New tenancy: LL wants to add strange clause to contract?

deviruchi

Hello,

I've paid a holding deposit on a flat and am due to get the keys in a week. However, via the letting agent, the LL has said that they are putting a clause into the contract that I am due to sign and I'm not sure if I'm entirely happy with it. Any thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Firstly, some background: it is a furnished flat (fridge/freezer, electric oven and washing machine). I agreed the rent, paid the holding deposit, and handed in the notice for my current flat. I've also started notifying utility companies I'm moving. To complicate things, I'm going away for 2 weeks in the first week of September where I will have sporadic phone and internet access, and was hoping to have everything sorted by then.

Today I spoke to the agent and they said that the landlord wants to add a clause to the contract that states I accept all responsibility for repairs and maintenance of the fridge/freezer and washing machine. I found this rather strange, as from my point of view one of the benefits of renting is knowing that there is someone to deal with those appliances if problems occur. I tried to find out what the reasoning behind this was, and the agent said something to the effect of: "It's due to past experiences, when they have broken before he has had to pay for it, and he doesn't want to do that." This makes me think two things:

1. There are known issues with the fridge/freezer and washing machine (why not add the cooker into this clause too? It seems too specific)
2. It implies the LL would not be the most accommodating/helpful if I did have a problem with other aspects of the flat (the agent is involved on a let-only basis)

I told the agent I didn't feel entirely comfortable about this, but they said the LL was adamant about having this clause.

I now feel that I have two options:

1. Sign the contract with the clause, and hope nothing goes wrong with the fridge/freezer or washing machine - or anything else with the flat (I can do my washing elsewhere if need be). The contract is only for 6 months so if it does prove to be problematic, I don't have to be there for too long
2. Pull out, potentially lose my holding deposit and wait until I find something I'm happier with. The area I'm looking to move in always has plenty of flats up for rent, and I'm confident I would be able to find something else, plus I can store my belongings and stay with friends in the meantime

Is this a normal thing for LLs to demand? Everyone I have spoken to has found it rather odd. I presume my insurance would cover at least some issues with the appliances. What I don't want to do is risk being faced with a massive repair bill if, for example, the washing machine leaks and causes damage to the floors and to the ceiling of the flat below.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Ankatden

Agree to it subject to LL getting every applicance tested prior to your moving it with a certificate stating their working order, he should have electric checks done on all applicances yearly anyway.

On that basis he is proving that 1.) they are in good working order 2.) electrically sound.

If as you say there are other properties then LL is not necessarily in best negotiating position.

LydiaJ

deviruchi wrote: »

I tried to find out what the reasoning behind this was, and the agent said something to the effect of: "It's due to past experiences, when they have broken before he has had to pay for it, and he doesn't want to do that."
<snip>
It implies the LL would not be the most accommodating/helpful if I did have a problem with other aspects of the flat (the agent is involved on a let-only basis)

Yes, I would feel the same. Either he wants to let the flat complete with appliances, in which case he should maintain them, or else he doesn't want to maintain them, in which case he shouldn't provide them as part of the tenancy. I presume he expects to find fully functional appliances in the property at the end of the tenancy? Why should you pay to maintain appliances that don't belong to you? (It's different, of course, if you damage the appliances in a way that's clearly your fault rather than normal wear and tear.)

I once lived somewhere where the LL came to a sensible compromise about this. He said that it wasn't his policy to provide FF or DW, but that when he bought the house they were there as part of the fitted kitchen. He said he didn't consider them to belong to him, and wouldn't be maintaining them, but that we were welcome to use them as long as they lasted. We were happy with that.

In fact, the FF worked fine, and was still fine when we left the property. The fitted DW, on the other hand, died soon after we moved in. We replaced it with a non-fitted DW, which we then took with us when we moved out. I presume the LL told the new T the same story about the FF as he told us, and let the property with "space for DW".

emms1981

I would do as the last poster said and get them to check them out 1st we were stung in the 1st flat we lived in. The fridge was in perfect working order but the flap on the ice box was a bit iffy and used to sometimes hang off one one side but didnt cause a problem and could be pushed back in so we left it and when we moved out he had the cheek to keep £50 and tell us we had broken the fridge mind u he tried it on he said the £50 was for cleaning but changed his mind when we said he had made us move out a day early. :mad:

theartfullodger

LL is a k**b 'ead.

Shelter, the wonderful, able, intelligent but very-short-of-money-and-resource Shelter as usual is wise & helpful on the subject..

see,...
http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/repairs_and_bad_conditions/repairs_in_private_lets/furniture_and_equipment

Cheers!


Lodger (LL)

deviruchi

Thank you for all of your comments. I'll ring the agent tomorrow about getting every appliance tested and see what they say - I'm not holding out much hope as they didn't seem to understand my concerns today.

theartfullodger, thank you for the Shelter link. I searched for services in my area and I'm going to call the council tomorrow for advice.

I must admit I am rather put off the tenancy by all of this (more than anything the impression it gives about the LL and his potential attitude if I ever did have a problem). I'm finding the idea of pulling out and waiting until after I get back in mid Sept to find another place a rather attractive option - I could focus on the arrangements for my holiday instead, not worry about the flat whilst away, and make sure I move somewhere I'm happy with.

If I was to pull out, would I still be liable to lose my holding deposit, seen as my decision would be based on terms introduced after paying the holding deposit?

princeofpounds

The shelter page is great, but let me elaborate. Under section 11 of LL&T act the landlord has to keep the property and a number of key appliances in good repair (boiler, electric meter etc). There is a rather curious phrase about appliances solely for the use of utilities that do this.

However, there is no duty to fix white goods. But if a LL doesn't explicitly contract out of repairs when providing them then a court would assume that he implied their provision as part of the service, so he has to do it. Your LL doesn't want to do this.

What can you do? You have a few options.

Back out.
Negotiate a lower rent for the change to terms from what you were shown.
Ask for appliances to be removed so you can supply your own.
Agree (possibly subject to no duty to replace if machines die a fair wear and tear death)

what you want to avoid is taking on an aged White good with a duty to replace with a new one if it breaks.

Landlords can be quite silly about these matters- avoiding repairs whilst not freeing space for tenant's own machines, thinking you can charge full furnished rent prices whilst avoiding White goods responsibility etc.

Ulfar

I personally would ask for them to be removed and provide my own, then when moving you can take them with you and there is no argument afterwards. You certainly don't want to be agreeing to this clause have the appliances go wrong two months in and have to buy new ones to leave for the landlord.

The reason he has excluded the cooker is that if it is gas it has to be in good working order for the gas safety certificate.

theartfullodger

Good point UFAR on gas cooker. But I don't think gas regs allow that - gas safety cert is LL responsibility.., he CANNOT get out of it.

I return to my earlier comment. LL is k**b 'ead///


Cheers!

Lodger

angrypirate

Landlord is being completely unreasonable. I suggest one of 2 things:

Say that you will take responsibility for organising the repair of white goods, but the cost or repair will be deducted from your rent upon production of receipt.

If they say no, then walk away - you know this LL is going to be worthless scum who will probably try and hold onto your desposit. LA has an obligation to return your holding desposit as negotiations willl falll through on contract terms (unreasonable ones at that).

FATBALLZ

To be honest I'd just steer clear of this one as the LL is clearly a chump who doesn't know much about being a LL. If you really want the place I'd suggest telling him to remove the applicances and drop the rent by £50 a month to reflect the drop in value of the rental.