Funeral Expenses Update Of Information I received

Ladywriter1968

Thanks for all your other comments and help of my previous question about funeral expenses if the family are poor etc and cant pay.

A friend told me today that her friend was in the same situation and the council paid for her parents funeral, but then later the council send her the bill of over £3000 and she had to pay the money back to the council. Even though she went to them cause she could not afford in first place, as she was direct next of kin the bill went straight to her to pay.

So from the information I gather have gained. The council only right off the debt if they cant contact any family cause you cant get nothing out of nothing. But if there is family the council still hit them with the huge bill at the end of it, despite the families poor situation.

Any comments welcome on this. If you know about this sort of thing as well.

Queries

It may be worth contacting the CAB (Citizens Advice Bureau), who should be able to give you up-to-date facts. The very best of luck!

McKneff

Like you say, the Council cant bill someone who is dead and who has no estate but if they find family who CAN pay for the funeral then thats fair enough. If the family are in dire straights and CANT pay then thats fair enough too.

If they cant find any family then the council dont really have any choice but to pay for it.

Personally, I find that very sad, some of these people, witouth friends or family have no mourners at their funeral cept for the funeral directors and vicar.

Just because people say they cant afford to pay doesnt actually mean they cant afford to pay.
Anyone can say that, their finances would have been looked into before the bill wnt out.

Thats life............

Ladywriter1968

Queries wrote: »

It may be worth contacting the CAB (Citizens Advice Bureau), who should be able to give you up-to-date facts. The very best of luck!

did already, they didnt know nothing

Ladywriter1968

McKneff wrote: »

Like you say, the Council cant bill someone who is dead and who has no estate but if they find family who CAN pay for the funeral then thats fair enough. If the family are in dire straights and CANT pay then thats fair enough too.

If they cant find any family then the council dont really have any choice but to pay for it.

Personally, I find that very sad, some of these people, witouth friends or family have no mourners at their funeral cept for the funeral directors and vicar.

Just because people say they cant afford to pay doesnt actually mean they cant afford to pay.
Anyone can say that, their finances would have been looked into before the bill wnt out.

Thats life............

I know some people say they cant pay when they just dont want to and do have the money. But there are also those who just do not have that sort of money and are living on their means just to keep a roof over their heads, let alone find 3K for a funeral.

it is said that the person who died may have no one either. But quite frankly, if when me and hubby gets old and he goes first, I will have no one at mine as I have no siblings and not close to family as they treated me badly, some people are pretty mean even when they are related. When I say family, I mean cousins uncles etc. and my Mother died when I was a child. As for friends, its not really fair to expect your friends to pay for your funeral when they have their own families to worry about.

vaio

McKneff wrote: »

Like you say, the Council cant bill someone who is dead and who has no estate but if they find family who CAN pay for the funeral then thats fair enough. If the family are in dire straights and CANT pay then thats fair enough too……..

…..Just because people say they cant afford to pay doesnt actually mean they cant afford to pay.
Anyone can say that, their finances would have been looked into before the bill wnt out…...

You seem to be suggesting that councils have the power to force unwilling family members to pay for a funeral against their will.

I don’t suppose you have any idea under what rule/law they have this power because it sounds like nonsense to me

lisyloo

But there are also those who just do not have that sort of money and are living on their means just to keep a roof over their heads, let alone find 3K for a funeral.

Even if councils did have the power to make people pay (which I don't believe they do) then they will simply not be able to get the money from people that don't have it.
They will know this and would probably not bother going to court.

So if these people genuinely have no way to pay for it then they have absolutely nothing to fear.

You simply cannot get money from people that don't have it.
You can win a court case but you can't get money they don't have.

McKneff

vaio wrote: »

You seem to be suggesting that councils have the power to force unwilling family members to pay for a funeral against their will.

I don’t suppose you have any idea under what rule/law they have this power because it sounds like nonsense to me

I dont know of any links but 8 years ago my brother died who didnt have a p to p in, wife on benefits, asked to fill a form in for any siblings/parents who would pay for the funeral. This was in Newcastle, around 2002,

Liquorice_Twirls

I think I posted on your previous thread stating that I had worked for a Local Authority in the past arranging these sorts of funerals where there are no relatives around. As I mentioned then, the only charge from the Local Authority for the cost of the funeral they arrange is on any estate the deceased may have. But just so you can be absolutely clear about this here are some cut and pastes from Councils' websites:

Worthing Borough Council:
"When a person dies in hospital and there is nobody able or willing to arrange and pay for the funeral the Health Authority will fulfil this obligation. Similarly local authorities have a duty to arrange the burial or cremation of any person who has died in their area if no suitable arrangements have been made. The authority can reclaim any expenses incurred from the estate. If there is no estate a basic but dignified funeral can be arranged which may include burial in an unpurchased grave."

Bolton Council:
"If a person dies in a hospital and no one is prepared to arrange and pay for the funeral, the Health Authority will fulfil this obligation as will Local Authorities, if the person dies within their area. However, it must be clear that no suitable arrangements have been made or will be made for the disposal of the body and the Local Authority can reclaim expenses from any estate. If there is no estate, a basic funeral will be arranged which may include the use of an unpurchased grave."

Islington Council:
"Finally, when a person dies in hospital and there is nobody prepared to arrange and pay for the funeral, the Health Authority will fulfil this obligation. Similarly, local authorities have a duty to arrange the burial or cremation of any person who has died in their area. It must appear to the authority that no suitable arrangements for the disposal of the body have been or are being made otherwise than by the authority. The local authority can reclaim expenses from any estate. If there is no estate, a basic funeral will be arranged which
may include the use of an un-purchased grave."

Of course if the Local Authority make the arrangements you would not be able to make any requests as to where/how or when the funeral happened. The grave would be an unmarked one. You would of course be able to attend.

So perhaps your friend was expected to pay the bill out of the estate. If there was no estate she should have made this clear to the Local Authority.

lisyloo

a basic funeral will be arranged which
may include the use of an un-purchased grave

£4K wsa mentioned on another thread regarding the bill from the LA.

Sounds WAY too much for a basic funeral.
The minimum should be about £700

£4K is probably more usual but that would include a posh chaffeur driven car for family and food afterwards for everyone. This is not what is covered by the LA.
So I don't think that we are getting the full story here.

If someone has no money then they have nothing to fear.

I don't mean to suggest that LadyWriter is mis-represnting something. More that she hasn't been told the full story, which is often the case when someone has a financial problem.

It sounds like they have booked and arranged a lot more than the basic funeral and now can't pay.
If you book it and arrange it and sign forms then yes you are liable as with any event you arrange and sign contracts for.
I suspect these peple have got themselves into something they didn't realise and nowregret.
But £4K is not the bill for a basic funeral where no=one can pay.

It really is the minimum service, minimum coffin, minimum gravestone where there is no one to pay.

vaio

McKneff wrote: »

I dont know of any links but 8 years ago my brother died who didnt have a p to p in, wife on benefits, asked to fill a form in for any siblings/parents who would pay for the funeral. This was in Newcastle, around 2002,

Yep, people on benefits are entitled to assistance with the funeral costs unless there was someone else who is willing & able to pay for it.

They will try and get you or your siblings to pay for your brothers funeral, what I’m saying is they have no power to force you to do so.