Heallth product samples for "silver shoppers"

Robert5988

I suggest there is little point in publishing scientific data from any University as the majority of us are unable to interpret the results. It is meaningless to quote a 99.5% accuracy for a testing procedure, when we do not know the significance of the tests.

Similarly publishing “hundreds of testimonials” has been standard procedure for those who, in the past, have peddled rubbish to gullible folk. The Australian conman(can’t think of his name) involved in buying flats for Cherie Blair used these tactics on a number of schemes.

I reiterate I am not in any way doubting the integrity of your company.

If your products really work in “relieving arthritis and other pain and muscle tension conditions” they will sell almost regardless of price.

However unless you can get some respected organisation such as the NHS to run trials and unequivocally state(in layman’s terms) their effectiveness, the public have every right to remain suspicious.

Have you thought of getting the Consumer’s Association to run tests to publish in ‘Which’.

daveoneil

Hi Robert

Thanks again for your comments. The data we will publish is of the scientific tests, but has been "translated" for want of a better word into plain English. It is presented so that the scientific data, for those of that mindset, is on the same page as the layman's explanation. While you might feel at the moment there is no point to it I would suggest that when it is up on the site you should evaluate it then and see if it is worthwhile. The only slight downside to it is that I did not personally produce it so it has been translated from Japanese by native Japanese speakers, therefore the English is at times somewhat ropey! However, it is clear and concise which is what matters.

I also have to say that it is somewhat insulting to be mentioned in the same paragraph as "conmen", "peddling rubbish" and "gullible folk", both to me and my customers. I publish these testimonials because people who have tried my products and believe in them have offered them to me. Whilst I accept that you do not directly state that we are seeking to do any of these things, I would strongly distance myself from any of these reasons for quoting people. I have had no negative feedback to date, and whilst some will undoubtedly arise (everyone after all lives in a different body) these comments at the moment represent a cross section of what I have been told.

I am also aware that they will sell almost regardles of price as you say, but I do not want to do this. I want a company that pioneers affordable, reliable products to people who need them. I have many elderly relatives and would be justifiably aghast if I felt they were being ripped off or made to feel "gullible". Perhaps the fact that I totally believe in these produucts, having seen all of the evidence, clouds my vision slightly in exchanges such as this but I am so keen for people to try it. I want to put something into the health community that will help cut down the reliance on drugs and the output of massive pharmeceutical companies. They can afford to pump money at NHS research projects which is the one and only reason why their products are so ubiquitous in medicine - the so called "medical model". My experiences of palliative care in hospices both at a personal and professional level has convinced me of the need for natural alternatives and every time someone reports that they feel better it is a very good feeling.

Finally, I am absolutely aware that the public have every right to remain suspicious - all I would ask is that until they are either convinced by the scientific data that I publish on the site or by any that may arise in the future, they remain open minded enough to request a sample when the opportunity arises and give it a try for themselves. I have offered samples to appropriate publications and agencies but it is incredibly diffficult to receive any kind of feedback from them - the vast majority look for quantities which I cannot yet deliver as we are a new start company, or they look for us to do advertising, which again I don't want or need to do. Maybe I will suggest to Phiten, who produce the goods, that they should look into avenues such as this. I think this is what they were aiming for with the trials in Japan that I'll publish, but you have made it somewhat obvious that this may not cut much ice here. Thanks again for your continued feedback though, healthy debate is all part of the fun

daveoneil

Hi Again

Sorry, as many of you will have noticed I am new to the boards, despite having used MSE before. Therefore, I did not see the following in the "small print":

Posting links for personal gain is strictly prohibited, except in the 'referrers' section.

I suppose, even though it is free samples we are giving away (hundreds of them, believe me!) this could be construed as being for personal gain (I wish). Therefore I am just apologising to everyone and won't be posting the offer again. However, if anyone has any ideas of how we can let people, especially older adults, know that they can try us out for free, either on MSE or elsewhere, without bending any rules, that'd be great. The free sample thing doesn't really seem to fit in the referrers section...

brm_2

Ted_Hutchinson wrote:

I don't think you have visited the link provided by the original poster. The products being sold are not meant to be consumed but worn.

There is scientific research showing those wearing bracelets containing strong magnets believe they experience less pain than when wearing identical but non magnetic or less powerful magnetic bracelets. See "Randomised controlled trial of magnetic bracelets for relieving pain in osteoarthritis of the hip and knee."

If you search Pubmed using "Arthritis" and "Green Lipped mussel" as the search terms, you will also find papers confirming oils of marine origin (e.g. from the green-lipped mussel) and a range of vegetable oils (e.g. olive oil and evening primrose oil) have indirect anti-inflammatory actions.

However the same cannot be said for research material concerning the wearing clothing items containing titanium. In order to justify the very high prices it would be reassuring for links to be provided to independent research confirming the effect of such materials.

Thanks
I do not look at web sites unless I am sure they are "kosha"
Regards

Ted_Hutchinson

brm wrote:

Thanks
I do not look at web sites unless I am sure they are "kosha"
Regards

Pubmed is the website for the
National Center for Biotechnology Information
National Library of Medicine
Building 38A
Bethesda, MD 20894

What does NCBI do?

Established in 1988 as a national resource for molecular biology information, NCBI creates public databases, conducts research in computational biology, develops software tools for analyzing genome data, and disseminates biomedical information - all for the better understanding of molecular processes affecting human health and disease.

While no one can blame you for not understanding the nature of the Pubmed I do assure you this website is one of the most respected databases of medical research and information.

brm_2

Ted_Hutchinson wrote:

Pubmed is the website for the
National Center for Biotechnology Information
National Library of Medicine
Building 38A
Bethesda, MD 20894

What does NCBI do?

Established in 1988 as a national resource for molecular biology information, NCBI creates public databases, conducts research in computational biology, develops software tools for analyzing genome data, and disseminates biomedical information - all for the better understanding of molecular processes affecting human health and disease.

While no one can blame you for not understanding the nature of the Pubmed I do assure you this website is one of the most respected databases of medical research and information.

Sounds like it's US to me.

Ted_Hutchinson

brm wrote:

Sounds like it's US to me.

But it is a GLOBAL database so that all published peer reviewed research listed is included where relevant, together with abstracts.

Perhaps you could suggest a better database for searching for published peer reviewed medical research papers.

Because Google is US based doesn't prevent it being used effectively anywhere in the world.

brm_2

Ted_Hutchinson wrote:

But it is a GLOBAL database so that all published peer reviewed research listed is included where relevant, together with abstracts.

Are you sure that all research papers are published on this site, or only those that they want 'included'.?

I did not read the original post web 'site' as explained, but you have, and you explained that that the products being proffered are for external use.

In my experience, external "prescribed" orthotics do not work for many adults unless you reduce their ADL.

Commercially available "this will aid your problem" orthotics are to viewed by each potential purchaser as a "can I afford to give this a try"
Each person makes their choice.

Other external worn items, can be considered jewelry or apparel.

Children are much different. They seem to able to grow up, cope and adapt to external orthotics of a "prescibed form".

If we are talking about external orthotics, or 'Gismo's, lets talk, but if we are talking about relieving arthritis and other forms of this problem, I refer to my answers in 2 and 6 of this thread.
Regards

brm_2

If your products perform as claimed, get the NHS to endorse them.[/QUOTE]

The NHS as an entity, do not endorse or approve any medicine or device.

daveoneil

brm wrote:

Ted_Hutchinson wrote:

But it is a GLOBAL database so that all published peer reviewed research listed is included where relevant, together with abstracts.

Are you sure that all research papers are published on this site, or only those that they want 'included'.?

I did not read the original post web 'site' as explained, but you have, and you explained that that the products being proffered are for external use.

In my experience, external "prescribed" orthotics do not work for many adults unless you reduce their ADL.

Commercially available "this will aid your problem" orthotics are to viewed by each potential purchaser as a "can I afford to give this a try"
Each person makes their choice.

Other external worn items, can be considered jewelry or apparel.

Children are much different. They seem to able to grow up, cope and adapt to external orthotics of a "prescibed form".

If we are talking about external orthotics, or 'Gismo's, lets talk, but if we are talking about relieving arthritis and other forms of this problem, I refer to my answers in 2 and 6 of this thread.
Regards

Hi

The company that produces the goods, Phiten, produce a range of orthotics (which they call supporters) for professional (i.e. sportsperson) use and also for everyday wear. They also produce items considered apparel. As you rightly say it is for each individual to decide if they can afford to give the a try, but we want to let people try the principle of it anyway with the free sample of tapes, which are made in the same way as the material for the supporters.

Interesting that the NHS offer no trials or endorsements etc as suggested by one other poster, but yet the system is flooded with the output of massive pharmaceutical conglomerates. Perhaps if we were more willing to embrace alternative health technologies, as the Japanese are, we'd live as long as they do and have far less of an iatrogenic disaster on our hands with multitudes of presription medication. Don't get me wrong: pills work, it's just that I've worked with some of the consequences of that.

As for Pubmed, it is actually pretty good at publishing a breadth of stuff although it can have a US slant at times. One of my professors at university had real difficulty having some of his abstracts and eventual papers published which led to problems with his US colleague's funding.