Gold Rises to Record, Silver Extends Gains on Currency Concerns

DiggerUK

The only people who are guilty of anything are the Gatagoons who peddle nonsense.
Encouraging people to invest in gold and silver because of price suppression does not pass the smell test and is deceitful.

You are talking about a whole world market being controlled by ????????, the market place is it's own boss, answerable to nothing except itself. It's a ridiculous theory.

The reason that gold's price is going up is down to the debasement of paper money, that's all, and has nothing to do with "Phantom Cabals Of Manipulators".

The free market always comes to the right price, always has done and always will do.

getzegold

DiggerUK wrote: »

That has to be the 'Faux Pas' of all time.

Sorry if I havn't thoroughly researched your full posting history unfortunately your don't rate very highly on my interests list.

The greatest faux par of all time? delusions of grandeur?

getzegold

DiggerUK wrote: »

The only people who are guilty of anything are the Gatagoons who peddle nonsense.
Encouraging people to invest in gold and silver because of price suppression does not pass the smell test and is deceitful.

You are talking about a whole world market being controlled by ????????, the market place is it's own boss, answerable to nothing except itself. It's a ridiculous theory.

The reason that gold's price is going up is down to the debasement of paper money, that's all, and has nothing to do with "Phantom Cabals Of Manipulators".

The free market always comes to the right price, always has done and always will do.

Those gatagoons encourage people to invest in PMs despite supression not because of it. Yes it is increasing in value due to currency debasement and as a safe haven in times of uncertainty despite the efforts of the large commercials to keep the price down in order to protect their massive short positions totalling about 300,000 contracts.

Your argument when you think about it makes no sense. I agree gold going up has nothing to do with the 'cabal' but that is not an argument to disprove the existance of such a cabal.

So your a gold bull but you don't believe in price supression? can you name anymore well known gold bulls that don't cos I've never come across any but can prob name several hundred analysts traders fundmanagers and dealers that do.

DiggerUK

getzegold wrote: »

.........I agree gold going up has nothing to do with the 'cabal' but that is not an argument to disprove the existance of such a cabal.

So, were is this cabal.
None of the case studies conducted by the Gatagoons come to anything.
Advising savers to invest in precious metals has to be done on sound economic arguments, something the Gatagoons find impossible to achieve.

C0ck up theories always trounce Conspiracy Theories.

getzegold

DiggerUK wrote: »

So, were is this cabal.
None of the case studies conducted by the Gatagoons come to anything.
Advising savers to invest in precious metals has to be done on sound economic arguments, something the Gatagoons find impossible to achieve.

C0ck up theories always trounce Conspiracy Theories.

That is simply not true and you know it. The people that are associated with GATA which includes many of the leading world dealers and ETF fund managers advise thier clients and the public to buy gold and silver to protect ones savings from currency debasement and inflation, just the same as your saying and they use sound economic arguments.

The same rational arguments are applied when looking at the massive short comex concentrations of the commercial dealers most, notably JPM, and whom the CFTC (an arm of the US gov) has been forced, by the overwhelming evidence of price capping short positions, to start doing something about it.

getzegold

Hre are some of the gatagoons alluded to by digger:

SPROTT ASSET MANAGEMENT: assets under management $5billion
HINDE CAPITAL: assets under management $2billion
Matterhorn Asset Management: asstes under management CHF5billion
Bullion vault: gold on deposit £540 million
GoldMoney: gold on deposit $476million

Lord Rothschild recently invested £12,5 million in Bullion vault, is he a conspiracy nut too? Adrian ash is a leading figure in GATA.

These fund managers are all involved in Gata and manage the gold funds and cash funds of some of the waelthiest people in the world including people like Lord Rothschild.

So all these people are nuts that dont use sound economic argument or reason? rubbish! and yet they all believe in price supression by large commercial banks and their agents.

DiggerUK

getzegold, if there was any truth in these market manipulation arguments, then there would be long jail sentences being served by those involved in the USA.
The USA is ferocious in how it's legal system deals with such people, and does not tend to brush these issues under the carpet, like in Europe.
Considering one Mr. Greenspan, "confessed" to market manipulation, and escaped a long jail term, does it not seem likely that said gentleman failed to confess, even though the Gatagoons tell everybody who will listen that he did confess!!

Recommending to investors here, that they put their savings in to gold with bad advice, is deceitful.

getzegold

DiggerUK wrote: »

getzegold, if there was any truth in these market manipulation arguments, then there would be long jail sentences being served by those involved in the USA.
The USA is ferocious in how it's legal system deals with such people, and does not tend to brush these issues under the carpet, like in Europe.
Considering one Mr. Greenspan, "confessed" to market manipulation, and escaped a long jail term, does it not seem likely that said gentleman failed to confess, even though the Gatagoons tell everybody who will listen that he did confess!!

Recommending to investors here, that they put their savings in to gold with bad advice, is deceitful.

Thats rubbish. look at the massive mortgage and securities fraud involved in subprime and the 2008 financial crisis, including the involvment of the mortgage brokers investment houses, ratings agencies and regulators. Look at the massive fraud involved in mortgage mess in US unfolding right now in the US (the high frequency signing scandal) and as yet nobody bar Madoff has gone to Jail. Supressing a commodity price by shorting it is not an offence in the US so we can't expect any jail sentances. governments i and their agents manipulate markets all across the world i.e SNB ciurrency interventions, BOJ currency interventions etc but its not a crime your argument holds zero weight.

I agree recommending gold on bad advice is deceitful but the people involved in GATA are not being deceitful and they use sound economic argument, hence they're sucessful and people like rothschild will invest in them. If they were the mad hatter tinfoil brigade your attemptong to dipict them as they'd have been out of business long ago. Your obvious misrepresentations of the people at GATA are the only decietful things I'm seeing in this thread.

Heres an excellent but short article on PM price supression by the large commercials from an experienced trader who knows his stuff:

Anyone following the futures market for silver know that the large commercial traders, banks such as JPM, always win. That is until now.

During the bull market in silver that began in 2001, a pattern of trading similar to the martingale betting strategy emerged in which 8 trading institutions sold short increasingly larger amounts of contracts into rallies until their sales volumes overwhelmed the market into a freefall. The same banking institutions would then purchase those short positions at a profit after the freefall and the rally process would begin again. This process of taking money from precious metals investors has been well documented by analysts such as Ted Butler, David Morgan, and others. The strategy has been so successful that some futures traders began to front run the banks on their own tactics using the COT report and other sentiment indicators.

It has been argued that these large short positions have suppressed the price of silver by a multiple of itself. This may be proven sooner than many expected.

http://tradeplacer.com/blog/2010/10/08/1286584740000.html

purch

Can I ask a Question ?

Why are posters like myself and the Digger, who do not believe that there has been any illegal price manipulation in PM's, automatically classed as anti PM's by those who do believe that the manipulation is illegal ?

Both the Digger and myself are strong advocates of holding PM's, yet because we dare to question the idea that holding large short positions in futures is in any way illegal, we are considered heretics.

That many large traders hold large short positions isn't open to question.

Whether or not it is illegal is very much open to question, and I personally would not expect the regulators to find that it is.

sabretoothtigger

Didnt JP Morgan who hold silver short options also then buy a silver mine. They can do whatever they like, if they promise to sell silver for 15 dollars next march then let them

If they do that so much that the price falls its fine unless they then fail to deliver it on time.
Has that happened ?
Whats probably happening is the price gets overbid, lots of people 'buying' (doug kass calls it renting) silver have no interest in owning it so the price is not correct

JPM is taking advantage of these false buyers by forcing the price to adjust down and causing them to sell where by JPM take a profit from these flushed out speculators and yes rebuy at a lower average price.
It appears to be bullying tactics but its normal

This is actually a positive and productive market process and I think its been happening for hundreds of years in every market.
Silver is a useful metal and a higher price can cause companies harm that need to buy it today and use it today

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arbitrage