RPI to CPI Early Day Motion 1032

Ripoff_2

BoxerfanUK wrote: »

Forgive my ignorance, but who is Steve Webb?

Not only his he work and pensions minister but he is also a Liberal Democrat.

I can't recall any change of this magnitude to indexing in any manifesto of either party and therefore what mandate do they have to change the UK recognised domestic inflation rate of RPI which has been used for 38 years to the lesser fundamentally flawed CPI measure.

They have no consensus, they have no agreement from the professionals and they certainly have no mandate from the British people, no one single party won the election but I think they have forgotten that.

Ripoff_2

Ask Steve Webb some questions at:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/blog/2011/jan/14/live-pensions-minister-questions-steve-webb

You will need to register with the Guardian but it's very simple then feel free to let go!

Ripoff_2

These are the 90 MP's who have signed the EDM 1032 so far, if your MP is not there then ask them again. It is not too much to ask for a delay in a change of this magnitude that effects people's lives and livelihoods, so adversely, is it?

Robertson, John
Begg, Anne
Sheridan, Jim
Llwyd, Elfyn
Hermon, Lady
Weir, Mike
Russell, Bob
Skinner, Dennis
Jackson, Glenda
Meale, Alan
Gapes, Mike
George, Andrew
Edwards, Jonathan
Heyes, David
Lucas, Caroline
Campbell, Ronnie
Mearns, Ian
Morrice, Graeme
Donaldson, Jeffrey
Stringer, Graham
Leech, John
Sanders, Adrian
Hepburn, Stephen
Illsley, Eric
Long, Naomi
Dobbin, Jim
Betts, Clive
Cooper, Rosie
Blenkinsop, Tom
Cunningham, Alex
McGovern, Jim
Ritchie, Margaret
Cunningham, Jim
Watts, Dave
Glass, Pat
Caton, Martin
Glindon, Mary
Hunt, Tristram
Roy, Frank
Campbell, Gregory
Hamilton, Fabian
Crausby, David
Dodds, Nigel
McDonnell, Alasdair
Alexander, Heidi
Walley, Joan
Wood, Mike
Kaufman, Gerald
Blomfield, Paul
Ruane, Chris
Michael, Alun
Gilmore, Sheila
Howarth, George
Blackman-Woods, Roberta
Roy, Lindsay
McGovern, Alison
Murray, Ian
Lloyd, Tony
Mitchell, Austin
Osborne, Sandra
Burden, Richard
Connarty, Michael
Clark, Katy
Green, Kate
Reynolds, Emma
Vaz, Valerie
Robertson, Angus
Meacher, Michael
Clarke, Tom
Mudie, George
Chapman, Jenny
McCabe, Steve
Engel, Natascha
Ruddock, Joan
Gardiner, Barry
Wishart, Pete
Miller, Andrew
Hood, Jim
McDonagh, Siobhain
Cunningham, Tony
Dakin, Nic
Danczuk, Simon
Esterson, Bill
Fovargue, Yvonne
Godsiff, Roger
Davidson, Ian
Dowd, Jim
Williams, Hywel
Sheerman, Barry
McGuire, Anne

Interested_Taxpayer

Ripoff wrote: »

Ask Steve Webb some questions at:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/blog/2011/jan/14/live-pensions-minister-questions-steve-webb

You will need to register with the Guardian but it's very simple then feel free to let go!

Good questions Ripoff. Posted mine at 6.01pm.

Come on everybody :mad:

Prof_as_was

Does anybody know if "a comment", now, on the Guardian blog actually has any chance of becoming a question in the future live discussion? Or is it only any good putting up questions while its on live?

Goldwing1

I've received a reply from Damian Green (Cons). It states:


"Thank you for your further e-mail of 13th January.
I have written to Pensions Minister Steve Webb on your behalf, highlighting the quote from the House of Commons Library brief to which you referred to in your earlier e-mail of 23rd December and asking whether he can confirm that the Government considered the view of the UK Statistics Authority.

I will, of course, let you know when I receive a response from Steve Webb. "

While it is only asking the question, I believe it is a step forwards. :j

Ripoff_2

Prof_as_was wrote: »

Does anybody know if "a comment", now, on the Guardian blog actually has any chance of becoming a question in the future live discussion? Or is it only any good putting up questions while its on live?

Hi Prof as was, lets put it this way. It can't do any harm to ask the questions now because the more that see the issue the better and there is nothing to stop you putting a question when live on Thursday. The more we get the message across the better, using any means we can.

Many people are unaware of the effect of this change. I was speaking to someone today who was totally oblivious to the change, I don't know what planet he had been on but it wan't this one. Mind you when I told him the effects he was horrified. This is my point really, there is real ignorance out there and we need to change that.

Today, the inflation rate, the true UK inflation rate is 4.8% (RPI) not the phoney inflation rate the Government would like us to believe of 3.7% (CPI). Moving the indexing of pensions to CPI needs to be shown what it really is for pensions, a CON TRICK by this Conservative led Government.

So,as I see it, it doesn't matter if you don't get your question answered, but it does matter that more and more people see the issue and realise what is happening!

I urge everyone to get the message out there by any means you can, people need to know what this change really means.

JohnB47

I'm really annoyed that I missed the chance to pose a question on the Guardian interview - I got there too late.

So I replied to my MP instead. Here is the text:

Dear Hugo Swire,

I wrote you you recently about the Governments proposal to replace RPI with CPI as the uprating index for pensions. I have now received your reply, for which I thank you but I would like to ask a further
question.

While in opposition, George Osborne wrote in the Conservative document ‘An Unfair Britain’ -

“Pensioner inflation is now considerably higher than CPI inflation
because pensioners spend a much higher percentage of their income on high-inflation goods, like heating, light, and food.”

He then quoted figures from the Office for National Statistics website which showed that pensioner inflation in 2008 was greater even than the RPI measure.

Yet, in your letter, you say:

“…. The Government believes the CPI provides a more appropriate measure of pension recipients' inflation experiences and is also consistentwith the measure of inflation used by the Bank of England. The CPI uses a methodology that takes better account of consumer behaviour in response to price increases....... CPI is a more appropriate measure of changes in the cost of living of pensioners and benefit recipients than RPI.”

Can you please tell me why the Governments position is now exactly the opposite of that held by the Conservative party, your coalition
partners, while in opposition? The pattern of pensioners spending can't have changed significantly, nor can the way CPI is used to measure inflation.

The only conclusion to be drawn is that this is simply a stealth tax on pensioners, who have for years paid into their respective schemes in the expectation that payments would increase according to the September RPI figure. I understand that the September CPI figure has always, apart from two instances, been lower than RPI and I think that it is disgraceful for any political party to reduce a pensioners income like this. Many people in receipt of their occupational pension are no longer in a position to do anything that would make up the shortfall that would result from this proposed change. It is simply not fair.

Why anyone would start a pension plan when they see Governments doing this sort of thing is beyond me.

I would be grateful for a response.

Yours sincerely,

Ripoff_2

Goldwing1 wrote: »

I've received a reply from Damian Green (Cons). It states:


"Thank you for your further e-mail of 13th January.
I have written to Pensions Minister Steve Webb on your behalf, highlighting the quote from the House of Commons Library brief to which you referred to in your earlier e-mail of 23rd December and asking whether he can confirm that the Government considered the view of the UK Statistics Authority.

I will, of course, let you know when I receive a response from Steve Webb. "

While it is only asking the question, I believe it is a step forwards. :j

Nice one, well done. If he comes back with a yes then the next thing to ask is for proof because the concensus of opinion is that they did not seek any advice from any professionals or the ONS.

Ripoff_2

JohnB47 wrote: »

I'm really annoyed that I missed the chance to pose a question on the Guardian interview - I got there too late.

So I replied to my MP instead. Here is the text:

Dear Hugo Swire,

I wrote you you recently about the Governments proposal to replace RPI with CPI as the uprating index for pensions. I have now received your reply, for which I thank you but I would like to ask a further
question.

While in opposition, George Osborne wrote in the Conservative document ‘An Unfair Britain’ -

“Pensioner inflation is now considerably higher than CPI inflation
because pensioners spend a much higher percentage of their income on high-inflation goods, like heating, light, and food.”

He then quoted figures from the Office for National Statistics website which showed that pensioner inflation in 2008 was greater even than the RPI measure.

Yet, in your letter, you say:

“…. The Government believes the CPI provides a more appropriate measure of pension recipients' inflation experiences and is also consistentwith the measure of inflation used by the Bank of England. The CPI uses a methodology that takes better account of consumer behaviour in response to price increases....... CPI is a more appropriate measure of changes in the cost of living of pensioners and benefit recipients than RPI.”

Can you please tell me why the Governments position is now exactly the opposite of that held by the Conservative party, your coalition
partners, while in opposition? The pattern of pensioners spending can't have changed significantly, nor can the way CPI is used to measure inflation.

The only conclusion to be drawn is that this is simply a stealth tax on pensioners, who have for years paid into their respective schemes in the expectation that payments would increase according to the September RPI figure. I understand that the September CPI figure has always, apart from two instances, been lower than RPI and I think that it is disgraceful for any political party to reduce a pensioners income like this. Many people in receipt of their occupational pension are no longer in a position to do anything that would make up the shortfall that would result from this proposed change. It is simply not fair.

Why anyone would start a pension plan when they see Governments doing this sort of thing is beyond me.

I would be grateful for a response.

Yours sincerely,

Right on the nail, they are trying to justify the unjustifiable and they know it.

RPI up again to 4.8% but CPI lagging behind at 3.7% how can they justify CPI as a better measure of pensioner inflation when they know that CPI has a built in flaw of between 0.4% to 1% between the two measures, because of the formula effect and the missing housing costs (Council Tax).

The variance due to the formula effect will always be there and thus 99.9% of the time RPI will be more than CPI and they know it. It's a CON TRICK and they know that as well.