Penalty for late rent

Brb

Yeah it's a brave tenant the says "excuse me dear LA but it appears you're trying to pretend you're either the police or a court by trying to get me to agree to £x penalty clause per day for late rent".

It's only the police or courts that can impose a penalty fee.

Cannot condone not paying the rent though.

LL can only claim for their real losses. Modest admin fee per letter and interest on monies lost (that they would have made in their account had the monies been there) that can be x% above the base rate (anything 2-5%) which doesn't actually amount to much.

mynameisdave

iscoed wrote: »

NOW, we are being told by the Letting Agents, they have the money and the Administrator in the office said she had made a mistake and that she was in trouble with the accounts department because she hadnt deducted fees for letters sent for late payment of rent, therefore they werent going to pay the deposit back.

When asked what fees they were talking about this is what she said...

36 x £17.63 for arrears letters

18 x £29.38 for guarantor letters

6 x £117.50 for Solicitors letter

So basically....all the £1852 that was owed to the boys!!

If the deposit was in the DPS, and has been released to the Lettings Agency, politely point out to them that they are not arbitors and the money is yours. If the LL wants money for unpaid rent then they should have disputed it and they have to show to a court that they are owed unpaid rent.

Why have they sent 36 (I assume 6 to each person) At what frequency do they claim they were sent?

Svenena

I can see why the OP's friend would be worried about such a clause, even if they intended to pay the rent on time every month. Mistakes can happen. At my last place I paid my rent about a week late once because of a bank error (I only realised the rent hadn't gone out when the LA contacted me). Being charged £210 for my bank's mistake would've stung! However, as the clause is unenforceable there is nothing to worry about.

<sebb>

Svenena wrote: »

Mistakes can happen.

Yep, that's exactly what would bother me. I've never missed or been late with a payment for anything in my entire life EXCEPT where there has been a bank error, lost invoice, or some other mistake. Such a penalty would be completely unreasonable in these circumstances.

The problem is, if you complain, and try to get the clause removed, the LA or LL assumes that you are complaining because you are likely to be late or default with the rent and doesn't want to rent to you! It's a no win situation!

iscoed

mynameisdave wrote: »

If the deposit was in the DPS, and has been released to the Lettings Agency, politely point out to them that they are not arbitors and the money is yours. If the LL wants money for unpaid rent then they should have disputed it and they have to show to a court that they are owed unpaid rent.

Why have they sent 36 (I assume 6 to each person) At what frequency do they claim they were sent?

There is no rent owed. Yes. each letter x 6. Even though we paid by telephone we were never asked for more than the rent plus a couple of pounds for paying by card....Not once were extra fees mentioned.

So much for Deposit protection too if they can just pass it over to someone other than the people it belongs to...And actually....the Letting Agents lied when they said it was the Landlord claiming rent arrears!

DVardysShadow

iscoed wrote: »

36 x £17.63 for arrears letters

18 x £29.38 for guarantor letters

6 x £117.50 for Solicitors letter

So basically....all the £1852 that was owed to the boys!!

This is a try on. For each instance of a letter, a basic charge for a letter, plus a much smaller charge for replication to everyone may be justified. As for the solicitor's letter, again the same should apply - you can put them to the test of producing an invoice.

Guitar

Couple of years ago I was going through my accounts and noticed the rent hadn't been paid for two months. The letting agents had sent me paperwork to change the bank account the rent was paid into but they'd then screwed up and lost the paper work after I'd returned it. I rang them up and they confirmed they'd received the paperwork and admitted they'd lost it and it was their fault but hadn't even noticed it until I pointed it out.

No problem, I said, and popped a cheque in the post for the outstanding amount and went to the bank myself and got everything sort out.

A couple days after I'd reported the missing rent, I got a recorded delivery from them (landlord sent a copy too), pointing out that they'd noticed my rent hadn't been paid for two months and that while they know it's probably just a temporary oversight on my part they'd like it sorted asap.

tbs624

iscoed wrote: »

My son rented as a student with 5 others from a Letting Agency...........As students there were times when the rent was late but always paid.

I'm not sure if you are suggesting that it is understandable/excusable for them to have kept their LL waiting for the rent, purely because they are students? That does a disservice to other students, if so. Part of going off to Uni is about learning to stand on your own two feet and manage your own budget. That means allocating your student loan funds to your rent before any other spending is considered.

A tenancy agreement obliges a T to pay their rent in full and on time. Most LLs will overlook a couple of late payments but from those charges listed it sounds as though some of the household regularly failed to meet their legal obligations.6 arrears letters each, plus a follow up to guarantors? Sounds a bit like Ts burying their heads in the sand and failing to communicate over those late payments. As a T, if you know you are struggling to pay your rent then why not approach your G yourself and ask for their help, before it becomes necessary for an LA/LL to contact them? This bit does of course fall under "hindsight" but may help another thread reader who may be in similar circumstances.

iscoed wrote: »

There is no rent owed. Yes. each letter x 6. Even though we paid by telephone we were never asked for more than the rent plus a couple of pounds for paying by card....Not once were extra fees mentioned.

Were the charges listed out in the tenancy agreement or any of the initial tenancy paperwork?

iscoed wrote: »

So much for Deposit protection too if they can just pass it over to someone other than the people it belongs to...And actually....the Letting Agents lied when they said it was the Landlord claiming rent arrears!

The Scheme cannot "just pass it over" without the Ts (a) agreement or (b) lack of action when notified that the LL/LA have requested a deduction.

You said previously

<At the end of the tenancy we applied for the return of the deposit .The money minus an agreed amount deducted by the Landlord for repainting etc was released. We were supposed to click the email to recover the money. Since we werent aware of the other boys bank account details and addresses we had asked the Letting Agent to do it...they said they didnt deal that. We had a couple of reminders from DPS and my husband telephoned them we were told that by then the Landlord had put in a claim for the balance of the money and the reason provided was unpaid rent.>

My bolding.

There is no need for Ts to be ignorant of the way in which the scheme works: the information is available in full on each Scheme's website and you can phone/email the Scheme for advice. You have to respond promptly to messages regarding the return or possible retention of the deposit monies - if you don't the funds are likely to be awarded to the other party.

mynameisdave wrote: »

If the deposit was in the DPS, and has been released to the Lettings Agency, politely point out to them that they are not arbitors and the money is yours. If the LL wants money for unpaid rent then they should have disputed it and they have to show to a court that they are owed unpaid rent.

I may be wrong but from what the OP (2nd one in the thread) says, it sounds as though they failed to respond promptly to messages from DPS, hence deposit monies were awarded in line with LA/LLs request.

Ts need to understand that LAs work solely in the LLs interests -iscoed, did you/your son hand over his Ts scheme info to the LA to request return of the funds? If so, you/he shouldn't have done - each party has their own and Ts should never disclose theirs to the LL/LA.

iscoed

My husband spoke to DPS and was told all would be ok. When nothing happened and he called again the girl said she had been unable to change the payment plan (sorry Im getting this 2nd hand from my husband) and that the LA now had put in a stat claim. If we disputed it then to say so. He rang the LA who at that time said it was just to get the money back into their office so they could distribute the money as they had all the Tenants bank and address details and not to dispute it as this would delay payments. I also believe that the previous tenants of the house had all their deposit kept. The LA didnt keep individual records of who paid and who didnt. They sent out letters to all students and parents...even when they did know (as in our case...because we paid over the phone and they posted receipts to us!) they still sent letters to all because the overall rent of £1820.00 wasnt paid at times. Another occasion, one parent paid double rent one month and when he realised he didnt pay the next month...this was chased as unpaid rent too!! Just thought.....we had the receipts for the money paid and no where did it say....and further money owed for fees!

tbs624

iscoed wrote: »

My husband spoke to DPS and was told all would be ok. When nothing happened and he called again the girl said she had been unable to change the payment plan (sorry Im getting this 2nd hand from my husband) and that the LA now had put in a stat claim. If we disputed it then to say so.

So why didn't you/your son do that?

iscoed wrote: »

He rang the LA who at that time said it was just to get the money back into their office so they could distribute the money as they had all the Tenants bank and address details and not to dispute it as this would delay payments. ..

It is not the role of the LA to receive any part of the deposit which is intended to be returned to the Ts. The only part of a deposit which should get returned to an LA/LL is the part which equates to an *agreed* deduction.

All Lead Ts should make sure that they have forwarding address info for other Ts, and Ts who are not Lead Ts should ensure that they give the LT their info.

The purpose of the scheme is so that LL and T can each put forward their own claim, and if they can't agree the scheme can arrange arbitration or either party can go to court to settle the matter.

DPS would not have returned any/all of the Ts deposit to the LA/LL without agreement or a lack of response from the Ts within the usual time frames.

You do seem to have created much of the problem yourselves by failing to make sure you knew how the deposit schemes operate.

You still have not confirmed whether there was anything in the initial tenancy paperwork or the tenancy agreement itself which relates to fees which may be charged. If there is definitely nothing there then you could try talking to your local Trading Standards Office and/or raising this issue with any self-regulatory body to which the LA may belong but it sounds as though you had the opportunity to dispute the LA's request and you missed it.