First Direct - 3 serious complaints arising out of one maturing Regular Saver!!!

2sides2everystory

Your suggestion and recommendation are taken as a late night insult Andy. Are you known for such or should I take it personally?

I do so love apologists for our banks. They do so need your help, don't they? :T

masonic

2sides2everystory wrote: »

So I take it masonic, that you do see the problem, because you call it a problem, but then you immediately forgive it, because it is your wont so to do? Is that correct?

I'm more than happy to slag off a bank if it's not doing what it is supposed to be doing, but in this case it is doing exactly what it said it would do in its T&Cs. In this case, all I see is a customer that is being completely irrational and launching into some sort of temper tantrum over something they should have expected to happen. Of course I feel sorry for the bank.

Why would I be embarassed? I have missed nothing. The Regular Saving account was still open when I logged in online on 7/10/2010 and if you read my complaints you would see that the painfully slow-grinding conversion process at "maturity" was expected to take more days. So I would be interested to know (since this conversion malarkey gives s0d all benefit to us punters) (a) why FD and other banks think it is necessary, and (b) why it takes 5 working days when their computers are capable of making it instantaneous, and (c) how exactly they account for the balances and interest during those 5 days if the old account is accounted online as having a balance 4 days after it is supposed to have "closed" if you are right, and the new account is set up retrospectively. I can imagine all kinds of creative accounts could be made internally from such. Of course contrary to what you seem to be saying you would expect, masonic, the account number remains the same. Why else would you say so condescendingly:Might the answer be that it is the same account? And incidentally it was always instant access.

So you believe you still have a Regular Saver account, contrary to the T&Cs that you read stating that it would not remain a regular saver at anniversary. You did read them, didn't you? If it really was still a regular saver, then your attempt to access the money would have triggered the rate to drop retrospectively, but that was also covered in the T&Cs of the account.

As far as I can see, you are the one being condescending and obtuse. Some people have tried to help you with your supposed plight, but you just seem intent on ranting and raving, ignoring any plausible explanation and launching into a tirade against any poster who dares challange your topsy-turvy way of looking at things. Again, how could I not feel sorry for the bank.

Let me be plain - Printing a headline that says Credit Interest 5% on a statement issued on a date when interest has already dropped to 0.25% is a deception. How do you like that assertion? Do you disagree or do you wish to continue to split hairs / dates / accounts?

Either it is not the same account, which is what is supposed to happen according to the T&Cs, or you've just blown an extra few days interest at 5% by accessing the money. More fool you.

Let me tell you what would have been useful: (I recommend it to First Direct - perhaps you might pass it on for me):

1. The NET INTEREST transaction details could have said NET INTEREST TO 02OCT2010 @ 4% (WAS 5% GROSS)
2. The headline on the second page if it needed to be there at all could have said CREDIT INTEREST AER 5% GROSS VARIABLE TO 02OCT2010 NOW REDUCED TO 0.25% PENDING CONVERSION TO EVERYDAY E-SAVER OR SAVINGS ACCOUNT
3. Better still they could make the conversion instantaneous with the issue of the statement and change the word PENDING to UPON.

Now is that not common sense, or is that more childishness in your book?

I completely agree with you. Why not include that information, or at least say account closed, transfer to xxx savings account. That would be helpful, but hardly worth ranting and raving about when it doesn't happen. Sadly, I can't pass that on for you. I would never work for a bank. Having to deal with customers like you would be just too trying on my patience.

opinions4u

2sides2everystory wrote: »

Your suggestion and recommendation are taken as a late night insult Andy. Are you known for such or should I take it personally?

I do so love apologists for our banks. They do so need your help, don't they?

Please can you name me in the reply to a post.

I so want to see my username in bold print. It will excite me greatly.

(By the way, it does look to me like they printed the right rate on a statement for a specific point in time and you've got a little bit over-emotional about things, but I haven't read every post in the thread in any depth, so it's possible I have things wrong).

Andystriker

opinions4u wrote: »

I haven't read every post in the thread in any depth, so it's possible I have things wrong).

No you have things right

LongTermLurker

2sides2everystory wrote: »

The start date was 3/10/2010. The maturity date was I guess midnight on 2/10/2010, because I have thus far received no interest for 3/10/2010 or later. The £77.79 amount was shown as NET INTEREST TO 02OCT2010 and I have no dispute with it.

The statement was headed 3 October 2009 to 3 October 2010.

The last thing heading on the statement was "Credit Interest 5%". By 3/10/2010 it wasn't, it was 0.25%. No mention of that.

It is not what this thread is about but regarding your paragraph about interest: let me just point out that it isn't very accurate. Probably worth an A* at GCSE thesedays, but inaccurate. Nothing is pro-rata about the way compound interest is calculated.

Even if you aimed to be rude, you failed. I know what you might mean about the head-banging feeling.

You really are getting wound up and spitting feathers aren't you? By pro-rata, I mean that for the last month you get 1/12 the annual rate. Interest will have been calculated daily, so maybe you only actually deposited the money for, say, 25/30 days, so not even 1/12 of 5%.

It is a end of year statement - it states what you got at the end of the year, not the start of next year. If you left your money where it was, next October, you would see the rate you'd earned this year.

Why do you feel the need to try and belittle me (or anyone else) by suggesting I have the intelligence of a 15 year old, which you then go on to belittle by suggesting that the most intelligent 15 year olds today aren't as well tested as they were in your day.

People on here are being reasonable, but you're just spitting retorts back at them (funnily enough, just like many a 15 year old!)

LongTermLurker

I am not sure what Longterm Lurker was trying to say because clearly he/she was off topic and was on some kind of pro-rata trip.

I wasn't on a trip, but you appear to be on drugs for sure (there, now I'm being rude...) I was pointing out that 5% per annum is not the same as "5% per part annum" - interest earned pro-rata to the length of time deposited. But you clearly didn't get that.

btw, I'm a "he".


And a big "HELLO" to opinions4u :wave: - welcome to the madhouse

2sides2everystory

By pro-rata, I mean that for the last month you get 1/12 the annual rate.

I know what you mean but you are not strictly correct. It is a fair approximation to use 'pro-rata' calculations for low rates of interest but this thread is not a complaint about the contracted rate of interest in the first 12 months at all.

It is a end of year statement - it states what you got at the end of the year, not the start of next year. If you left your money where it was, next October, you would see the rate you'd earned this year.

Yes, apparently so, but how is a punter to know that without first clueing up himself/herself to the extent that the data on the second page of the statement is of no additional use to him or her anyway? First Direct are NOT following any kind of standard banking rule by showing it like they have. By showing it the unqualified way that they have, they are deceiving people.

And masonic, I never said I had a plight. It is First Direct who have the plight because I promised to be on their tail for 48 hours did I not? You again are splitting hairs on what I quite rightly call "the same account". It may have different terms and descriptors as of some time on 3/10/2010 but it is the same account. A bank account is first and foremost defined by its account number. There would have been no transfer" to a new account. It is indeed just a change of a First Direct banking product code. The account is at no point closed so to assert that the 5% on the statement could only be taken for the period past and not the forthcoming period is not to exercise any basic logic, but just to exercise a biased viewpoint.

And for you banking apologists generally, you all are conveniently ignoring the other two complaints - that I telephoned First Direct a year and four days after I opened this account, and if I had taken their word for it I'd have lost at least another weekend's worth of interest in my preferred destination account whilst I let them complete their arbitrary 5 working day long "maturity process."

LongTermLurker

ok........

masonic

2sides2everystory wrote: »

And masonic, I never said I had a plight. It is First Direct who have the plight because I promised to be on their tail for 48 hours did I not? You again are splitting hairs on what I quite rightly call "the same account". It may have different terms and descriptors as of some time on 3/10/2010 but it is the same account. A bank account is first and foremost defined by its account number. There would have been no transfer" to a new account. It is indeed just a change of a First Direct banking product code. The account is at no point closed so to assert that the 5% on the statement could only be taken for the period past and not the forthcoming period is not to exercise any basic logic, but just to exercise a biased viewpoint.

:rotfl:The T&Cs of the account clearly state what happens to the account at anniversary. When you opened the account, you would have received a letter (as I did) that clearly stated what happens to the account at anniversary. You can try to argue your way out of it with whatever "evidence" want to bring to the fore, but the fact remains that everything that has happened with regard to the interest rate is consistent with the account maturing into a simple instant access account paying a feeble rate, just as the T&Cs and welcome letter told you it would. There are dozens of regular saver and fixed rate accounts out there that work just like this and this is the first time I'm aware of anyone feeling misled as to what has happened to their interest rate.

And for you banking apologists generally, you all are conveniently ignoring the other two complaints - that I telephoned First Direct a year and four days after I opened this account, and if I had taken their word for it I'd have lost at least another weekend's worth of interest in my preferred destination account whilst I let them complete their arbitrary 5 working day long "maturity process."

I'm not conveniently ignoring them. It's good to know that with a little persistance I will be able to get my money transferred by faster payment by phoning FD when my own Regular Saver matures, so thanks for that.

2sides2everystory

masonic wrote: »

There are dozens of regular saver and fixed rate accounts out there that work just like this and this is the first time I'm aware of anyone feeling misled as to what has happened to their interest rate.

Yes, but they are all different in their way and one difference is that if, like the majority of accountholders, your life is short enough without wading through whatever banking gobbledegook and small print drops through the letter box, and thus you are blissfully ignorant of exactly how the account works (i.e. not like all of us who have posted in this thread) then receiving that final piece of paper with a final word in bold print that says Credit Interest 5% might easily wrongfoot you into leaving the balance where it is. That situation should be fixed - not for you and me - but for those who got persuaded into buying the product by the headline rate of 5% and have never understood what more they should take note of. That's all.

It's good to know that with a little persistance I will be able to get my money transferred by faster payment by phoning FD when my own Regular Saver matures, so thanks for that.

Glad to have cleared that one up then

Time's up. Over and out.