2 or 4 Winter Tyres

maxheadroom

The next video on ice cornering quite an eye opener considering how much black ice is about

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlYEMH10Z4s&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

mrbadexample

derrick wrote: »

you can't legally use them in summer

Eh? Which bit of the law says that then? :huh:

mrbadexample

purplephoenix wrote: »

Any thoughts

Does it say anything about winter tyres in your car's handbook? Mine said only fit 4.

vikingaero

You can't use studded tyres on clear road. You can drive with winter tyres on clear roads.

As to 2 or 4. Well, many cabbies in lowland Scotland happily use 2 winter tyres on the driven axle of their cars. The further North you go, the more likely they use 4 winter tyres.

sunshinetours

derrick wrote: »

Because IMO they are not needed if you drive to the conditions, and am not sure if they actually work, although never tried them. There was an article on a TV prog last week, (can't remember now), but I gleaned that they are an expensive "not required" in this country due to the small amount of bad weather needed for them, (you can't legally use them in summer), and that some insurers classed them as modification, I would get it in writing from yours if you do go down that route.



There is a thread running HERE on winter tyres.

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vikingaero wrote: »

You can't use studded tyres on clear road. You can drive with winter tyres on clear roads.

As to 2 or 4. Well, many cabbies in lowland Scotland happily use 2 winter tyres on the driven axle of their cars. The further North you go, the more likely they use 4 winter tyres.

There is clearly still a lot of MIS-information around about Winter tyres aswell.

Winter tyres are for cold weather and made with a softer compound which grips better in conditions generally below 7 degrees. Ones marked with the M&S marking and a snowflake symbols are tyres with a tread pattern more suitable also for snow

Studded tyres being referred to above are extremelly uncommon on the UK and meant for Scandinavian type countries where compacted snow and ice exists for months on end, and are not the Winter tyres most people are referring to
You can also indeed leave them on all year round if you wanted but they probably would wear out quicker than your regular tyres once temperatures were back to Spring/Summer levels

there are those who have tried them and generally seem to give postive feedback (like myself) and others on here who have a mate down the pub who knew someone etc etc,... well you can make up your own mind

They are certainly not a miracle cure by any means but they have made my winter driving so far much much more comfortable shall we say

vaio

On the 2 or 4 debate, the general rule is the grippiest tyres should go on the rear.

Those of us old enough to remember the introduction of radial tyres will recall similar arguments back then, the law is if you only have two radials they must go on the back as they are the grippiest and exactly the same logic applies to winters (or indeed any other tyres.)

Under-steering cars tend to be self limiting and are much easier to control than over-steering cars (if not as much fun for those who enjoy playing)

Farzackerly

purplephoenix wrote: »

Anyway, I digress, its the safety of 2 on the drive wheels versus a full set that I'm wanting opinions on really. Hence why I started a new thread, as the others didn't seem to cover this.

cheers

If you fit two only on the front, it all depends how good you are at controlling the rear when it wants to slide out, big time. Personally, I'd go for all four and just pay the extra.

bigjl

In the same way as snow socks, you only need them on the driven wheels, as winter tyres aren't there to provide you with summer levels of grip, they are there just to stop you getting stuck.

Obviously 4 is the best bet, but as the only purpose is extra traction when needed, such as a slippy incline, then if driven properly then fitting them to the driven wheels of a front wheel drive car will give more traction when needed, having more traction at the front doesn't reduce the traction at the rear, but a poorly skilled or inexperienced driver might misjudge how much grip they have at the back due to not being able to judge changing grip levels.

The argument about putting new tyres on the rear will go on and on, mainly due to a piece of research done by Michelin a few years ago.

Thus Costco only put your new tyres on the rear of your car, though interestingly they never mentioned this to the London Ambulance Service when we went over to Michelins a year or so ago, and we continue to put the new tyres on the axle with the worn tyres, not just the rear, just the one with the worn tyres.

When we where given snowsocks last year they were for the driven wheels only, thus there will be more grip on the driven wheels, this would be the same if they fitted 2 winter tyres, it never caused any accidents, nobody lost control, but they where able to negotiate the ungritted side roads easily, though personally I didn't use them, as I didn't consider the snow bad enough to need extra traction in side streets, just needed more anitcipation and extra smooth braking and steering.

This year we are having winter tyres fitted, October to March roughly, whichi is thought to be a better compromise than snowsocks.


To answer the question that the OP has posted, there is nothing unsafe about putting winter tyres on the front wheels only of a FWD car, as long as the driver is aware that there will be better traction on the front, the rear may feel a bit looser, but it is not much different to having a better pair of tyres on the front and a set of ditch finders on the back, it seems that a lot of drivers these days rely more on the abilities of their car rather than thier own driving abilities, I think it should be compulsory for all new drivers to drive an Morris Minor or an Austin A40 mk2 Farina for a few years after passing thier test that will put some hair on thier chest and give them a very good grounding in the art of controlling an oversteering car. At relatively low speeds aswell, I used to enjoy driven from Uni to my home town, 140 miles and the car would oversteer at every corner on the way.


Best practice is a set of four matched tyres, which I always try to do on my own cars, money permitting, but I really don't like having mix and match sets of tyres, but remember some people can't tell when one of thier tyres is soft when driving along, let alone when they are loosing grip on a slippery surface. Hence the recommendation by Michelin to put the best tyres on the rear, as it will be a good safety measure for those that just dont have the "feel" for driving that some people have.

Lets be honest, how many times have you seen a car behind you lose control when trying to copy your cornering speed, I have seen it a fair few times, and it is normally the same kind of driver, the kind that drives a nice car and thinks that they can drive, until they try to do something that the driver in front does and not be able to do it, regardless of driving a car with vorsprung dorsh technic or the ultimate driver machine, there is a mechanical failure of the nut behind the wheel.

mikey72

bigjl wrote: »

When we where given snowsocks last year they were for the driven wheels only, thus there will be more grip on the driven wheels, this would be the same if they fitted 2 winter tyres, it never caused any accidents, nobody lost control, but they where able to negotiate the ungritted side roads easily, though personally I didn't use them, as I didn't consider the snow bad enough to need extra traction in side streets, just needed more anitcipation and extra smooth braking and steering.

That will work in London, where you don't have any decent hills, but once gravity overcomes friction, then there's no way you're going to move. 2 Winter tyres are definately better then none then.

vaio

bigjl wrote: »

......you only need them on the driven wheels, as winter tyres aren't there to provide you with summer levels of grip, they are there just to stop you getting stuck.......

.......This year we are having winter tyres fitted, October to March roughly, which is thought to be a better compromise than snowsocks.........

Do your ambulances only need them on the driven wheels or are your bosses ignoring your advice and fitting them all round?