Home Education and benefits issue....

StrongWork

Bambywamby wrote: »

^ An example of state education?

I'd rather sarcasm than delusion any day of the week.

Bambywamby

I am so pleased...that you gathered I was being sarcastic.

StrongWork

Bambywamby wrote: »

I am so pleased...that you gathered I was being sarcastic.

I needed to check. You may have been home educated.

Lou76

AliBambee wrote: »

Tomorrow, she is bringing the boys and their schoolwork here, and we are going to do some brainstorming based on some of the interesting and helpful ideas that have been posted. Hopefully between us we can come up with a few options for her. I am not sure whether this situation gives her the option of being able to do a part-time training course in something, but we will investigate that too. As far as the boys' schooling is concerned, I will have them one or two days a week, and some retired close friends are going to have the boys a couple of mornings a week for maths and stuff (fishing I believe has been suggested as possible lessons in the Summer!) if they are well enough, so that will help too.

I can't see what the problem is then with her working?

If she has time to do a part-time course, and the boys have you, and others, having them for study time and summer lessions, it sounds as though she's in a much better position to look for work than a "Non-Home Ed" single parent who has to fit work around a strict school timetable.

It sounds as though she, and the boys, have a great network of people to help them out.

GlasweJen wrote: »

The problem is that the OPs daughter can't afford it and wants benefits to subsidise her choice to stay at home with her kids. If the OP simply asked on the families board for advice on home schooling she would have got loads of advice but as she's posted on the benefits board asking for money to fund a lifestyle choice then she can hardly complain about the thread getting tough. It's not as if the children cannot be educated elsewhere.

As above. They seem to be using Home Ed as an excuse not to work, when it is actually less restrictive than most single parents' availabilty to work.

As for Home education itself, I have no comment, but that wasn't the point of the thread.

starchild1972

Oh Strongwork you are rather naiive about home education aren't you?
I suppose all teachers are brilliant and know everything? Like the teacher who told my daughter (then 5) that it was impossible for my husband to have been in the army in South Africa because he was WHITE! This was no just out of uni teacher either but someone of advancing years and experience, I guess apartheid must have just passed her by I mean white people in Africa, whatever next! I won't even comment about what I thought about her calling my daughter dirty because we were living in a caravan "Don't sit by ***** because she lives like a dirty gypsy" She even told one of the other parents that my daughter could pass on disease. (We had to leave an area in another part of the country due to neighbour problems and DH getting a job elsewhere. 2 years in a caravan was brilliant)
I was just so glad I took her out (we had home educated before when we lived elsewhere when it became obvious that she was not safe at school as certain people's children also attended. We had full backing of police for that but sod all from LA) Ever had a 6 yr old come home and tell you that if she went back to school she would run away?
Or have that same daughter stop eating at school due to bullying? We were told that she was eating well at school. It was only when we took her to the GP weighing 1.5 stone that she told us what had been going on. We thought she had a serious metabolic problem. What had been happening was systematic bullying at her school. Including comments such as "if you eat that you will get as fat as your mother" (for the record I was not overweight, I was 8 months PREGNANT), "put your hand down **** no-one likes a clever clogs". We complained but they closed ranks and told us it was "horse-play".

She was outta there!

Never had a problem with her since. She was a bit apprehensive when she went to the small school (we are fighting for free school status) but settled well. That was after not being at school since the age of 6. Considering there was no home ed group in our area and no clubs for her age group she seems to have a large circle of friends and better social life than me.

My 3 others the same, well youngest is slightly different due to aspergers but they will all go to the same school at 11 with no state primary education.


What is difficult though is the allowing of someone else to educate your child when at work if you are home educating. IF that person has more than 5 children then legally they are a school and should register as such. You are putting the child in a situation where there is no obligation for CRB checks and yes unfortunately on the rare occasion there is abuse that happens in the HE community.

There is no state support for home education as it is seen in the same light as private education. It is a choice therefore it is your obligation to finance it.
Just one thing though, a single parent may come up against opposition from an absent parent who has parental responsibility and it could go as far as court, which has happened in the past.

As for University entry, many universities will take home educated children and class them under the "non traditional entry route". Yes even Oxbridge will take "non-trads." There are foundation degrees and preliminary courses run by many universities (including Russell Group) for many paths including medicine and dentistry.

University of Nottingham will take non-trad route students

The Preliminary Year in Veterinary Medicine and Science aims to attract students with diverse life experience and educational pathways

http://www.russellgroup.ac.uk/uploads/Special-entry-routes-Russell-Group_2.pdf

Many universities see potential in a prospective student at an interview that no A-level or GCSE qualification will show.

As for my eldest, she is off to Norway in 5 yrs to do Classical Studies and comparable Scandinavian History with option module in 20th centuary Norwegian History. All taught in Norwegian and no Uni fees.

Please excuse any typos, I am using dragon as I have swollen hands this morning and cannot type.

Oldernotwiser

starchild1972 wrote: »

As for University entry, many universities will take home educated children and class them under the "non traditional entry route". Yes even Oxbridge will take "non-trads." There are foundation degrees and preliminary courses run by many universities (including Russell Group) for many paths including medicine and dentistry.

University of Nottingham will take non-trad route students
http://www.russellgroup.ac.uk/uploads/Special-entry-routes-Russell-Group_2.pdf
.

Unfortunately, this isn't totally accurate. As an example, Nottingham's Veterinary Science with a Preliminary year has entry requirements of


"Required subjects: any subjects at A2 and AS level (to include, at most, only one of biology and chemistry and excluding general studies and critical thinking); biology and chemistry cannot both be taken at AS level; minimum five grade As at GCSE, minimum of grade B in chemistry (or double science), maths and English language"

with expected grades of AAB at A2. The alternative qualifications accepted include things like BTEC and Access courses. This is pretty much the same with most universities.

I'm glad that your experience of HE was successful but you really shouldn't advise people that it's easily possible to get into good universities without any formal qualifications, because this just isn't the case.

StrongWork

starchild1972 wrote: »

Oh Strongwork you are rather naiive about home education aren't you?
I suppose all teachers are brilliant and know everything? Like the teacher who told my daughter (then 5) that it was impossible for my husband to have been in the army in South Africa because he was WHITE! This was no just out of uni teacher either but someone of advancing years and experience, I guess apartheid must have just passed her by I mean white people in Africa, whatever next!

Quality anecdotal evidence there.

Tbh, I'm happy with my children going to school where their teachers actually have background in the subject they are teaching (rare but it happens) and are able to ask questions above the standard of the class and get answers as opposed to a random middle aged woman who has read an EdExcel revision guide and thinks she knows best.

It's also nice they have the facilities to play a wide range of sports frequently, musical instruments and the chance to do scientific experiments.

starchild1972 wrote: »

I won't even comment about what I thought about her calling my daughter dirty because we were living in a caravan "Don't sit by ***** because she lives like a dirty gypsy" She even told one of the other parents that my daughter could pass on disease. (We had to leave an area in another part of the country due to neighbour problems and DH getting a job elsewhere. 2 years in a caravan was brilliant)

I don't even need to comment on that.

It sounds like you've got a blinkered view on state education judging by your bad experiences. I can't change that, and I don't intend to.

I am however of the opinion that education delivered by individuals trained and passionate about a subject, backed up by good facilities is a superior method of education than a randomer with a couple of revision guides.

Regarding the 'catch up courses' (clue is in the name as per your link) at university prior to the degree course proper - they will be expecting formal qualifications.

An acceptable academic standard must be demonstrated, whether that be through UK standard GCSEs, A Levels and the like or Euro Bac/equivalent. People don't get into medicine because 'mum taught me this and that while sitting round the campfire braiding my hair'.

starchild1972

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

I'm glad that your experience of HE was successful but you really shouldn't advise people that it's easily possible to get into good universities without any formal qualifications, because this just isn't the case.

Actually I know PERSONALLY of someone on that course who has neither A-levels or GCSE's. He worked from the age of 16 to 18 as an assistant in a quarantine kennels. This experience, including personal study got him an unconditional entry. He did all the work required for teh GCSE and A-levels but, as it the main problem, could not find an exam centre that would accept an external candidate. He could not physically sit the exams. Going to college would have left him unable to work at the kennels and therefore losing out on the vital experience.

As I say there are special dispensations for "non traditional" educational routes and 99% of the time a home educated child will have an interview. It is always best to contact the universities before submitting to UCAS, they are more flexible and those "minimum" requirements are NOT set in stone.

He does not have a piece of paper to his name, unless you include the food hygiene certificate he got when he got a job working part time in the university student union.

They will accept OU credits, those are courses that can be done from the age of 14 in some cases. (subject to OU interview)
They will accept evidence of prior experience, evidence of non-traditional learning.
It's not rocket science to phone up the admissions office and ask.

EG, pharmacy at Nottingham

Alternative qualifications: please contact the School's Admissions Office to discuss

Try reading this.
http://www.home-education.org.uk/articles/article-open-university.pdf

the best quote...

The point is that there are many paths to university open to home educators.

Jowo_2

GlasweJen wrote: »

The problem is that the OPs daughter can't afford it and wants benefits to subsidise her choice to stay at home with her kids. If the OP simply asked on the families board for advice on home schooling she would have got loads of advice but as she's posted on the benefits board asking for money to fund a lifestyle choice then she can hardly complain about the thread getting tough. It's not as if the children cannot be educated elsewhere.

Yes, it's a shame that this thread has descended into a policy discussion on the merits and de-merits of home education versus state education. Discussion time is the place for it.

I wish a moderator would close the thread as the specific benefit entitlement question was answered long ago and other posters have suggested various options to help the OPs daughter get an income to fit around home educating her children.

To reiterate the response to the OPs main query, a single parent whose youngest child turns 7 cannot remain on income support if they home school their children. Like every other lone parent in the land, they will be moved onto JSA and expected to find employment.

My personal feelings are that it is extraordinary that someone who shuns existing infrastructure provision expects the public purse to subsidise them for a further decade or so. Where is the social contract? The reciprocity inherent in the welfare state where a person is supported temporarily in their time of need and doesn't depend on its provision because of personal preferences?

I'm not saying it's the OPs fault that she is a lone parent, unable to afford to home educate her children, but its not the taxpayers problem to help those opt out of some aspects of state support that they do not desire (state schools) while wanting to remain within other aspects of state provision (the benefit system).

Mod, lock this bleedin' thread!

StrongWork

Jowo wrote: »

Yes, it's a shame that this thread has descended into a policy discussion on the merits and de-merits of home education versus state education. Discussion time is the place for it.

^This

Jowo wrote: »

My personal feelings are that it is extraordinary that someone who shuns existing infrastructure provision expects the public purse to subsidise them for a further decade or so. Where is the social contract? The reciprocity inherent in the welfare state where a person is supported temporarily in their time of need and doesn't depend on its provision because of personal preferences?

^This

Jowo wrote: »

Mod, lock this bleedin' thread!

^This.