Free solar panel discussion

Cardew

Anyone who contemplates paying Homesun £5 a month for the legal right for Homesun to use their roof must have rocks in their head.

Unbelievable!

slacky555

Cardew wrote: »

Anyone who contemplates paying Homesun £5 a month for the legal right for Homesun to use their roof must have rocks in their head.

Unbelievable!

But if the long term plan is to buy out then it is a good idea if it's the only way you could possibly fund a system by buying out a few years down the line when it's cheaper. As pointed out by grahamc2003 post 1595 do you disagree with that statement.

Cardew

slacky555 wrote: »

But if the long term plan is to buy out then it is a good idea if it's the only way you could possibly fund a system by buying out a few years down the line when it's cheaper. As pointed out by grahamc2003 post 1595 do you disagree with that statement.

Post#1595 is a question, and you will note that it wasn't answered!

slacky555

Cardew wrote: »

Post#1595 is a question, and you will note that it wasn't answered!

It is a good point to be made, it may not have been answered, it may have been an example but with very valid and true points that the buy out price will keep falling while the FIT's will only keep increasing.

EddyB

JenR, many thanks for info re smaller panels from myenergystation. I must track that company down.

We came upon a house the other day with a particularly long landscape roof and the front of the house looked south. So as you approach that house you see that is has two lines of very large landscape panels positioned on its roof, from left to right. What used to be a most attractive-looking house is now an ugly-looking house. The large landscape panels just don't flatter it at all.

The house in question would not look anywhere near as bad if it had MANY and SMALL portrait panels laid upon it.

Of course, it wouldn't matter if this arrangement was on the rear-roof, which nobody can see.

I realise this is only an issue if people care about the appearance of their home.

HomeSun_company_representative

Mcfi5dhc wrote: »

Hello

I'd like to ask Krish (official HomeSun company representative) how the matter of existing meters is dealt with in providing customers with estimated savings with the free panels.

For example, I had a backwards spinning meter which I voluntarily changed to an export meter (I have bought my own PV system). This turns out to be a huge mistake.

Your customers will have one of two types of meter, backwards spinner, or not, and the savings they make will be vastly different between the two.

If they have a backwards spinner, do you warn them that the fairly large savings they'll get now, will be erroded virtually overnight once a smart meter is forced upon them.

Many thanks

Hi Mcfi5dhc,

You are quite right about mentioning that there will be a vast difference in savings if a property has a backward spinning meter (BSM). On the other hand we do not change the BSM at a property. We only install a Generation Meter which measures the electricity our panels generate/use/exported etc.

Once we have completed the installation, we inform the DNO (Distribution Network Operator) that Solar PV has been installed and that’s all that we inform. We do not notify the DNO if a property has a BSM or any other type of meter or any other specifics about the homeowner’s meter.

Once we advise them, that Solar PV has been installed, the DNO can contact the homeowner and arrange for the BSM to be changed at no cost to the homeowner. Additionally the homeowner will have to comply with their DNO in the event they are contacted by them. Furthermore, I am not aware of any of our customers who have been approached by the DNO to have their BSM’s replaced till date.

Anyone with a BSM is probably aware that they are currently saving a fair bit more than a homeowner with a new meter, therefore in the unlikely event a new meter is installed by the DNO, the homeowner will continue to save the “right amount” and for that reason I would not like to think that the savings will be eroded completely due to the meters being changed.

Regards,

Krish

grahamc2003

Cardew wrote: »

Post#1595 is a question, and you will note that it wasn't answered!

Although the salient points weren't addressed at all in Krish's reply to my question, the question was sort of answered by the original post explaining the 'straight-line depreciation' buyout option being deleted!

Such a policy would not be viable to the company for the reasons given. Homesun would make a thumping loss, so either the policy wouldn't be honoured, or the 'free' panel barnch of Homsun's business would make a potentially large loss.

The only viable buyout option would be similar to one described before - where the buyouit pice in the future would be the system cost plus all future fit payments (possibly discounted a little due to being paid in advance). The reason this is so is due to the high fixed/initial/setup costs of pv panels, and the very low variable/ongoing costs. Even allowing for a 100% markup on the panels, a buyout price of that order would be necessary, otherwise it makes no sense to the panel owner.

The buyout clause, even though expensive to the roof-renter, is still a valuable option imv, since it gives flexibility in the future of a house sale to a buyer who doeen't want the panels. Although expensive, it could enable a house sale which otherwise could not proceed.

Having thought about the possible buyout clauses, It's clear in my mind thst

- a 'free' system makes no sense without a buyout clause, due to possible house sale problems in the future

- exercising a viable buyout clause in the future would almost certainly cause the roof-renter a large financial loss overall, with the buyout potentially costing far in excess of any 'free' electricity gained.

Mcfi5dhc

HomeSun_company_representative wrote: »

Anyone with a BSM is probably aware that they are currently saving a fair bit more than a homeowner with a new meter, therefore in the unlikely event a new meter is installed by the DNO, the homeowner will continue to save the “right amount” and for that reason I would not like to think that the savings will be eroded completely due to the meters being changed.

Regards,

Krish

Hi Krish

Thank you for a quick and honest reply.

In my experience, people don't really know the difference a BSM would make. I bought my own panels, and I fitted an export meter through my own (misguided) choice.

Hypothetically, if a customer has a BSM and takes out your completely free offer, they'll be saving a packet. Then, when an export meter is forced upon them (or a smart meter- I know this isn't your fault by the way!), the savings will be shockingly reduced. Probably from about £350 a year, to about £100 (agree/disagree??)

Is this made clear to customers, or is it kind of left up to them to figure out? I know you are in a totally new industry, and in many respects, one of the two market-leaders, but I always think being up front to customers from the start is a good thing. Maybe a small point about it on your webpage in the Q&A section?

Also, I don't think it has been clarified yet, but if someone took up the £5 a month offer, this amount does reduce any future buyout price from your systems, right? Its not just paying for you to earn FIT on their roofs. Again, that could do with going on the webpage.

Thanks

slacky555

grahamc2003 wrote: »

Although the salient points weren't addressed at all in Krish's reply to my question, the question was sort of answered by the original post explaining the 'straight-line depreciation' buyout option being deleted!

Such a policy would not be viable to the company for the reasons given. Homesun would make a thumping loss, so either the policy wouldn't be honoured, or the 'free' panel barnch of Homsun's business would make a potentially large loss.

The only viable buyout option would be similar to one described before - where the buyouit pice in the future would be the system cost plus all future fit payments (possibly discounted a little due to being paid in advance). The reason this is so is due to the high fixed/initial/setup costs of pv panels, and the very low variable/ongoing costs. Even allowing for a 100% markup on the panels, a buyout price of that order would be necessary, otherwise it makes no sense to the panel owner.

The buyout clause, even though expensive to the roof-renter, is still a valuable option imv, since it gives flexibility in the future of a house sale to a buyer who doeen't want the panels. Although expensive, it could enable a house sale which otherwise could not proceed.

Having thought about the possible buyout clauses, It's clear in my mind thst

- a 'free' system makes no sense without a buyout clause, due to possible house sale problems in the future

- exercising a viable buyout clause in the future would almost certainly cause the roof-renter a large financial loss overall, with the buyout potentially costing far in excess of any 'free' electricity gained.

Can Krish please clarify if the buy out price is just the system price at reduced cost not the system price plus any remaining FIT's?

HomeSun_company_representative

Mcfi5dhc wrote: »

Hi Krish

Thank you for a quick and honest reply.

In my experience, people don't really know the difference a BSM would make. I bought my own panels, and I fitted an export meter through my own (misguided) choice.

Hypothetically, if a customer has a BSM and takes out your completely free offer, they'll be saving a packet. Then, when an export meter is forced upon them (or a smart meter- I know this isn't your fault by the way!), the savings will be shockingly reduced. Probably from about £350 a year, to about £100 (agree/disagree??)

Is this made clear to customers, or is it kind of left up to them to figure out? I know you are in a totally new industry, and in many respects, one of the two market-leaders, but I always think being up front to customers from the start is a good thing. Maybe a small point about it on your webpage in the Q&A section?

Also, I don't think it has been clarified yet, but if someone took up the £5 a month offer, this amount does reduce any future buyout price from your systems, right? Its not just paying for you to earn FIT on their roofs. Again, that could do with going on the webpage.

Thanks

Hi Mcfi5dhc,
To be honest I am not sure of how much savings there would be as I have never come across a customer who has had meters changed therefore I cannot agree or disagree, but if you are stating from your own experience the difference between the meters was saving you £250/year then yes I must agree that is a massive difference.

We like to keep things simple therefore if a customer has any doubts about their meter supplied by the DNO’s our Solar Specialists will answer their queries at the time of the visit. I will speak to the relevant team and enlighten them of your comments about adding a section about the BSM part to our FAQ’s. Thank You.

Panels are required to be maintained to ensure their full functionality as such the £5/month is maintenance and service fee therefore this will not reduce the buyout price of the panels at anytime.

Krish