Early-retirement wannabe

gadgetmind

I'm firmly in the Remain camp but don't think more arguing the toss is the way to go.

I actually think the process is now essential and will be a positive step for the EU. Once other EU member states see the damage that Brexit will do to our currency, our economy, and our international reputation, plus the rise in open and deeply-unpleasant racism and the rise of the far right that it is already causing, then they will understand why they need the EU.

Of course, we'll still be deeply screwed, but I think that fate is inevitable and unavoidable.

Personally I'm pretty isolated from sterling and the UK economy, and my employer uses US dollars as the currency on every contract we sign, but I'm not being complacent as these things can sneak up on you. My wife has already been warned that her local council job is under threat as many parks, houses and museums are reliant on EU funding.

gfplux

OldBeanz wrote: »

The Government in its election manifesto was elected to put the EU membership question to the people. The people have voted. I and any democrat would expect the Government to fulfil its mandate. Hopefully we can take forward the death of Jo Cox by having unity and not allow the non-democrats to win.

Exactly my thoughts.
Please note I voted STAY
However:-
Democracy is not "keep voting untll we get the right result"
The Politiciens have campaigned (lied more than usual)
The People have voted.
The People have spoken.

Invoke article 50 immediately and leave the EU ASAP.

Marine_life

I don't disagree with the rule of democracy - if the government is daft enough to put the issue to the vote then it has to be prepared to deal with consequences and implement a solution.

Ask yourself though what exactly does "leave the EU" mean?

- repeal all the EU laws that have been imposed? or just the ones we don't like?
- stop all migrants coming in? or just those migrants we determine are unsuitable (and who decides who is unsuitable)?
- stop paying all out contributions to the EU (and assume the government will immediately replace those pound for pound with British government money)?

My point is that there is a lot of detail to be worked through which will be in the hands of a new (unelected) prime minister and whether you voted remain or leave, I for one would like to see how the detail will be enacted.

Thrugelmir

Marine_life wrote: »

My point is that there is a lot of detail to be worked through which will be in the hands of a new (unelected) prime minister and whether you voted remain or leave, I for one would like to see how the detail will be enacted.

Early general election perhaps to obtain a mandate.

Marine_life

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Early general election perhaps to obtain a mandate.

In my view very likely.

The lib dems have already come out and said they would take the UK back into the EU http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/26/lib-dems-pledge-british-return-eu-next-general-election which could actually be a very shrewd move politically.

uk1

gfplux wrote: »

Invoke article 50 immediately and leave the EU ASAP.

The people have had their vote and we now have the results of this safely in the back pocket. There is no reason to invoke article 50 asap in fact I believe the opposite.

At the moment we have a highly charged EU wishing to punish us. We need to let them calm down and start behaving a bit more maturely. They want us to start the stop watch because theb alance of power is with the EU with respect to negotiations. They want to get this all out of the way before December 2018.

We need to let things calm down, appoint the best negotiating team we can under a new Conservative PM, and when we have a decent agreed mututally infromally agreed acceptable framework hit the two year stop watch. But only after we have an acceptable framework.

Whilst we delay we have a little power in our hands as this is unsettling the rest of the EU. Not triggering therefore, before we have a viable informal framework is an incentive for the EU to work sensibly with us. The moment we trigger there is no incentive.

Jeff

OldBeanz

Marine_life wrote: »

I don't disagree with the rule of democracy - if the government is daft enough to put the issue to the vote then it has to be prepared to deal with consequences and implement a solution.

Ask yourself though what exactly does "leave the EU" mean?

- repeal all the EU laws that have been imposed? or just the ones we don't like?
- stop all migrants coming in? or just those migrants we determine are unsuitable (and who decides who is unsuitable)?
- stop paying all out contributions to the EU (and assume the government will immediately replace those pound for pound with British government money)?

My point is that there is a lot of detail to be worked through which will be in the hands of a new (unelected) prime minister and whether you voted remain or leave, I for one would like to see how the detail will be enacted.

- repeal all the EU laws that have been imposed? or just the ones we don't like?

Our choice - I would not be happy with anything that has been "imposed" on us.
stop all migrants coming in? or just those migrants we determine are unsuitable (and who decides who is unsuitable)?
Our choice - points system is in place for those not in the EU already.
- stop paying all out contributions to the EU (and assume the government will immediately replace those pound for pound with British government money)?
We stop paying into the EU when we finally leave. Our choice how we spend our money thereafter and can elect/re-elect on the decisions they make.
My point is that there is a lot of detail to be worked through which will be in the hands of a new (unelected) prime minister and whether you voted remain or leave, I for one would like to see how the detail will be enacted.
I have never voted for a Prime Minister because I am not in either the Labour or Conservative party. We do not elect our Prime Minister we elect our MP.
Nobody knows how this will pan out as it has never been done before but Frau Merkel and Mr Hollande (both of whom are up for election next year) have been making soothing noises because it will benefit no-one if the change-over does not go smoothly.

gadgetmind

OldBeanz wrote: »

I for one would like to see how the detail will be enacted.

I'm going to take a guess at "badly".

OldBeanz

gadgetmind wrote: »

I'm going to take a guess at "badly".

That is not a quote from me but me quoting another poster and answering his concerns.

gadgetmind

Your odd commenting/quoting style left it very unclear what was what TBH.