Advice about being a rent Guarantor

Lilibee

We're in the process of renting a new house, and my Dad is going to be acting as Guarantor for my boyfriend as he is starting a Masters so won't have any income (joint tenancy, so we're jointly liable even though my income is high enough to cover everything).

Dad just got the Guarantor Agreement through today, and it's full of incomprehensible legal jargon. We've deciphered most of it, but it seems to be saying something along the lines of, he is liable to pay anything that the Landlord arbitrarily decides that we as Tenants owe him, regardless of whether or not we (the tenants) dispute it.

E.g. If the washing machine broke down, and the LL decides we caused it and wants £200 to fix, but we dispute that, could the LL demand that money from my Dad without first having to prove that we as Tenants are liable?

I can post the exact wording of the contract if needed, it's not long but VERY full of legal speak!

Thanks for any advice

Yorkie1

I think for meaningful comment, it would indeed be useful to have the full text of the clause / document (obviously don't post anything that identifies anyone or the property)

PasturesNew

The biggest worry isn't the washing machine. The biggest issue would be: you come home one day and find your bf in bed with the local floozy. A row ensues and you stomp your little feet out and right back to daddy's house .... bf then decides to stop paying the rent and have mates over to party most nights and hangs on for grim death over the eviction (rest of the rental period plus a few months beyond until the bailiffs come), then on the last night decides to have a party, gets drunk and some gatecrashers decide to strip the house of the bathroom/kitchen and entire heating system while he's passed out. Then your dad'll get the bill for the lot.

Wouldn't worry about a few quid here and there on the little stuff, you have to think about the bigger stuff.

bristol_pilot

The best advice would be - do not EVER be a guarantor for anybody under any circumstances. If the OP's income is sufficient to cover the rent, then put the tenancy in the OP's name only and there will be no requirement for a guarantor. If the LL requires all occupants on the tenancy, find somewhere else to live. TBH I think it is wrong and inconsiderate to expose your father to this kind of financial risk.

G_M

The guarantor will be liable for the same things the tenant would be liable for: basically rent and damage.

If there is a disputed cost (eg the washing machine scenario) then that dispute gets decided in just the same way as it would be between landlord and tenant. in the first instance through discussion/agreement between the parties, via the deposit registration scheme arbitration process if the deposit is in dispute, or via the Small Claims Court, The fact that a guarantor is involved makes no difference.

I agree with Pasturenew above though. Being a guarantor is a major commitment, which cannot be cancelled at whim. Once signed up, you are committed come what may. Guaranteeing a family member is a major commitment. Guaranteeing someone less closely related carries even greater risks, as Pastures outlines.

Lilibee

Wording as below: (Section 1 just says X guarantees Y for [address] for [term] etc) This is the bit that's a bit difficult:

=========================================

2. Landlord's Protections
2.1 The Guarantor acknowledges and agrees that this Guarantee is and at all times shall be a continuing security and shall extend to cover the balance due at any time from the named Tenant to the
Landlord under or in respect of the Agreement and any continuation renewal or variation thereof.
2.2 The Guarantor acknowledges and agrees that none of its liabilities under this Guarantee shall be reduced discharged or otherwise adversely affected by:-
2.2.1 Any variation extension discharge compromise dealing with exchange or renewal of any right or remedy which the Landlord may now or hereafter have from or against the Tenant(s) in respect of any of the obligations and liabilities for the Tenant(s) under and in respect of the Agreement
2.2.1 Any act or omission by the Landlord or any other person in taking up perfecting or enforcing any security or guarantee from or against the Tenant(s) and/or the named Tenant.
2.2.2 Any grant of time indulgence waiver or concession to the Tenant(s)
2.2.3 Any invalidity legality unenforceability irregularity or frustration of any actual or purported obligation of the Tenant(s)
2.2.4 Any claim or enforcement of payment from the Tenant(s)
2.2.5 Any act or omission which would not have discharged or affected the liability of the Guarantor had it been a principal debtor instead or Guarantor of Indemnitor or by anything done or omitted by any person which but for this provision might operate to exonerate or
discharge the Guarantor or otherwise reduce or extinguish its liability under this Guarantee

2.3 The Landlord shall not be obliged before taking steps to enforce any of its rights and remedies under
the Guarantee:-
2.3.1 To take action or obtain judgement in any Court against the Tenant(s)
2.3.2 To make or file any claim in liquidation administration or insolvency of any of the Tenants
2.3.3 To make demand enforce or seek to enforce any claim right or remedy against the Tenant(s)

=============================================

I should note that I'm aware of the bigger stuff as pointed out by PasturesNew, so's my Dad in agreeing to be guarantor, and we're all OK with those risks. Put it this way, if it ever did come to that, I definitely won't be the one leaving the house... lol. Thanks for reading and responding though.

The washing machine thing was just meant to be an example, the real question in general terms is, can a LL demand money from a Guarantor WITHOUT first proving that the tenant is liable for that money?

Lilibee

G_M wrote: »

The guarantor will be liable for the same things the tenant would be liable for: basically rent and damage.

If there is a disputed cost (eg the washing machine scenario) then that dispute gets decided in just the same way as it would be between landlord and tenant. in the first instance through discussion/agreement between the parties, via the deposit registration scheme arbitration process if the deposit is in dispute, or via the Small Claims Court, The fact that a guarantor is involved makes no difference.

Thanks for this, that's very helpful. Kind of what I thought, but nice to have someone else confirm too

bristol_pilot

The first bit says the guarantor cannot get out of the agreement. The second bit means that the LL can come after the guarantor in the first instance rather than look to the tenants to pay up first as he properly should. The OP's Dad would be nuts to sign this, there is a high risk that he is chucking away a major sum like £20k or so. But why ask for advice if you are determined to go ahead with this anyway?

Lilibee

bristol_pilot wrote: »

The best advice would be - do not EVER be a guarantor for anybody under any circumstances. If the OP's income is sufficient to cover the rent, then put the tenancy in the OP's name only and there will be no requirement for a guarantor. If the LL requires all occupants on the tenancy, find somewhere else to live. TBH I think it is wrong and inconsiderate to expose your father to this kind of financial risk.

Thanks for your input, if we could find another place, we would. Problem is we HAVE to move in the next two weeks, and we HAVE to move to this particular town because of OH's masters starting on 17th Jan. The other problem is, there's a huge lack of rental properties in this area unless you can afford a 4 bed 'executive' home, so we're a bit stuck. Agency will not put the tenancy in my name only because we'll both we living there. So it's provide a Guarantor, or be homeless.

bristol_pilot

Lilibee wrote: »

Thanks for this, that's very helpful. Kind of what I thought, but nice to have someone else confirm too

G_M posted before the OP had posted paragraph 2.3 of the contract.

G_M

The washing machine thing was just meant to be an example, the real question in general terms is, can a LL demand money from a Guarantor WITHOUT first proving that the tenant is liable for that money?

The LL can DEMAND anything. If it is disputed (whether by tenant or guarantor) then it could ultimately go to arbitration or court, and the LL would then have to PROVE liability.