New DFW - Learn from my pain!

saltnvinegar

Consumerist wrote: »

I agree that you should restore your contingency fund as a first a prioity. You must have a cushion to protect yourself against life's little mishaps.

As regards overpaying your creditors, I assume your DMP arrangements are reviewed periodically so I would suggest holding back any extra payment until a review comes up and decide then how much you can afford to distribute. Hopefully, one-off overpayments at set periods will discourage creditor's over-expectations for increased regular payments until you can reasonably afford it.

All the best to you and yours.

Thanks Consumerist

That sounds like a plan to me. Finances were so tight that it was the lack of a contingency that led me into the Payday Loan trap so am not going to go down that route again!

SnV

saltnvinegar

eyeopener2 wrote: »

Hi SnV

i was just reading your note about Payday UK and how you hadn't heard anything but still paid them.

This is a prime example of how creditors treat cases differently. I was threatened repeatedly by their hired goons Keyes Whitlock and then palmed off to Mackenzie Hall! And my payments just stayed the same..so they paid McHall to collect exactly the same amount from me.

Bizzarre people.

Hi Eyeopener!

I'll let you know for how long the silence continues. I also started to get threats from Keyes Whitlock but a couple of savage letters back to them and a complaint of their conduct to the OFT seems to have shut them up. Maybe they have decided I am too much trouble, but as you said they are bizarre people!

If you're not aware you may be interested to know that Keyes Whitlock are a trading name of MEM Finance aka Payday UK!

I haven't had the pleasure of dealing with Muck Hall so look forward to that one if it happens!

Best

SnV

DeeDeeinDooDoo

Great post. You hit the nail on the head when you say it is not wise to pay creditors MORE than you can afford cos you will just fall down later. I used american sites to clear my debt before MSE existed and they would say PAY YOURSELF FIRST! Once you get your head around that concept you have it sussed. ONCE you start budgeting for everything YOU need even if it is £2 away per month towards a potential washing machine breakdown then eventually you stop NEEDING to charge to credit and the circle is broken.

saltnvinegar

Hi All! :hello:

Well this month is the first big milestone in my self-administered DMP as it marks 6 months in and my first round of DMP review letters!

So what have I learned being on a self administered DMP over the last 6 months?

1) It really is not as scary as you may think and gives you a sense of control over your finances again which personally I don't think you can achieve with having someone do this for you (though I understand why you would want to - see point 2!)

2) Creditors seem to act very aggressively (initially) when they know you are on a self administered plan. This is simply par for the course as they will be after a bigger slice of the pie and try to get in before your other creditors.

3) After the initial flurry of harrassment, things really do settle down and you are able to get some breathing space to get back on your feet.

4) I wished I had addressed my debts and done this much much earlier!! If you are thinking of going on a DMP or are struggling to manage your debts do things sooner rather than later and learn from my mistake!!

5) Some of your creditors, through their intimidation tactics will actually give you enough ammunition to launch a complaint against them for breaches of OFT guidelines giving you leverage over them! This then gives you some highground to then put pressure on your creditors to accept your payment plan

6) That despite threats of "Pay in 7 days or we may take you to court" this has never happened. I'm not saying that this will never happen, as it still could, but keeping a dialogue with creditors makes it difficult for them to be seen to be reasonable should they take that route.

7) Shop Direct are the worst creditor to deal with (see below!)

So where am I now?

Well I have a couple of creditors who are still not playing ball:

Santander (who are renowned for their customer service! - NOT!) have passed my account to their internal debt collection agency and who refuse to acknowledge any letters or offers but just send out templated threats.

Shop Direct have continued to add interest and charges over the last 6 months and have ignored all my letters. However they have now started passing my accounts onto Lowells (whose initial communication has already breached OFT guidelines! :rotfl:) so I look forward to the next round of dealing with them!

Hope you're all well and I'm looking forward to my 1st anniversary on a DMP!

Best

SnV

ps I have heard nothing now from Keyes Whitlock or Payday UK since my last post so I wonder after my formal complaint (and complaint to the OFT) whether I have been put into a 'too much trouble' pile and am being left alone while they pursue people who are intimidated by their bullying.

Consumerist

saltnvinegar wrote: »

. . . but keeping a dialogue with creditors makes it difficult for them to be seen to be reasonable should they take that [court] route.

Hi SnV,

Well done, again.

To continue polite dialogue with creditors is not only good sense but it actually provides you, the debtor, with reasonable grounds to effectively harass them right back without the liability of any criticism of being unco-operative. You must find that very satisfying; I know I would.

Looking forward to the next episode.

saltnvinegar

Consumerist wrote: »

Hi SnV,

Well done, again.

To continue polite dialogue with creditors is not only good sense but it actually provides you, the debtor, with reasonable grounds to effectively harass them right back without the liability of any criticism of being unco-operative. You must find that very satisfying; I know I would.

Looking forward to the next episode.

Thanks C

There is also an 'unfair relationship' angle that I am currently investigating, where a creditor completely ignores a debtor seeking to make a payment arrangement and continues to send out template 'threat-o-grams' (in the case of Shop Direct).

If an unfair relationship can be established by creditors acting in this way then it throws the door open to some very interesting things...........

I am sure that Santander are also now in breach of the British Bankers Association guidelines too.

But moving on....... another month and another payday! As can be seen on my signature I am also (currently!) on my longest run sticking to my budget sheet and have not spent beyond that!

Things are slowly improving financially. I am now chipping away at the debt mountain and am seeing the balance start to reduce which is a great thing.

I have had my first official letter from Lowells. While it is slightly better in terms of its content to the emails they have sent me it still misrepresents their actual capacity (in one sentence they say the debt has been sold to them, but then they start banging on about 'their client'. Erm either the debt has been sold to you or it hasn't!!)

Hopefully I will have a good March and continue sticking to my budget. It would be great to reach my DMP 1st anniversary without any unbudgeted spend, and then also pay my creditors some surplus that has been built up from my contingency money.

Best

SnV

GeorgieFTB

SnV

I am loving your attitude, you seem to actually be relishing the battles with your creditors/DCAs. Now that is healthy!!! I hope others start to figure out this is 'entertaining' ok maybe not quite the right word but I couldn't think of another one.

You have to feel sorry for them sometimes... MSE vs DCA, no contest really!! I wonder if we could ever get to the point of just numbering template letters, imagine the emails flying back and forth...

I'm sorry sir but we will have to send a threat-o-gram number 5

Ohh... ok then I will have to send template letter number 3

Nice counter, but number 8 sent, well... worth a try

I'm not scared, I'll just send a number 10!

Think of the paper we could save, and the fun, if there are 10 template letters, just think of the confusion if 'number11' was sent!

Gx

Consumerist

saltnvinegar wrote: »

I have had my first official letter from Lowells. While it is slightly better in terms of its content to the emails they have sent me it still misrepresents their actual capacity (in one sentence they say the debt has been sold to them, but then they start banging on about 'their client'. Erm either the debt has been sold to you or it hasn't!!)

Hi SnV,

You don't miss much, do you?

It just goes to show what can be achieved if you keep your head while the DCAs around you are losing theirs.

Keep up the good work.

C.

lindann_2

well done snv,

l am taking a leaf out of your comments, that do not get stressed over the daft debt collectors, we have paid one debt to un-reliable collection last september 2010, it my hubbys, JDWilliams.. dispite this we got statements since then asking for payment on a NIL balance. Last week we got a letter threating court for none paying this bill. We was told in a phone call it is an error, it should not happen. Hubby said let them take us to court, see what the judge tells them, if that it does not get thrown out. so well done, xxx good and great advice

we got letter stating this debt has been paid

saltnvinegar

GeorgieFTB wrote: »

I am loving your attitude, you seem to actually be relishing the battles with your creditors/DCAs. Now that is healthy!!! I hope others start to figure out this is 'entertaining' ok maybe not quite the right word but I couldn't think of another one

Once you realise that DCA's have very few 'powers' other than to threaten and intimidate then you have them on the back foot.

I love DCA's who are members of the CSA (Credit Services Association) and breach the CSA's own guidelines (not to mention the OFT). I have made 2 complaints to the CSA about their own members in the last 6 months and getting results.

This is not to mention breaches of OFT guidelines either and complaints I have made to them.

Yes you ultimately may get taken to court, but every creditor, without exception, who has been difficult or obstructive to accepting my DMP have breached OFT and CSA guidelines on collection activity. This has been pointed out to them, and they have been informed that their conduct will be detailed in my defense should they decide to take things that far.

GeorgieFTB wrote: »

You have to feel sorry for them sometimes... MSE vs DCA, no contest really!! I wonder if we could ever get to the point of just numbering template letters, imagine the emails flying back and forth...

I'm sorry sir but we will have to send a threat-o-gram number 5

Ohh... ok then I will have to send template letter number 3

Nice counter, but number 8 sent, well... worth a try

I'm not scared, I'll just send a number 10!

Think of the paper we could save, and the fun, if there are 10 template letters, just think of the confusion if 'number11' was sent!

I love the template thing!! In fact we are almost there already!

I do mix it up a bit by not using template letters 'ad hoc' but more as a framework by adding my own circumstances and amendments into them.

When I then get a standard threat-o-gram 'template response' it then makes it easier to push back as they generally don't address the points made, also opening them up to the 'unfair relationship' test.

At least thats my take on things at the moment.....

Best

SnV