Tuition fee protest

wageslave

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

Well, I went to a Comprehensive and got into Oxford.

My old man went to a Comprehensive and has a PhD.

Not many did though.

Comprehensives, on the whole, have been bliddy disasters

wageslave

diable wrote: »

Like the old grammar system?

Yes, I would start from there. Bring back the old 11plus thing and start streaming kids.

What I would not do is put a university education out of the reach of the bright working classes and that is what this present government is doing.

We voted in a coalition government for a reason.

All we are getting is tory policies and an increasingly tattered Nick Clegg

That is the real problem we need to address.

If majority rule didn't work and the LibDems haven't the moral courage to stick to their guns, where do we, the voter, go next?

A._Badger

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

Well, I went to a Comprehensive and got into Oxford.

My old man went to a Comprehensive and has a PhD.

Generalising from the particular again. eh?

wageslave

A._Badger wrote: »

Generalising from the particular again. eh?

It is actually allowed.

It is what we, as people, do. Talk from our own perspective.

Lack of a decent education, most likely

A._Badger

wageslave wrote: »

It is actually allowed.

It is what we, as people, do. Talk from our own perspective.

Lack of a decent education, most likely

Most probably. Not quite what you'd expect (or perhaps, might once have expected) from someone who waves his Oxford degree around like a magical talisman, though.

wageslave

A._Badger wrote: »

Most probably. Not quite what you'd expect (or perhaps, might once have expected) from someone who waves his Oxford degree around like a magical talisman, though.

Well isn't that what what we have been debating?

Degrees of idiocy and defending the right to have them. Irregardless of whether Daddy had a PHD.

Or is that arguing from the particular?

EDIT GENARILISING, Generalising from the particular. A phrase so far beyond me, I was forced to cut and paste.

<--waves enthusiastically at Badger. It was getting really difficult pretending to be adequate in your absence

wageslave

Anyways, why are you having a go a Humphrey?

Having a decent degree is not a hanging offense

Degenerate

diable wrote: »

not everyone is equal so don't be blinded by propaganda.

I am quite happy with the concept that university education is not for everyone. I think we went astray with the obsession with trying to send all kids to uni, we should probably be halving places and cutting the many worthless subjects to save money.

Where I fail to see your logic, as someone from humble beginnings yourself, is in your concept of how these limited places get allocated. Surely the fair way is to have selection based on academic ability, but you seem to prefer self-selection by way of economic exclusion.

Degenerate

wageslave wrote: »

Not many did though.

Comprehensives, on the whole, have been bliddy disasters

People like to compare grammar schools to comprehensives and conveniently ignore the "secondary moderns" that most kids went to in the grammar school era. There are some excellent comprehensives and some terrible ones, just like there were some excellent grammar schools and terrible secondary moderns. I'm in favour of academic selection, but I'm not sure that a system of academic apartheid that keeps the brighter kids completely segregated in different schools is beneficial. I went to a good comprehensive with strict academic streaming and IMO this enabled the brighter kids to reach their potential whilst turning them out better socially developed than a segregated system would.

diable

Degenerate wrote: »

I am quite happy with the concept that university education is not for everyone. I think we went astray with the obsession with trying to send all kids to uni, we should probably be halving places and cutting the many worthless subjects to save money.

Where I fail to see your logic, as someone from humble beginnings yourself, is in your concept of how these limited places get allocated. Surely the fair way is to have selection based on academic ability, but you seem to prefer self-selection by way of economic exclusion.

Hmmmm maybe gone off track a bit as it was late, what I meant was that if you are gifted no matter from what background you should have the opportunity to educate yourself further at a reasonable cost. Far too many people leave Uni with a degree in some obscure and meaningless subject thinking they will waltz in to a high salaried position but in reality if they are lucky to find a job they will end up in Phones 4 U or a call centre in the middle of nowhere.

Scholarships, grants, reasonably priced evening classes helped a lot of people my age better themselves and move up in the world but I don't think those times will ever return as nowadays as most people are trying to juggle holding down a job, earning enough to survive and paying ridiculous fees for child care.

As someone mentioned earlier a lot of people have been brainwashed into thinking that they must or have to go to Uni, fantastic business plan if you are selling something in getting the masses to believe they must have it, bit like Ugg boots..............