Huge rant, not our debt!!

mattb001

Hi there - not sure what I'm hoping to gain by writing this, but having a rant sure makes me feel better!

A brief background:

My partner and I bought our first house in July this year. It all went through reasonably smoothly, a few hiccups with the survey but all was sorted to our satisfaction.

The house is an ex council house. The sellers purchased the house at a discounted price around 4 years ago. They had a garage built and a drive, front garden landscaped etc. We paid the going rate for the house this July.

The sellers told us they had been left a house in Ireland by a relative and were relocating there. Thus, they left most of their furniture and so we felt we had somewhat of a bargain.

The first problems appeared when we got the keys to the house and moved in. They had left no forwarding address and a pile of what were evidently bills soon grew. We returned all of them to the sender except for those with no return address on, which we eventually opened (what choice is there?). The first was a CCJ for a £1200 debt against a kitchen fitting company. The second was a final reminder for a £300 NTL bill. Add unpaid credit cards, water and electricity bills to the list.

We contacted the creditors and informed them the owners had moved house, and we had no address for them.

Fast forward three months to today – we’ve received calls from debt collectors, had to pay a £50 deposit to get the phone connected “because the house has a bad history” etc. etc.

It has become obvious to us that the owners were in a spiral of debt, have sold the house for a large profit and, to be blunt, done a runner.

We can cope with fending off the £300 debts, but last Friday a letter arrived demanding the repayment of an £80k mortgage advising court bailiffs would be arranged within 7 days if no further contact was made. Remember, these are not our debts.

So we ring up the lender (GE Money) who refuse to talk to us, and say we should contact our Solicitor, which we duly have. Getting worried, I check the last correspondence we had with our Solicitor, which congratulated us on the move and stating his only further task is to register the deeds in our name. This letter is dated the 10th July. I check the Land Registry website and download the Deed for our house. It isn’t registered in our name, but in the previous owners’ still.

So as far as I can tell, we’ve lived in this house for 3 months, have been making mortgage payments to our lender, yet the house isn’t registered as ours and has an £80k mortgage outstanding on it which has nothing to do with us.

What on earth has happened to the money we paid for the house?? The sellers’ Solicitor must have received it, so why hasn’t their mortgage been settled? Our Solicitor has stated it is the sellers’ Solicitors responsibility to settle their mortgage and they are chasing it up, but this is of little comfort to us. We’re having to answer the door with the security chain on just in case the bailiffs appear to collect someone else’s massive debt!!

The whole situation is ridiculous, and we're at a bit of a loss what to do next.

Poppy9

OMG this sounds awful.

I would just put a line through all mail not addressed to you saying "not known at this address".

Bailiffs have no right of entry to your house as you are not the debtor. You can call their regulating body. I will try to find a link for you.

r.mac_2

First of all don't panic. Take a deep breath - I am sure that it will get sorted out.

Point 1. The rule of property law (I speak from a scottish perspective but this is true of england too) is that ownership (real rights) really passes upon the registration of the deeds. This is the job of your solicitor. If as you say registration has not occured within 3 months then then your solicitor has been negligent. (if you suffer in any way because of this the legal firm is then liable for damages etc) The estimated time of registration is about 4 days in practice. The law society currently propose that 2 weeks be considered a suitable time period. So contact your solicitor, tell him what you found re: the land register and ask if s/he can clarify the situation for you.

Point 2. Keep returning all mail unopened. You do not have to pay for debt that is not yours. DOn't pay it in the hope they will disappear. it would be unlikely you could get anything back by doing this.

I really hope that it gets sorted, its an awfully upsetting expereince to go through. I have my fingers crossed that the online register is just not updated regularly and you have your deeds registered.

Keep smiling and I am thinking of you x

TJ27

Doesn't it take quite some time for the new owner's details to actually show up on the land registry? I quite often need to get these details in my line of work and find that it can take up two or three months. So it's possible that the solicitor has done his/her bit, but it just hasn't been logged on the land reg computer yet.

I'm sure you've phoned all parties involved though.

abaxas

There is another way....

Write to anyone who is harrassing you with letters stating that any further threats will be deamed as 'harrassment' and will forwarded onto the police.

If they continue, get the police involved. The companies will scuttle away quicker than greyhound on speed.

mattb001

Thanks everyone for your concern

Yes, we can and have written to the creditors.

What concerns us is the fact the house still appears to be registered in the previous owners' names, and their mortgage hasn't been paid. So does this mean the creditors can reposess the house?

Mrs_pbradley936

Have a look here:-

http://www.housepricespy.com/?ppc=google-house%20price%20spy

and see if your details are there. It could be that the details have not been finalised as yet.

If the link does not work the site is called house price spy or you can get the same info from rightmove.com both are free but you might have to register.

Bossyboots

As TJ says, it can take time for the entry to appear on the register. What is important is when it arrived at the land registry. Someone else had this problem and was told by the land registry it can take up to three months for it to show up. Your best bet is to actually ring the land registry and ask them to check exactly what they have and whether the registration document has been received. Until you do this, you really don't know exactly what you are dealing with.

Do you know for sure the 80k mortgage is on your property? Just sending back post unopened and saying the person has moved as suggested won't work because that is the oldest trick in the book and no one owed money is going to believe it.

The seller's solicitor would be a good place to refer all these creditors. I suspect that they may not have actually been buying another property but the solicitors may have a forwarding address and a court can order it to be revealed. Your solicitor will have the seller's solicitors details if you do not. Give those details to all the creditors and forward all post for your sellers onto the solicitors as well.

mattb001

Hi,

Yes the move is listed on that page. It was also listed on a similar website about a month ago when I checked, thinking about it.

Where do these sites get their information from? Anyone know?

mattb001

As TJ says, it can take time for the entry to appear on the register. What is important is when it arrived at the land registry. Someone else had this problem and was told by the land registry it can take up to three months for it to show up. Your best bet is to actually ring the land registry and ask them to check exactly what they have and whether the registration document has been received. Until you do this, you really don't know exactly what you are dealing with.

I'll ring them tomorrow, good idea.

Do you know for sure the 80k mortgage is on your property? Just sending back post unopened and saying the person has moved as suggested won't work because that is the oldest trick in the book and no one owed money is going to believe it.

You're right, but if it's illegal to open other people's mail what choice do we have? We eventually opened the letters, and yes, the mortgage is on our house.

The seller's solicitor would be a good place to refer all these creditors. I suspect that they may not have actually been buying another property but the solicitors may have a forwarding address and a court can order it to be revealed. Your solicitor will have the seller's solicitors details if you do not. Give those details to all the creditors and forward all post for your sellers onto the solicitors as well.

Do you mean forward their post to their solicitors? We have their solicitors name I believe.

Thanks for your help

Mrs_pbradley936

mattb001 wrote:

Hi,

Yes the move is listed on that page. It was also listed on a similar website about a month ago when I checked, thinking about it.

Where do these sites get their information from? Anyone know?

Ok it sounds as if it is all in hand but do as bossyboots suggests it is good advice. Also I think that the Land Registry only update their details every three months and not as soon as they are notified of a change.