Whipped them all soundly, and sent them to bed. A nation of child haters.

SingleSue

ceridwen wrote: »

I also agree that children need to be taught (from an early age) to behave properly in public. It may be that even the best-behaved children occasionally decide to "throw a screaming fit" in public - well, in that case, its up to the parent to take them out of any shop/other building they are in at the time and not take them back in again until they have calmed down. It is not fair on other people to have to put up with a child literally screaming near their ears - some of them scream so loudly that it is very upsetting to anyone unfortunate enough to be next to them. No - it really doesnt make the person who is getting upset by a child screaming near them feel any better at all to see the parent feebly going "shush, shush" or the like to a child (we know they dont really mean it..the child knows they dont mean it). If they really meant it they would tell the child "Stop screaming NOW - or I'm taking you out of the building" and proceed to do so if the children didnt shut up instantly. Having experienced so many children being allowed to scream near me now I just think "Two can play at that game - ie bad manners" and openly put my fingers in my ears to try and block out the noise, whilst looking straight at the parent concerned or ask them to take the child out. A parent that does not have the manners to make sure their child acts with manners as well is bringing them up to be a selfish spoilt individual.

As for parents who actively teach their child to ride a bike along pedestrian only pavements - words fail me...

If you have an autistic child, to take that child out of the shop when he/she decides to have a tantrum, is playing into their hands.....they WANT to get out of the shop and that is why they are creating, so you have to approach it slightly differently.

To put it another way, it is the same scenario as a child having a tantrum because they want a sweet, if you give in and let them have it, they shut up but become spoilt and have learnt they just need to create enough, so the autistic child, will know that if they find something uncomfortable, all they need to do is scream, shout enough and they will get what they want....to get out of the situation, for their long term future and ability to cope in the mainstream world, it is advisable to almost force them into having to deal with the uncomfortable times.

I perfected the art of walking serenely around a shop whilst youngest or middle were having meltdowns but it has had the effect that they can now go shopping (quietly I hasten to add!), they can cope going out for meals and they can cope in cinemas, as I taught them coping mechanisms (when youngest was younger, it was maths questions to divert his brain) rather than giving in to them and taking them out of where ever we were.

Percy1983

I must admit that I do see some situations and think 'My children wouldn't get away with that', with that I do remember when there was a kid in a supermarket screaming with the mum doing the 'please stop' thing, I shouted at the kid 'stop it' and guess what... the kid stoped (and looked a little shocked). I will add I am not scary looking generally.

On the flip side I remember in my younger days on my way to work on the bus that a young boy sitting opposite asked about my tie I was wearing (it was covered in disney characters), before I could say a word his mum stopped him 'don't disturb the nice man', to which I thought it was a shame as he was perfectly polite in his asking, as it is we had a chat to and my horror he didn't know who chip & dale rescue rangers were!!!

Now to me the boy was polite and I wasn't doing anything so why not talk? should we be saying never talk to other people, I don't completely disagree with don't talk to strangers, but all friends where stangers at some point.

Orpheo

toby3000 wrote: »

I think the OP proves exactly WHY those of us with no interest in children find parents and their offspring so annoying.

We don't care about your parenting. We don't care about your children. What they have done is of zero interest to me. I will never find your daughter interesting or worthwhile to talk to.

I have no problem with your desire to not have children, but leave our kids alone. There's no need to be a hater. Is there anything you do care about?

I certainly hope that you have taken up a life of celibacy, it's the only way to be sure.

toby3000 wrote: »

I don't care that 'all children have tantrums'. If your child isn't able to behave in public then don't bring it to the shops where I will have to listen to it and dodge it and its mother with its massive buggy. I don't wish to watch you breast-feed when I'm drinking my coffee. I don't want to hear it screaming on my bus ride home. Until children are suitably socialised they shouldn't be inflicted on the rest of us in shops/restaurants/pubs/public transport.

Aside from the obvious places, parents are entitled to take their children to wherever they like. How do you imagine children to be 'suitably socialised' without being exposed to the situations you suggest? Think things through.

If you don't want to see a breast-feeding mother, get out. If you don't want to listen, go somewhere else.

Long_tall_sally

Generali wrote: »

How do you propose that children become 'socialised' if they aren't allowed to be in social situations?

FWIW, I think the attitude to children in the UK stinks. My kids are very well behaved* but they are kids and will do what kids do and that includes having tantrums.





*Due to Mrs Generali's excellence, I do not take credit for anything other than doing what I'm told by her. She is regularly complimented by strangers for their good behaviour.

I completely agree. Children will not be able to behave "perfectly" in say a shop or restaurant if they have not been giving regular opportunity to practise. What is a parent supposed to do if they "risk" taking their child to a public place as a toddler and they misbehave and a telling off doesn't work - never take them anywhere again until they are an adult?

I think its just as well that a lot of you don't want children. I would feel very sorry for any children that you did have with your appaling, intolerant attitude. This world is not owned by childless adults & kids have as much right to be in it as you, even if they, god forbid, behave like kids!

Sapphire

nomoreboomandbust wrote: »

I hope you are CRB approved :eek: . Seriously though, Britain has a reputation for considering kids to be a "pain" shall we say (hating is too strong a word I think) it's a case of children must be seen but not heard.

How many times do we hear the words "they love children in Spain, Italy, Portugal, etc ", but you won't hear people say the same about Britain, maybe it's the rose tinted spectacles when people travel aboard.

Children of people abroad are generally much better behaved than those of Brits, probably because they have discipline and rules set in their lives, which incidentally help them to become disciplined and polite adults. In Latin countries, children often eat with their parents late into the night, and it's a pleasure to have them around because of their polite behaviour. From what I can see, many Brits allow their children to run riot, which is unfair both to them and to the people around them who have to tolerate this.

I also cannot abide screaming kids when I'm trying to have a meal or commuting – under such circumstances, parents should have consideration for others. (My cousin related to me how she witnessed a woman changing the nappy of a child in a pub garden, which my cousin had to leave after expressing her disgust. That sort of behaviour by parents is completely inexcusable.)

I don't give a toss what parents do with their children in their own homes, but do object to having them thrust on me when I do not desire this.

ILW

Orpheo wrote: »

I have no problem with your desire to not have children, but leave our kids alone. There's no need to be a hater. Is there anything you do care about?

I certainly hope that you have taken up a life of celibacy, it's the only way to be sure.



Aside from the obvious places, parents are entitled to take their children to wherever they like. How do you imagine children to be 'suitably socialised' without being exposed to the situations you suggest? Think things through.

If you don't want to see a breast-feeding mother, get out. If you don't want to listen, go somewhere else.

Sorry, but if I am paying a lot of money to have a meal in a restaurant, I do not want it disturbed by a couple of children whos parents seem to think it is OK for them to run up and down screaming at each other. I have on one occasion told the manager of a half decent place that I wished to cancel my order and leave if it continued.
I do have children (now grown up) and if they decided to play up in an innapropriate place I would either leave or take them outside to calm down. To me that is just common courtesy.

Orpheo

Sapphire wrote: »

Children of people abroad are generally much better behaved than those of Brits, probably because they have discipline and rules set in their lives, which incidentally help them to become disciplined and polite adults. In Latin countries, children often eat with their parents late into the night, and it's a pleasure to have them around because of their polite behaviour. From what I can see, many Brits allow their children to run riot, which is unfair both to them and to the people around them who have to tolerate this.

I also cannot abide screaming kids when I'm trying to have a meal or commuting – under such circumstances, parents should have consideration for others. (My cousin related to me how she witnessed a woman changing the nappy of a child in a pub garden, which my cousin had to leave after expressing her disgust. That sort of behaviour by parents is completely inexcusable.)

I don't give a toss what parents do with their children in their own homes, but do object to having them thrust on me when I do not desire this.

Everything you write here makes sense. Bad behaviour by children in publich should be dealt with by their parents. I was just thinking about the eating as a family thing and it has always been something that I consider to be important. Eating together, at the table at the end of the day is a forum to be a family and talk about the day; breaking bread together is your celebration of your work done as a family.

I tend to agree that if your child is acting out at a restaurant then it is reasonable for the parent to take them outside, provided, as SingleSue points out, that you are not giving in to their demands. If you give in to their demands then you are rewarding their bad behaviour. You should care about how parents are dealing with their children's behaviour at home because this is the same behaviour that they are bringing out of the home.

Generali

ILW wrote: »

Sorry, but if I am paying a lot of money to have a meal in a restaurant, I do not want it disturbed by a couple of children whos parents seem to think it is OK for them to run up and down screaming at each other. I have on one occasion told the manager of a half decent place that I wished to cancel my order and leave if it continued.
I do have children (now grown up) and if they decided to play up in an innapropriate place I would either leave or take them outside to calm down. To me that is just common courtesy.

Kids shouldn't be running up and down in a restaurant, you are right.

However it is important not to react to tantrums as if you do you just get more of them. A parent that is ignoring a child's tantrum is doing the world a favour. It's called 'soggy chip syndrome'.

Orpheo

ILW wrote: »

Sorry, but if I am paying a lot of money to have a meal in a restaurant, I do not want it disturbed by a couple of children whos parents seem to think it is OK for them to run up and down screaming at each other. I have on one occasion told the manager of a half decent place that I wished to cancel my order and leave if it continued.
I do have children (now grown up) and if they decided to play up in an innapropriate place I would either leave or take them outside to calm down. To me that is just common courtesy.

I don't dispute this. Of course context matters. It is right for you to cancel and leave a restaurant if you are unhappy with anything, including the bad behaviour of other people's children. It is then the restaurant manager's responsibility to determine which are his/hers most favoured customers and which is the most profitable policy.

Bad behaviour should be dealt with. Were I the restaurant manager I certainly would not tolerate the specific behaviour you describe, there is hot food being transported and their behaviour is a hazard.

ILW

Generali wrote: »

Kids shouldn't be running up and down in a restaurant, you are right.

However it is important not to react to tantrums as if you do you just get more of them. A parent that is ignoring a child's tantrum is doing the world a favour. It's called 'soggy chip syndrome'.

Not if they are sat at the table next to me and I am paying £100 or so for a meal for two.
If I want to hear screaming kids I will go to McDs or Pizza hut.