Virgin Trains thought a tandem folded in half.

ColdDish

From consumer direct:

In agreeing that the train would be able to accommodate the bike, when actually they could not, it could be argued that a misrepresentation had occurred, as you were given false information that induced you into contract. The trader would be obliged to cancel the contract and offer a refund, you could also request compensation as a consequential loss as a result of this breach, but this would have to be reasonable.

dzug1

Moneyback yes, but I thought he already had that. It is arguable that use of a mobile phone in this context is unreasonable and therefore not claimable.

OTH if you go to court it's not worth the company's trouble to contest it and they might pay regardless of the rights and wrongs

ColdDish

Virgin Trains email address: customerserviceATvirgintrainsDOTcoDOTuk



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Dear Virgin trains.

Thankyou for your letter.

I have posted your responses on a forum. I, quite luckily, live next door to a friend who works for the media so I'll be passing this story onto them and to other newspapers.

To reiterate:

Every phone call has been recorded,.

1. I purchased a train ticket from East Midlands rail. They then informed me I could not carry a tandem bicycle on the train.
2. I looked at a website called wwwDOTatobDOTorgDOTuk/Bike_RailDOThtml. This site informed me that Virgin Pendelino Trains allows tandems.
3. I called Virgin Trains and requested a ticket from Sheffield to London via Virgin trains using a virgin pendelino train. I told them I was carrying a tandem bike. I then spent 15 minutes on hold to check that the trains would carry a tandem bike. They informed me that it would carry a tandem bike and that they have reserved two cycle spaces for me.
4. I went to pick up my tickets the next day and did not believe Virgin Trains. I talked to a train manager who informed me Virgin Trains do not run a service from Sheffield to London.
5. I called Virgin trains and asked for a refund. They refused stating they simply cannot refund tickets.
6. I then spent a week phoning Virgin Trains as I could not find their email address and I was informed by their staff that they had to give an authorisation code to customer service so there is no point trying to contact customer service directly.
7. During this week I continuously asked the staff you do know what a tandem is don't you? They all replied yes.
8. On Friday I asked them:

"Do you know what a tandem is?"
They said yes. However this time I asked them,
"What is a tandem?".
"It's a bike that folds it half."

That was their response. I finally got through to a supervisor who admitted he didn't know what a tandem was.

He agreed to refund the tickets AND refund the cost of my calls.

I sent a letter to Virgin Trains:

28 Jul 10 AG931164817GB

This was your response:

"National Rail Conditions of conditions of Carriage state that the train companies do not accept liability for such expenses."

This is consumer directs response and I agree:

"In agreeing that the train would be able to accommodate the bike, when actually they could not, it could be argued that a misrepresentation had occurred, as you were given false information that induced you into contract. The trader would be obliged to cancel the contract and offer a refund, you could also request compensation as a consequential loss as a result of this breach, but this would have to be reasonable.
If you were unable to resolve the matter with the trader, the only way to enforce your civil rights would be to take legal action through your County Court."

The Misrepresentation Act of 1967
1967 c.7

An Act to amend the law relating to innocent misrepresentations and to amend sections 11 and 35 of the Sale of Goods Act 1893.

[22nd March 1967]

Where a person has entered into a contract after a misrepresentation has been made to him, and—

the misrepresentation has become a term of the contract; or
the contract has been performed;

The consequential loss was incurred by trying to get a refund because of your misrepresentation. It is reasonable for you to refund the costs of my calls as they were all a result of trying to phone virgin to get a refund where there is no email contact and authorisation can only be given by the call centre.
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ColdDish

dzug1 wrote: »

Moneyback yes, but I thought he already had that. It is arguable that use of a mobile phone in this context is unreasonable and therefore not claimable.

OTH if you go to court it's not worth the company's trouble to contest it and they might pay regardless of the rights and wrongs

I disagree. The costs were incurred directly as the only way to ask for a refund is to call them. If you contact virgin trains customer service directly and ask for a refund, it cant be authorised unless it comes from the call centre.

How can you ask for a refund and say the costs of asking for a refund are not a consequential loss of the act of:

asking for a refund.

ColdDish

Judas wrote: »

You still havent explained why you didnt say something when they didnt book a place for your tandem? They clearly state you have to book if you want guarenteed room therefore where is your confirmation of a tandem booking?

They did book a place for a tandem (apparently) they booked two cycles spaces.

Two cycles spaces does not mean a tandem will fit.

They thought a tandem folded in half. (I found out later)

charley_177

The joy of privatisation! Bring Back British Rail (or Intercity, at least), with large brake vans for massive luggage and plenty of bicycles, all is forgiven! Perhaps there should be just one 'National Rail' booking service, rather than all the different TOCs telesales and websites?

dzug1

ColdDish wrote: »

I disagree. The costs were incurred directly as the only way to ask for a refund is to call.

Yes - but not from a mobile where rates are sky high

FARE-COP

Why was it not possible to follow the much cheaper route as advertised on Virgin Trains own website??

Extract below:

write to Customer Relations at:
Customer Relations
Virgin Trains
FREEPOST BM 6613
PO BOX 713
Birmingham
B5 4HHTelephone: 08450 008 000
Text phone: 01216 547 528
Calls cost 2ppm (day) and 0.5ppm (evening) from a BT landline.
Other operators' charges may vary.
Opening Times

Monday to Friday: 08:30 - 18:15 Saturday: 09:00 - 16:00 Sunday: Closed

You would be asking the County Court to consider whether incurring big mobile charges and expecting the company to refund them is reasonable when they have provided a number of cheaper alternatives, not least of those being a first class stamp.

Remember too, you will have to pay up-front for the issue of your County Court Summons and the fare that you were contesting has already been refunded.

It costs the TOC nothing more than a written submission to put their initial defence to your claim.

I'm not really sure that you'd get any joy, but if you are keen to go for it, then that's a matter for you..

ColdDish

As I have already stated:

I was told by the people in sales that I cannot contact customer service for a refund unless I get authorisation from the people in sales.

Mobile because I dont have a landline.

Also I was trying to get this sorted out on the morning of the journey, during the journey, and coming back as I didn't want to purchase more tickets. The costs were incurred as they kept putting me on hold to figure out what was going on or simply hanging up. Writing to virgin trains and then purchasing several hundred pounds of tickets wasnt really an option at the time. Also they specifically state (and I have it recorded) that they would refund the cost of my calls.

The fare was refunded after a WEEK of calls. It was refunded after being refused 6-7 times because they tought a tandem folded in half.

If Virgin trains state:

We will refund the ticket and the cost of your calls.

I expect them to:

Refund the ticket and the cost of them calls.

I have recorded them telling me that.

I'll also want compensation for wasting my time, buying new tickets from another train company and having to go to Doncaster to get it sorted out as only East Coast trains would allow me to do it.

sassy_one

I would write to them advising them of your intentions and giving them 7 days for a reply, failing which you proceed to small claims.