Advice needed RE: family member giving false refs??

amarrah

Hello, I'm new here and looking for some advice, I hope someone can help me.

My sister recently asked me if she could use my name as a reference on a rented property she is interested in.

She was very forthright and upfront with me, admitting that she had got into some rent arrears (approx 2 months) at the start of her tenancy, and has just started paying her landlord back, albeit in small amounts.
Her landlord gave her notice to leave 3 months ago (she has to leave at the beginning of December) so she had plenty of notice, but the LL has said he will not be giving her a reference, and not to even ask.

She is working and in a better position financially now, than she was a few months ago, and I know she won't get into the same position again (she says so, and I know her well enough to know that she made a mistake that she isn't keen to repeat), so she just needs a 'break' to get back onto the rental property ladder, so to speak.

Apparently what she wants to do, is give my name as a reference at her current address and say she was previously renting the property from a family member (IE: me) to explain why we both have the same surname.

I know the moral 'don'ts' of this proposition, and tbh although I'm nto thrilled about lying, I would be willing to do it IF it would help my sister (and her child) get the house she needs and PROVIDED I won't be done for fraud! There is only so far I will go to help out a family member. :eek:

So my question is, what checks will both letting agents, and private lanbdlords do, on the landlord references my sister provides? I assume that letting agents will have more thorough checks than LL's advertising in the local newspaper, for example?
Do they check the land registry or something/is there a way of linking my name (as the 'landlord' to the property she is curently living in, or will they just credit check me (I have good credit, so will pass checks).

Please, helpful advice only if possible, please don't judge me and say that I am inflicting a 'nightmare tenant' on an unsuspecting landlord; I wouldn't agree to this unless I KNEW 100% that she would not get into arrears again - she said to me, she wants to have more than one christmas in a house, so I know she is serious.

Apologies for the long post, I will appreciate any advice.

MobileSaver

amarrah wrote: »

I wouldn't agree to this unless I KNEW 100% that she would not get into arrears again - she said to me, she wants to have more than one christmas in a house, so I know she is serious.

Obviously totally wrong of you to lie and I suspect if she gets behind with her rent again and the LL starts looking into the reference/history then you run the risk of being prosecuted for fraud.

Fraud: Any act of deception carried out for the purpose of unfair, undeserved and/or unlawful gain;

However as you know 100% she will not get into arrears again then don't make false claims on a reference but instead offer to be her guarantor.

BitterAndTwisted

As checking with the Land Registry only costs £4 I wouldn't be entirely surprised that any prospective LL or agent would check this information once they know that you're a family member.

Don't forget that most scams which an ordinary person could think of as a fantastically clever stunt, most decent and experienced landlords or agents will have encountered before.

If you really do want to help your sister, please recommend that she is completely honest about her circumstances. They do not necessarily preclude her from being able to rent a property but being found out telling lies and ensnaring family members to support her in her dishonestly most certainly will

Jowo_2

Your sister can offer a guarantor or pay more rent upfront to offset the fact that she is an unreliable tenant who cannot manage her money and fails to prioritise her rent. These are the solutions open to those with poor credit records and previous landlord issues.

If the tenant screening checks undertaken on her are very thorough, the landlord or agent may either detect her actual concealed address or fail to associate her with her fictional address and therefore her score for her reference could be lowered through that. Address verification is undertaken in a comprehensive search.

http://www.tenantverify.co.uk/comprehensive.htm

Grow a pair and push back - her problems are not yours. Be as forthright and pushy to her as she is to you. Presumably she's used to being manipulative and persuading people to do her dirty work.

You are not in the position to know whether she will inflict further misery on landlords. If you are that certain, you can offer to be her guarantor and therefore be fully confident that you won't be billed by landlords for her deliquent approach to paying the rent.

amarrah

Thank you all for your advice - I did forget to mention that she is offering the letting agents/landlords 2 months' rent in advance (in other words, the usual months' rent and deposit, plus a further month's rent) - but a lot of the agencies she has tried (so she says) have said that this isn't enough; and either a guarantor, or landlord references will still be required.

I would offer to be her guarantor in a heartbeat but am not a homeowner, so I can't do it. We don't have any other family and I doubt anyone outside the family would agree to do it.

The fact she has saved up the extra months' rent (and she says if she can raise another month's rent by the time she is due to move out, she will add that as well) makes me feel assured that she IS being genuine, and just needs a break as I stated before - if she hadn't shown me her savings account balance (with the advance rent in there) then I wouldn't have even entertained the idea.

BitterAndTwisted

If you think that being a guarantor is a risk too far for you (and not being a homeowner doesn't preclude you from being one, you just need to have the funds available should they be required) then imagine what a risk it would be for a landlord: an asset worth tens or even hundreds of thousands of pounds at your sister's disposal. If you have that much confidence in her ability to be responsible for future rent when the past has proven that she hasn't been, why not offer to loan her the six month's rent in advance she might need in the absence of a guarantor?

Jowo_2

amarrah wrote: »

..
The fact she has saved up the extra months' rent (and she says if she can raise another month's rent by the time she is due to move out, she will add that as well) makes me feel assured that she IS being genuine, and just needs a break as I stated before - if she hadn't shown me her savings account balance (with the advance rent in there) then I wouldn't have even entertained the idea.

Doesn't warm my cockles - she appears to be paying off her existing arrears at a snails pace in order to get this money together. Perhaps she should move in with a family member and concentrate on paying off her debts and raising another 5 months rent so she can offer 6 months rent upfront to the next landlord?

This sounds much more logical and fair than you lying for your sister.

DVardysShadow

amarrah wrote: »

Apparently what she wants to do, is give my name as a reference at her current address and say she was previously renting the property from a family member (IE: me) to explain why we both have the same surname.

I know the moral 'don'ts' of this proposition, and tbh although I'm nto thrilled about lying, I would be willing to do it IF it would help my sister (and her child) get the house she needs and PROVIDED I won't be done for fraud!

This is so blindingly easy to resolve. If the reference does not match the truth, try again and make the truth match the reference.

You put her up for 6 months and then give the reference exactly as she requests. It is all true and above board, no fraud or lying.

BitterAndTwisted

Jowo wrote: »

Doesn't warm my cockles - she appears to be paying off her existing arrears at a snails pace in order to get this money together.

Good point, Jowo. I also notice that she got into arrears at the very beginning of this tenancy and wonder how long it's been taking her to pay them off.

It sounds like this sister should be either moving in with family as you suggested or finding herself a flat or house-share

amarrah

Not that I'm making excuses for her...but this is her only option - either that, or stay in her current property until the LL evicts her (not ideal), OR go the the council as homeless - however she phoned them from my house (so I heard the conversation as she put it on speakerphone) and they said that as she has the funds to be able to raise enough for a deposit, they would help her but not as quickly as if she had no money. Basically, she stays in a hostel which I don't want for my toddler nephew.

She has only recently started paying off the arrears, as she has only recently (in the last 4 months) started work - before that she was unemployed, so on less money. Also, toddlers tend to 'eat' money, as I know from experience (I have one myself). There's always something they need

I cannot put her up as I simply don't have the room (and I'm only renting myself and my LL wouldn't allow it; I've checked) as far as I know she has no friends (she only socialises with myself and my husband) and as for a house/flatshare; that isn't possible with a child.

Believe me, I've checked out every option I can think of myself, before posting on here to ask my question.

Oh and bitterandtwisted; I have spent the morning phoning every letting agent in the town (literally EVERY single one), asking if I could be guarantor despite not being a homeowner - I have a good job so that isn't a problem - and three quarters of them said no, I HAVE to be a homeowner and the others said that they wouldn't allow anyone who doesn't have landlord references, to rent from them.

BitterAndTwisted

So lend her the six month's rent in advance and be done with it. You're making it sounds like there's no other option than to be dishonest and risk being caught out perpetrating a fraud. That is not the case, and if there's any fraud to be perpetrated it shouldn't be you who is doing it, it should be your sister as she is the only one who might gain from it.

Have you offered any of these letting agents you've spoken to the six month's rent in advance option?