Is probate always necessary?

TrulyMadly

My father in law has died and my husband is the sole executor. Do you need to go through probate or does it depend on whether the institutions insist upon it. He has a substantial amount of money. His wife died last year and my husband is an only child. So I'm hoping things can be kept simple by merely writing to each institution with the death certificate and the will. Does anyone know if probate will be insisted upon.

Thank you

Mojisola

Yes it will. See here for the rules - https://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Governmentcitizensandrights/Death/Preparation/DG_10029799

Is a grant of probate/representation always needed?
When a grant is needed
A grant is almost always needed when the person who dies leaves one or more of the following:
£5,000
stocks or shares
certain insurance policies
property or land held in their own name or as 'tenants in common'
In most cases above, the bank or relevant institution will need to see the grant before transferring control of the assets. However if the estate is small some organisations, such as insurance companies and building societies, may release the money to you at their discretion.)

HoofeHearted

I think if property is involved, then probate is needed.

When my father died a couple of years ago, he had no property, but had savings in several banks.

The largest was about £20k in HBOS and they told me they could avoid probate by calling it a 'small estate'. Don't know if all banks have similar rules.

I did not know about probate till he died. Only son, will made out as me being sole executor/recipient. Makes you wonder about wills in general.

datostar

HoofeHearted wrote: »

I think if property is involved, then probate is needed.

When my father died a couple of years ago, he had no property, but had savings in several banks.

The largest was about £20k in HBOS and they told me they could avoid probate by calling it a 'small estate'. Don't know if all banks have similar rules.

I did not know about probate till he died. Only son, will made out as me being sole executor/recipient. Makes you wonder about wills in general.

I was executor of my late father's will last year. He had accounts with several banks and certificated shareholdings. Some banks offered me the small estate procedure but the forms require you to certify that you are not applying for probate as well. 2 of the banks insisted on probate so I couldn't use the small estate procedure with the others. Obtaining probate was easy - 2 forms to complete and an interview. It can also be cheaper - there were charges for the small estate procedures and the small estate procedure for the shareholdings was quite complex and expensive.

Mee

datostar wrote: »

I was executor of my late father's will last year. He had accounts with several banks and certificated shareholdings. Some banks offered me the small estate procedure but the forms require you to certify that you are not applying for probate as well. 2 of the banks insisted on probate so I couldn't use the small estate procedure with the others. Obtaining probate was easy - 2 forms to complete and an interview. It can also be cheaper - there were charges for the small estate procedures and the small estate procedure for the shareholdings was quite complex and expensive.

Ditto.
I managed to do probate for my late father's estate (sans will, property tenancy-in-common) - I'm not particularly bright either... You'll get through it... Good luck.

getmore4less

Probate is relativly easy to do.

The tax return can be more complicated.

If the total is over £325k then you will need to do a full IHT400 return to get the extended nill rate band.

If there is a house then that needs probate.

All the forms are on-line
start with PA1 and IHT205

http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/HMCSCourtFinder/GetForms.do?court_forms_category=Probate

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/inheritancetax/iht-probate-forms/find-right-forms.htm

hushpuppy

Hi all,

A very timely thread, I too need some advice on this topic please?

My Uncle recently died, leaving no will and only my elderly aunty and I feel that to employ a solicitor is unnecessary. I have gone through all his papers and written to all the financial institutions and have now established the following:

His house owned jointly with my aunty is worth @£55,000
The contents of the house are worth @£5,000
He had @£138,000 in bank accounts in his sole name
He had @ £65,000 in stocks and shares.
He had no joint bank accounts and as far as I can ascertain had not given any gifts to anyone (at least not in the last 10 years).

I have completed forms PA1 and IHT205 BUT (and here is where I need help), on the last page of PA1 it states completing IHT400 and IHT421, they in turn suggest completing other forms. Do I have to do so given the value of his estate?

I have read and re-read the HMRC IHT pages, but I am still confused and would rather not have to employ a solicitor, so any advice as to what I should do would be greatly appreciated?

getmore4less

hushpuppy wrote: »

Hi all,

A very timely thread, I too need some advice on this topic please?

My Uncle recently died, leaving no will and only my elderly aunty and I feel that to employ a solicitor is unnecessary. I have gone through all his papers and written to all the financial institutions and have now established the following:

His house owned jointly with my aunty is worth @£55,000
The contents of the house are worth @£5,000
He had @£138,000 in bank accounts in his sole name
He had @ £65,000 in stocks and shares.
He had no joint bank accounts and as far as I can ascertain had not given any gifts to anyone (at least not in the last 10 years).

I have completed forms PA1 and IHT205 BUT (and here is where I need help), on the last page of PA1 it states completing IHT400 and IHT421, they in turn suggest completing other forms. Do I have to do so given the value of his estate?

I have read and re-read the HMRC IHT pages, but I am still confused and would rather not have to employ a solicitor, so any advice as to what I should do would be greatly appreciated?

it says 205 OR 421

Read the IHT205 notes(IHT205) very carefully and the rules for intestate estates.


If they were married then all will transfer to the aunt.

I think this estate may only need the IHT205 and if you managed to fill it in without anything requireing you to stop and do a IHT400 you should be OK,, if not the probate office will probably pick it up.

Another option is to phone or make an appointment with your local tax office for help

Savvy_Sue

or phone the probate office, they're very helpful too.

srcandas

Sort of related:

My father died 2006, my mother 2011. I am having to do a IHT400 and friends as I am claiming the remains of my father's nil rate allowance to top up my mother's nil rate allowance (a trust had already used £200,000 of my father's allowance - there's another thread about this "probate two parents").

As suggested by others I called the HMRC help line and they were very helpful as to which forms were required. They said a IHT205 would have been an option if I had been claiming 100% of my father's allowance.

But a question which hopefully someone can make a suggestion:

The estate is £520,000. House £400,000. Cash £120,000.

My brother who lives in the house, he was my mothers helper, would like to stay there. So the easy answer is my brother keeps the house and gives me all my mum's cash and £140,000 from his savings.

Is there a risk that I will become liable to tax because I appear to have sold him half a house?

dzug1

You WILL have sold him half the house.

Not sure why it should lead to a tax liability for you personally though. You will have sold it at the same price as you acquired it, presumably, so no CGT.