Vermin in property

garethevans1986

Hi all

Sorry for the long post!

To cut a long story short, we live in a rented house, the landlord is pretty good, any problems we've had he's been round the following day or got it sorted within a few days - the best landlord I've rented with in a good 6 to 7 years.

Our house very different to others I've rented, it used to be a multiple occupancy house so 3 of the rooms have en-suits in (toilet + shower cubicle, sink is in the main room usually). One room that we don't use on a daily basis is used for storing things - this room also has an en-suite that I would class as "unfinished".

Now then, I'm an angler and since the summer my fishing equipment has been stored in this bathroom. In September the electrician came round and got the sockets and light working in our "store room" and had to go into the bathroom, I can only guess that it was to check the wiring to the shower in there. Anyway I closed the door and that was it.

Now the fishing gear was stored with nothing that could go off and any "food stuffs" was either in plastic sealed tubs, plastic sealed bags or sealed tins.

The past 4 to 6 weeks we'd been hearing russtling upstairs while we have been downstairs and put it down to the cats either running around or fighting with each other and ignored it. One day while the wife and I were eating our tea we hard something run/shuffle across the ceiling - this was definitely not one of the cats!

We spoke to the landlord and he was round by 0900 the following day. He suspected mice and said to give the council a ring, they'd come out, sort the problem and any costs involved he would pay. Fair enough. So we gave them a ring.

Bearing in mind we have 1 cat and a 4 to 5 month old kitten we haven't seen any evidence of mice in the house other than the noise beneath the floorboards.

So a fella from the council came round, we told them what we know and he diagnosed "field mice driven in by the cold", popped some poison behind the sink in the spare bedroom and said they'll be back next week.

The following Sunday we heard noises in the attic - above our bedroom. So we told the council fella when he came back on the Tuesday and he put some poison in the attic - right by the hatch (bedroom is the other side of the attic).

The noise stopped and we thought everything was now over and forgot about our "lodgers"...

Friday last week I thought about going fishing on the weekend so cancelled my plans on Friday night and went to get my fishing gear out of the bathroom where it was stored so I moved the boxes that were against the door and opened the door.

I noticed a lot of large black "bits" on the floor, a pair of waterproof trousers had been chewed by something and a dead rat on top of one of the bags I had in the room - lovely. the black bits turned out to be rat poo....and plenty of it too! The whole room absolutely stunk.

The wife and I decided to ring a company near by who after telling us they would be with us in 2 hours were around in 45 minutes. The fella came into the house, we showed him what we had found. He pointed out there was another dead rat underneath the shower cubicle - so that's 2 dead rats now and explained how they live and so on.

He had a good look around the outside of the house to try and find where he thought they were getting in, we found a suspect hole and he recommended that we filled it in asap.

He then helped us clear the room the rats had been in and we found another 2 dead rats amongst the fishing equipment - that's now 4 dead rats in total.

He collected the dead rats in a bag and took them away to be disposed of. He pointed out where the rats had been getting into the room/property by and also how they had been getting into other parts of the property by.

Saturday I had to go through the fishing equipment we hadn't already chucked into bin bags and sort out anything that could be cleaned/salvaged and anything that couldn't - most of it couldn't as it was in such a state and/or smelt that bad I didnt even want to risk it with the dangers of Weils disease.

I had to take a good trailer full of equipment to the tip - probably about 1/3 of the equipment I own. A very depressing day for me.

I emailed the landlord on Sunday night and I had a reply by 0800 on Monday morning (this morning) both he and his electrician came round today to check all the electrics in the house.

Today I also phoned the insurance people (we have contents insurance) but sadly they said they won't payout due to "..damage by vermin or pets" exception.

I've been told that the landlord "is at fault" and should claim on their insurance for the damaged gear but more than likely they will have buildings insurance and not contents insurance, and even if they did have contents insurance they would come up against the same brick wall that I have today.

I've taken plenty of images both after we moved everything out of the room and the equipment as we've sorted through it. As I was sorting through and chucking out I started making a list of everything that I was chucking out.

For any angler or somebody who understands what this equipment is, I had to chuck out my seatbox, carryall + contents, another large box with bags of groundbait and pellets in and another 2 bags with spare waterproofs in and another bag with other miscellaneous bits in too (carp rigs, spare and old Octoplus legs).

Thankfully my poles/rods are undamaged but still need a clean first.

There's also another two hold all (large rod bags) which I'm going to have to chuck because of contamination.

So where do I stand and where do I go from here?

Gareth

CloudCuckooLand

garethevans1986 wrote: »

To cut a long story short,

but you haven't...

A short summary will get more responses.

garethevans1986

Fair enough, hows this.

Rented house, heard noises, thought it was mice, they were actually rats. Found 4 dead, they crapped all over my fishing gear, had to chuck most of it out. Insurance won't pay out, been told landlord should claim on their insurance but landlord is pretty decent but I don't want to rock the boat.

Where do I stand and go from here?

Gareth

theartfullodger

http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/neighbourhood_issues/environmental_issues#17

Vermin - rats and mice

Rats cause damage and can spread disease. If they are in or near your home, you need to take steps against them. Mice are usually harmless outdoors, but in the home can cause damage and spread disease. Put food away in sealed containers or on high shelves. If the problem gets bad, take steps against them.
If you are the homeowner, you can use shop-bought traps or poison, or use a pest control company. If you rent your home, report the problem to the landlord, who should deal with it. If there are rats on neighbouring land, it is your neighbours' responsibility to deal with them. If your landlord or neighbour refuses to do anything, report the situation to the council's environmental health department.

garethevans1986

We were charged for the company who came out on Friday and the Landlord has said he will pay for that.

The problem was reported to the landlord when we first found out about the "mice", the council pest control department were called, they were very unprofessional in their working methods according to the pest control company. It does sound like a "we're a pro. company and better than the council etc etc" but the council:

a) put poison down which could result in us having a dead animal between wall cavities or under floorboards and then a really bad smell for us for 2 weeks, traps are better but mean they have to be check on a daily basis.
b) to diagnose mice without seeing any evidence at all (a lot of poo apparently is the give away)
c) to put poison in places that can't be checked.

All rubbish outside is in the bins provided by the council. There's no food left around the house. Like I said there was no evidence of rats in other parts of the house - the pest control fella had a thorough check, if he had seen any evidence he would of told us but he didn't find anything.

Gareth

G_M

Now the fishing gear was stored with nothing that could go off and any "food stuffs" was either in plastic sealed tubs, plastic sealed bags or sealed tins.

Forgive me being cynical, but... well, rats only come in if there's a reason. Food. Have any of the tubs, bags, tins been chewed through? Might the fishing gear have remnants of food on them? These rats are finding food somewhere, and whilst fishing is a fine occupation, and I'm sure you store your stuff well, I'd bet the reason for the presence of the rats is.... fishing. ie, you.

Hardly the landlord's fault.

I may, of course, be completely wrong, and if so, I apologise.

CloudCuckooLand

I wonder if the smell got them to the room, then their sharp teeth did the rest..?

Tricky. Landlord should have fabric of house in good repair. Tenant should not having something "smelly" (which anglers may not realise themselves, being so used to it) around the place - should it have been in shed/garage ?

Incyder

I've dealt with a few rats over the years. Rats hunt alone and will travel up to 500m from where they live at night searching for food. The fact you have 4 dead ones is good for 2 reasons.

1) the poison worked
2) they didnt die under the floor boards where they then rot and stink the house out.

There may have only been 4 and they are ALL dead but probably not.
If there is still a way in, more will follow.

Place bits of kit-kat (chocolate) about 1 inch long in the room where u found the dead ones, and attic. Shut the door so your cats dont eat it. If all the bits remain untouched for up to 2 weeks it looks like you have got them all.

If the choc vanishes then get to Wilko's and buy a good snap rat trap, not the old fashined wood ones, but the new style black plastic ones made by rentokil. They are deadly, yet easy to set, and cheap. If your wilko's have them then they will be £3 ish, homebase probably £5.
They have a little attached cup about the size of a thimble to put bait into, fill this cup with peanut butter or choc spread. Yum.

Shut the doors so cats cant get in to the room.

2am and BANG, you've got one. Pull on a pair of petrol pump plastic gloves. The trap has an easy release bar at the back, just pull this back and let dead rat drop into a carrier bag. Tie this up and dump in wheelie bin, wash hands. Reset trap with fresh bait, wash hands. Repeat......and repeat.....

Try never to touch the trap without gloves even when new as you dont want to leave human scent on it, rats hate humans.

As you see in the photo, the trap has 2 little holes in the plastic at the rear, one on each side. Screw the trap down to a plank of wood via these holes. This stops the trap leaping into the air when it goes off, the spring is very powerful.

garethevans1986

G_M wrote: »

Forgive me being cynical, but... well, rats only come in if there's a reason. Food. Have any of the tubs, bags, tins been chewed through? Might the fishing gear have remnants of food on them? These rats are finding food somewhere, and whilst fishing is a fine occupation, and I'm sure you store your stuff well, I'd bet the reason for the presence of the rats is.... fishing. ie, you.

Hardly the landlord's fault.

I may, of course, be completely wrong, and if so, I apologise.

All "food stuffs" were in sealed plastic tubs, plastic bags or metal tins. Yes anything they fancied they got into EXCEPT the tinned stuff. There was even a plastic bait tub which was clean and empty that they had chewed through - they was about 2/3 of it left!

The Pest removal fella said that the rats came into the house seeking warmth.

In our last house all my fishing equipment was kept "under" the house and we only ever had problems with spiders and damp - no rats or mice.

CloudCuckooLand wrote: »

I wonder if the smell got them to the room, then their sharp teeth did the rest..?

Tricky. Landlord should have fabric of house in good repair. Tenant should not having something "smelly" (which anglers may not realise themselves, being so used to it) around the place - should it have been in shed/garage ?

There is a hole that the rats were using to get into the house. The fishing equipment hadn't been used in 6 months and trust me, if something did smell the wife would of said so!

theartfullodger wrote: »

In cases like these I think it important that you can prove what was said to who & when. So, always put everything in writing, if necessary after a 'phone call, confirming what was said. And ask for responses in writing.

What for...?? It's not a "he said, I said" situation.

Incyder wrote: »

Snipped.

Thank you very much Incyder.

chris_m

garethevans1986 wrote: »

All "food stuffs" were in sealed plastic tubs, plastic bags or metal tins. Yes anything they fancied they got into EXCEPT the tinned stuff. There was even a plastic bait tub which was clean and empty that they had chewed through - they was about 2/3 of it left!

If they are hungry, the little s*ds will eat almost anything - plastic included, especially if they've tried one tub and found even nicer stuff inside.

I used to work at a heritage railway and we kept a bar of soap on top of an internal half-wall and a bucket of water below next to our coal stove so we could have a quick cleanup if we wanted. Suddenly our bars of soap started going walkies and we blamed other people until we realised that we were the last out in the evenings and first in come the following mornings. Eventually we found part of a bar of soap, complete with tooth marks and the mystery was solved, Rattus Rattus was having midnight feasts of our soap.

James_N

chris_m wrote: »

If they are hungry, the little s*ds will eat almost anything - plastic included, especially if they've tried one tub and found even nicer stuff inside.

SNIP

Eventually we found part of a bar of soap, complete with tooth marks and the mystery was solved, Rattus Rattus was having midnight feasts of our soap.

It could equally have been Rattus norvegicus