Heallth product samples for "silver shoppers"

daveoneil

Hi

My website (https://www.metacog.co.uk) offers free samples of products which relieve arthritis and other pain and muscle tension conditions. The products are new from Japan and I know people on this site are interested in ways of saving money - it all features titanium but at up to 1/5 of the price of a regular titanium pain relief product. Please contact us via the site for samples on enquiries. Thanks for reading

brm_2

daveoneil wrote:

Hi

My website (https://www.metacog.co.uk) offers free samples of products which relieve arthritis and other pain and muscle tension conditions. The products are new from Japan and I know people on this site are interested in ways of saving money - it all features titanium but at up to 1/5 of the price of a regular titanium pain relief product. Please contact us via the site for samples on enquiries. Thanks for reading

Great idea, will the free samples be ongoing indefinately or will we be asked to pay for a full course eventually!" Just asking.
In my experience New Zealand Green Lipped Mussels are the preferred. acknowledged, vit to take. with a little "kosha" cod liver oil.

daveoneil

Hi

As we are a new start company we have to watch finances and we are in the business of retailing these items. Therefore after 1, or at most 2 (different types of) samples we'd have to ask you to pay for the products. However, we have priced everything as keenly as possible and as I said they are all up to 80% cheaper then traditional titanium products, but give the same effect because of the way they are made. They've been sold in Japan for 20 years and 1 in 10 Japanese people use them, so we're happy to give out (albeit limited) free samples to let people see "what the fuss is about".

Thanks for your interest

brm_2

Thanks for your reply.
I do understand you policy.

Ted_Hutchinson

daveoneil wrote:

They've been sold in Japan for 20 years and 1 in 10 Japanese people use them

With this amount of use and experience you should therefore be in a position to point to some peer reviewed scientific papers which compare the effectivness of your products as compared with the placebo effect.

You will find Scientific papers published here Pubmed perhaps I have not entered the appropriate search terms.

As this is a moneysaving website it would be foolish to consider spending the exorbitant prices charged on your website without one shred of evidence from independent researchers that supports your claims.

brm_2

brm wrote:

In my experience New Zealand Green Lipped Mussels are the preferred. acknowledged, vit to take. with a little "kosha" cod liver oil.

I am reliably informed these are the best forms of vits for body joint problems.

I worked for many years as the Buyer for a well known Pharmaceutical company.
I purchased 'BP' materials from very respected and reputable suppliers from around the world. These were always tested on delivery, on site, as QA and MA requirements, before being used in 'BP' generic medicines.
Some materials which did not fall inside the 'BP' requirement but were a product for our customers were purchased also from other parts of the world but were specified by our customer to be 'kosha'. ie no added vits or mins
The main products being raw Cod liver oil and New Zealand Green lip mussel extract had to be UK government lab tested before packaging for re-sale into the UK.
I do feel you need to review your claims as already mentioned on the last post before you start to sell your product.
I assume your products do not have a PL licence but are being sold as a health product with no claims.

Ted_Hutchinson

brm wrote:

I am reliably informed these are the best forms of vits for body joint problems.............

I don't think you have visited the link provided by the original poster. The products being sold are not meant to be consumed but worn.

There is scientific research showing those wearing bracelets containing strong magnets believe they experience less pain than when wearing identical but non magnetic or less powerful magnetic bracelets. See "Randomised controlled trial of magnetic bracelets for relieving pain in osteoarthritis of the hip and knee."

If you search Pubmed using "Arthritis" and "Green Lipped mussel" as the search terms, you will also find papers confirming oils of marine origin (e.g. from the green-lipped mussel) and a range of vegetable oils (e.g. olive oil and evening primrose oil) have indirect anti-inflammatory actions.

However the same cannot be said for research material concerning the wearing clothing items containing titanium. In order to justify the very high prices it would be reassuring for links to be provided to independent research confirming the effect of such materials.

daveoneil

Ted_Hutchinson wrote:

With this amount of use and experience you should therefore be in a position to point to some peer reviewed scientific papers which compare the effectivness of your products as compared with the placebo effect.

You will find Scientific papers published here Pubmed perhaps I have not entered the appropriate search terms.

As this is a moneysaving website it would be foolish to consider spending the exorbitant prices charged on your website without one shred of evidence from independent researchers that supports your claims.

Thank you for your comments. I would counter your points with the following: 1. I run a new company, having started after leaving university. This is the first time Phiten has been in Scotland. Therfore, all the information you need may not be immediately available on our website 2. I am perfectly aware of the availability of scientific papers on Pubmed having studied for and gained a B.Sc honours degree at 1st class level. 3. I think the confrontational tone of your message is unfair, as saying the prices are exorbitant fails to take into account that i) we offer free samples to anyone who wants to try them, ii) many of our health products such as supporters, shampoos etc are priced at a level commonly found in Boots the chemists, major salons etc. and iii) our products are often 80% cheaper than pure titanium bracelets. 4. I notice that you have not requested a sample. The phrase "don't knock it until you have tried it" is what we base our marketing strategy on as we want to help people. 5. I have a booklet of studies (happy to provide one) on the increase in flexibility, visual acuity, blood flow, thermographic readings and lowering of muscle lactate concentration of titanium tapes, carried out using double blind methods and peer reviewed. This was carried out by the Kaname Machi hospital in Tokyo, an internationally recognised centre of excellence in sports medicine. Their blood analysis technique of LBA (Live Blood Cell Analysis) is 99.5% accurate at measuring blood chemical content ex-vitro. 6. I have literally hundreds of testimonials from satisfied customers, many of whom I demonstrated on without telling them what to expect. These were provided without my asking them to do so. 7. You do not note in your praise of magnetic therapy the huge body of work cited on Pubmed which illustrates how rapidly the effect can wane. This is not the case with Phiten products.

I would have been happy to provide any/all of this information in response to a courteous e-mail, instead of a somewhat inflamatory post on a site where I was simply hoping to help people. No doubt you will question my motives, but some young people are interested in making people feel good, however unlikely you may perceive it to be. I would also reiterate to anyone with an open mind that I am still happy to provide free samples via https://www.metacog.co.uk. Thank you for your feedback, I hope I have answered your queries.

Robert5988

Whether you consider Ted_Hutchinson’s post confrontational is not the point. You have posted what amounts to an advert on a forum so why should he sent an email to you. It is far better that he voices his concerns for all who visit this website to see – together with your reply.

You have entered a field where conmen have run riot for many years. Whilst I have no reason to doubt your integrity I, and probably many others, share his scepticism about the claims for these type of products.

Quite frankly quotes like this below reinforce my scepticism:

daveoneil wrote:

5. I have a booklet of studies (happy to provide one) on the increase in flexibility, visual acuity, blood flow, thermographic readings and lowering of muscle lactate concentration of titanium tapes, carried out using double blind methods and peer reviewed. This was carried out by the Kaname Machi hospital in Tokyo, an internationally recognised centre of excellence in sports medicine. Their blood analysis technique of LBA (Live Blood Cell Analysis) is 99.5% accurate at measuring blood chemical content ex-vitro.

If your products perform as claimed, get the NHS to endorse them.

daveoneil

Robert5988 wrote:

Whether you consider Ted_Hutchinson’s post confrontational is not the point. You have posted what amounts to an advert on a forum...

Hi, thanks for your comments. Firstly, the reason for posting on this forum was not primarily as an advert - I very much admire what MoneySavingExpert has achieved and have used it myself many times to achieve savings on everything from credit cards to free samples. The demographic of our customers to date has been primarily in the age group 50+, hence I thought this group, which is hard to reach at times, would benefit from a post on a site to advise them that we may be able to help if they have chronic pain.

Perhaps saying it was a confrontational post from Ted was a misjudged comment. The reason for it was simply that it is very soul destroying, having spent a large amount of time and energy checking prices of similiar products in high street stores, to have your products branded as "exorbitant". I would have preferred if this particular comment was sent by e-mail purely because I feel it is for people to make up their own minds, having tried our products, if they offer value for money, and not have an immediate prejudice activated in their minds. Having said that, Mr Hutchinson is perfectly entitled to his view and it is all part of the process in a public forum.

The poster brm was in my view very helpful, providing constructive criticism. In response to this we will shortly publish the scientific data we hold from Kaname Machi hospital on the "Data Centre" on our website. This will then allow anyone with an interest to view the results of scientific studies into our products. As also mentioned by Ted, anyone who wishes to compare their efficacy with that of magnets can do so via Pubmed. Again, we are a new company so these things do take time, which is why a query to ask if these studies were available, rather than assume they were not, might have been a more constructive use of a post.

Finally, I know many people will be skeptical about the products. I myself was extremely skeptical when I discovered them in Tokyo, and was only convinced because they helped me despite the fact the shop staff did not speak English - there was no way they could tell me what to expect. I know many people will also feel this way and this is why we offer free samples to let people have a proper chance to evaluate the claims about Phiten. If this was perceived as an advert or any form of agressive marketing then I am truly sorry for that, as it was not my intention to come across this way. Having worked in sales for 3 years and hated the high pressure approach, the idea of sampling and hassle free trials appealed to me and I felt it would also to the users of a site of this nature.

Please post any other points you may have at any time and I'll be happy to answer. If anyone changes their mind about the samples the offer remains open. We can provide extra samples if you would like to try them on relatives without telling them what they are (slightly unscientific, but the best available at home!)

daveoneil

Sorry, I should also have said if anyone from the NHS wants samples I would be absolutely delighted to provide them. I have a few final year and PhD students looking to carry out projects using our tape at the University of Glasgow next term, and a similiar request from the National Health Service, who do an amazing job, would be welcome.

Thanks for the suggestion...