Orange contract - debt collection

Mungen

Hi everybody, I heard this is a good site for advice so i thought i'd sign up and ask hopefully someone can help me :beer:

Me and my girlfriend went to Phones4u to look around for phones, and after alot of pressure from the sales-staff before we knew it , we was signing up for a phone! I know you can say well... they didn't force you but to be honest they pretty much did, i felt i had no choice but sign it, It's my first time ever having a contract i've always been pay-as-you-go.

We sat down at the table and they put me through a credit check- And surprise .... I failed the check.. so we decided we'll leave but they kept pressuring and pressuring for my girlfriend to sign it up, and she to transfer it to me after 2 weeks, so i wasn't keen on the idea, but after they offered us £100 cash in advance to do it! poor people that we are... couldn't resist the temptation from the devil, so they did her credit check, and it passed. she signed up with the assurance from them it can be transfered to me after a short while.

All was good-and well. but after walking out of the shop, straight away i had a bad feeling and knew it was a very bad idea, after anaylsing it at home for a week, and not long falling out of work (and my girlfriend only works 7 hours a week) I decided we can't afford the £49 first month charge and £35 thereafter, so i phoned up orange and asked them about cancelling (and returning the phone we got with the contract) as soon as i mentioned it, the phone cut dead...they hung up on me! So i rang them again and this time it took half an hour to reach customer service, they said You can't cancel untill 6months, so i explained to them that phones4u said we can within 2 weeks if we arent happy with it, they said we need to take it up with Phones4u...

Right.....So we travelled back to phones4u, and the guy who served us, looked like he seen a ghost, he just clearly knew that i wasnt the first person to realise i got suckered into a scam, and probably knew what i was about to say. So i explained to him i wish to cancel the contract and return the phone (and I'd be willing to pay a small cancelling fee if needed say up to £100 ) and he just grinned and laughed and said, you can't, i said what you meen i can't, you said i could within 2 weeks, and he started stuttering and said you need to take it up with orange. I said they refered me to you, they said well i don't know why, it's nothing to do with us, you need to take it up with orange. they wanted me out of the shop fast, because i was scarying customers away, so i said fine, ok.

So i left. next day on a cool head, i rang orange, explained it all, explained what phones4u said, they insisted its nothing to do with them, so i insisted that it IS something to do with them, so the guy on the phone said please hold (20minutes later) i got put through to someone totally differnt who barely could speak english , i explained it all, she put me through to someone else, while it was on hold, guess what, the phone went dead, they hung up again.

Don't get me wrong but i am getting immensly angry at this point and want to strangle somebody!

So i waited a couple hours, tried again, No luck, same thing was happening over and over.

i phoned phones4u this time trying to explain it to them, but they told me the same jargon that orange are telling me, both are denying that its got anything to do with them.

it felt like they are fobbing me off till the 2weeks are over! so i 'legally' am stuck.

i kept trying daily to resolve it with them, i wasn't trying to scam them, or anything i was willing to pay cancelling fee, (reasonable fee obviously) and return the phone - i never even used a text or minute on the contract phone!

So weeks passed, i said !!!!!! it they wont listen. debt collection rang me (morecroft i believe) and they demanded to speak to my girlfriend- i said im taking responsability for this , because it was mine, they put it in her name to transfer it a couple weeks later just to get the contract, so they insisted, so .. i told emma, (who is only 18, im 21, and shes very shy and scared of going to jail over this) i told her to "give me permission to speak on her behalf" so she said that, and they had no choice but talk to me, The gentleman..or should i say, the nasty man on the phone was trying to bully me on the phone, he said i need your credit or debit card details right NOW and we will take £850 off, and your debt will be resolved. i nearly choked, and laughed at the same time, i said are you kidding? i dont even have 100 let alone 850!

he was being arrogant and said its not his problem, its my "silly" fault for legally getting emma into a contract - "its not YOU who can face LEGAL action here, its EMMA" (my girlfriend ) he said,

i told him to calm down and stop raising his voice to me, so after talking for half an hour on the phone he was adamant i must pay 850 right now, i said to him, thats great to know but im telling YOU i dont have 850! so i explained we're willing to return the phone and cancel fee, he said, well thats just stupid YOU signed the agreement, we dont want your phone we want the money, and the only cancellation fee we're willing to accept is above half the ammount (around 500) i laughed again. i told him you just dont understand do you? I HAVE.NO MONEY.!

He kept getting more irate- and flustered at me, so i said to him, LOOK why are you even bothered? you're working for a multi million pound company, it doesnt affect you PERSONALLY so stop getting angry, and he said "im just doing my job"! i said yeah i respect that, but stop acting like its your money i personally owe money too.

So he eventually calmed down, still...threatening me with boysterous tactics that debt collection ' wouldnt want to end up on your doorstep' then ' serious legal action in court for your girlfriend' i said look, take me to court if you like because ill explain it all to the court and im sure they'll see my point here, im willing to pay a 100pound cancel fee, or even £10 a month repayments, he ... no joke nearly screamed at me down the phone because he wasnt getting his own way, but neither was i, we was getting nowhere except go in circles, so i told him.. look, I'm going to get in touch with citizens advice, and other aids, to see what my legal rights are, and where i stand because your bully tactics are really starting to irritate me, ' he stuttered and chuckled fine, if you want to request legal aid thats fine, we' will hold your account for 2weeks and after that...welll.. lets just see what you do for now. (undertone threat)

So the call ended.

Im really stuck here and have no idea what to do, so hopefully one of you experts here can help me out here. why should we pay 24months in advance on a contract we've never even used? ! i know we signed it.. under pressure..we're binded, but its a one off thing, and didnt expect all this to happen.

I want to resolve it rather than ignore it because my girlfriend is thinking shes gonna go to jail ..which i dont think she can?

Thanks to anyone who can help me, and sorry for the massive post, i just am in desperate need here so wanted to get the whole story across..

Cheers. Mungen

PNPSUKNET

You need to setup a payment plan, although I would complain to orange about their call centre as I have x3 with them and never once been spoken to like rubish or phone put down.

Mungen

Hi thanks for the reply, I offered them a repayment of £10 a month and he told me not to be stupid, and i pushed it to £20 a month and he also said that i need to be realistic and theres 'no way' there gonna accept that.

FTW

PNPSUKNET wrote: »

You need to setup a payment plan, although I would complain to orange about their call centre as I have x3 with them and never once been spoken to like rubish or phone put down.

Ignore Moorcroft. Pay no mind to them or anything they say - they're powerless, and nobody will be going to jail. Offer them nothing and try to resolve with Orange directly, but do in writing.

If you've been mis-sold or mis-advised, and you have proof of this (that you've made effort to cancel before the cooling off period), then send a formal written complaint to Orange (if you haven't already done so).

Even if they took you to court, which is doubtful, they'd look pretty stupid if the phone hasn't even been used.

I'd also be inclined to contact the OFT and the Financial Ombudsman Service regarding Moorcroft (and Orange, since they instigated Moorcroft), using the details you've specified in your thread.

But from now on, do NOT use phone communication - keep it in writing only. If they call you, refuse to discuss and keep repeating 'Only in Writing'.

FTW

I would also contact your local Trading Standards office about all of this as well.

Mungen

we never borrowed any money and there is no way they will make us pay £800 for something we havent even used, this is why we are needing help

FTW

Mungen wrote: »

we never borrowed any money and there is no way they will make us pay £800 for something we havent even used, this is why we are needing help

I'm agreeing with you, which is why I've stated you should consider the options I've outlined.

welwyn

I had 10 letters from Moorcroft over a 6 month period and also a phone call. This was over a supposed debt with Orange over a mobile contract, which although I cancelled the contract a month before by e-mail and by postal letter they claim that I owe them £60 for two months "airtime". I disputed this with Orange and they handed the debt over to Moorcroft. I pleaded with Moorcroft to take me to court but instead they handed the debt over to another company called DLC. Now it's all starting again with the threats of court action etc. etc. But this time I am not answering letters or phone calls. Can I sue for harrasment?

BigCraigJohn

I don't think phones4u are blameless here either. Seems they will say anything to get you to agree to something.
My brother was in town last week after an iPhone 4. They were offering the phone for £40 below anyone else and said they would give a free cover.
We mentioned this is a few network shops trying to get them to match, vodaphone said that apple put the prices in place and they are not allowed to lower the prices strictly. He said that if they got found to be doing this by apple they would probably be banned from selling them.

Maybe a nice letter addressed do someone high up at orange and phones4u explaining your issue and how you were miss led by phones4u and are now being felt to feel like a criminal, say you are willing to give them the phone back in exchange for the account to be wiped.

Mungen

Thanks for the advice FTW i will do as you said and tell them im only willing to communicate in letter, i have a feeling this wont disuade them from the phone calls and bully tactics though,

And yes bigcraigjohn i googled phones4u and ive seen an immense ammount of people complaining about feeling forced into signing, im not sure if it would stand up much in court however, if they did take me to court id gladly tell them it all, i dont fear the court its the girlfriend that does.

FANut

If I were you I would find out the name and address of the Chief Executive of Orange and write directly to him or her. Their office will be obliged to deal personally with your problem and you will get much better results than going through the company complaints system. I did this earlier in the year over a dispute with BT and not only got the problem solved but also £120 in compensation.