made, not a nessesity.

The only way around this would be if there were no plots available in the area where he was resident, or where the cost of burial in his resident area would be higher. In those circumstances the payment of another local authority area can be met. Some local authorities place a time limit on residencies. Some will not count a person as "resident" for the purpose of burial fees unless they have lived in the area for a specified period, whereas others will count a person as still resident for the purpose of the fees if they lived outwith the area for a short period (usually two years). The local authority in which your Nan's son was buried states this:

Where evidence is provided that the deceased lived in the District for the majority of their life but took up a place in full-time care outside the District within two years of their death, the premium fee will be waivered.

It appears therefore that these are the only circumstance in which an exemption of the surcharge would apply. If this doesn't apply to your Nan's son, perhaps look into the burial fees of where he was resident to see if those would have been more expensive or less expensive - remember to look for periods of residency. If it would have been more expensive for him to be buried there or if they had no plots available, an appeal may be successful in the DWP meeting the extra surcharges of non residency. You only have one month from the date of the decision on the funeral payment to appeal against it, though if you can show exceptional circumstances apply and the DWP feels the appeal has a reasonable prospect of sucess, you can appeal up until 13 months after the date of the decision.

Another way around it may lie in this:

Deep_Ocean wrote: »

We were given the single rate fees when we were speaking to the funeral directors. It wasn’t until the funeral had been announced in the paper that my Nan received a letter saying that she would have to pay triple fees.

Were the funeral directors aware at the time that the deceased live outwith the area and for how long he had lived outwith the area? Did she have any agreement in writing in regard to the fees at the resident rate? (Not an estimate but a fully broken down contract) Had she signed a contract agreeing to the purchase or for the funeral directors to pay the (unspecified as the non resident sum) fees on her behalf? If so was she by this point unable to cancel the agreement? If so, she may have a claim against the funeral director/local authority depending on whom she held the contract with for the burial costs - but only if she can show that the funeral director/local authority were negligent in applying the correct fees and they had been fully aware that the deceased was a non resident. If she became aware of the fees, had the opportunity to cancel the agreement but chose to go ahead anyway, she won't have a claim against the funeral director or the local authority.

The one other thing that I will stress is that if the local authority/funeral directors have performed in accordance with their side of the bargain, your Nan must pay the fees, even if she intends to attempt to claim them back - if she doesn't the council (or the funeral director if they have paid the council on her behalf) can take her to court for the money and add court costs to that as well, causing even more stress.

zzzLazyDaisy

I am sorry for your loss.

It sounds very unfair, but if those are the rules, then that is what the family will have to pay if you want him to be buried there. As you say, you have consulted various people/organisations and no-one has been able to persuade the council to change their decision.

This means that you have to look at what you can do now.

Have you discussed this with the undertaker? It may not be too late to change to a cremation. Alternatively perhaps they can offer payment by installments?

Regarding the headstone - that doesn't have to be done straight away. It was almost a year before my cousin's headstone was put on the grave (though this was due to the fact that the stone mason ceased trading after taking the money!).

natnhay

We were charged triple fees when my stepfather passed away 7 yrs ago.He purchased a double plot when my mother died several years before him.He wasnt charged triple fees when my mother was buried but she was born in the district, but because my stepfather was not born in the district we were charged triple fees. I would check that it is correct especially if he was born in the district as i understood it was only triple fees if they were born outside of the district.We could have had him cremated,but he wouldnt have purchased a double plot at the time when my mother passed away.Obviously he wish was to be buried with her hence the double plot.I honestly dont think that he would have purchased a double plot at the time if he knew of the costs before hand. Hope everything gets sorted for you.

damos1

I wonder if you may of saddened a lot of readers with your post (this is not your fault)

I personally think everyone should be allowed to be buried as to the families wishes (location, type of funeral and so)

Maybe parliament need to consider this an option for future considersation as if you cannot afford the fees to be within your chosen place of rest you should be allowed to be subsidised, especially with your relative having previously lived within the area.

McKneff

If you got the invoice for £7k before the burial, you really should have changed the arrangements.

You had the invoice in front of you but still went ahead with it knowing the bill had to be paid.

While I sympathise with you, it really wasnt too late at that point to change the arrangements.

Hope things turn out okay for you all.

Tiddlywinks

The council may charge 3 times normal rates (as is their right as landowner - they have not been secretive about those rates; they are readily available as demonstrated above by the poster who found them easily enough) but I still can't see how that can add up to £7,000 odd pounds - the undertaker should not treble his fees though for services such as coffin, cars etc.

How is the invoice made up? It is usual practice for an undertaker to agree fees BEFORE final arrangements are made.

Just because someone is in their 70s does not make them incapable of handling affairs such as this. I know it sounds harsh but if your grandma is/was not in a position to handle such arrangements why did your mother /other relative not go with her from the start?

The services have been used so the invoice is now due - I would suggest going back to the funeral director if he did not make all charges clear.