What do you think?

sephrenia

Hi all,

After much messing around (and one virus attack) My ex-hubby completed a website for an Avon representative that included full e-commerce capability. she has constantly added to it and wanted more done to it (which he's done as a gesture of goodwill) and now she's demanded that he remove the link to his own website from the bottom (i.e the link that says 'designed by').

All she paid for was the setting up, design of her logo, uploading to her own domain and general layout and for this he charged her £300. He used zencart as the underlying e-commerce code. He has tried to explain to her that she doesn't own the code in any way and that she can't afford it, that she has simply licensed it.

It's getting to be really annoying and I wondered, should he remove the code and let her get naffed over on copyright, or should he try yet again to explain to her that to remove his code is a violation of their agreement. Bearing in mind though that he didn't actually get anything signed, it was all verbal although, I was a witness to this agreement.

All thoughts are appreciated.

fwor

Is he asserting that he owns the copyright to some or all of the content of her website? Or is he just linking to his own website?

Did she explicitly agree to have a link to his website on hers? It doesn't seem to be a condition of use of Zencart to have any specific links - just a requirement that you acknowledge their copyright if you use one of their templates.

If her website is registered under his Zencart account then it seems to make sense just to get her to apply for her own account, transfer it to that and leave her to it.

23n1th

So the Avon lady wants your OH to remove the "designed by .." link? How does that connect with your OH half using zencart?

As far as I know zencart is opensource which means as long as the Avon lady gives credit where credit is due she can do what she wants with zencart including modifying it anyway she wants (though she probably doesn't know how).

[Deleted User]

Hi,

tell him just to take it off just to please her, then he can gradually feed some parasites into Avon Lady's web site.

sephrenia

Hi all,

thanks for the replies. I'll just let him steal the keyboard.

(Him)

I acknowledged zencart which is common practice although you don't actually need to. All the files, except those where I added my own coding, include my own copy right as well as zencart.

The point is that have designed it, built it on the zencart platform and as is common practice, put 'designed by' at the bottom with a link to my site.

What she is on about, is that she wants me to pay her to keep that link on the site that I built and to top it all, she wants me to carry on doing stuff for her for no pay despite my pointing out that she has gotten exactly what she asked for, for the amount she paid (£300).

She paid me to design the layout of the site, insert her logos and come up with colour themes. All of this I came up with off my own back, just showing her when it was done to get her opinion. She liked it and so she kept it with a couple of minor tweaks.

Included in this was also code editing for payments/billing, implementing full e-commerce capabilities (paypal etc) and setting the site up and installing 200 items in the shop. As an act of goodwill, I entered the other 1000 items in the brochure she provided.

I explained that while it is her site but that she doesn't own the coding and that it is licensed from zencart and that she doesn't own the design that I came up with but she simply won't accept that and asserts that it ALL belongs to her so in view of this, I am just going to remove the link and inform zencart that she is trying to claim ownership of the e-commerce software.

My ex-wife just wanted to know if this would cause me any more problems than already exist with this client.

Kind Regards,
Thanatos.

23n1th

I'd remove your code and design as well silly woman

fwor

sephrenia wrote: »

I am just going to remove the link and inform zencart that she is trying to claim ownership of the e-commerce software.

I would remove the link. I would not inform Zencart (I can't see what you have to gain by doing this). I would make sure that she is using her own Zencart account with her own details and none of yours - and just let her get on with it herself.

macman

And invoice her for all the additional work done over and above what was agreed. She presumably won't pay, so you can either pursue it through the small claims process, or at least write it off as a bad debt which can then be set against your tax bill.

sephrenia

Thanks for all your help guys, I'll pass all your replies on to him

littlepanther

This is why terms and conditions are so important, treat it as a lesson, don't get even use the experience to cover himself next time.

Invoicing for work not agreed and then pursueing it in small claims may well backfire.

A lesson I learned is spending time on this will cost you more in the long run in time, stress and missing opportunities, put a smile on go after other clients and charge properly, £300 too cheap, and make sure you have agreed the 'designed by' tell them what they will get and equally as important what they wont get.

the182guy

It's not clear exactly how much work went into the site, zencart is a complete solution to an ecommerce site, it sounds like it only needed installing and configuring. The design is something seperate, if it has been done from scratch then I think he has done well to get £300. The data input work (adding 1k products) is again something seperate and should treated as such - you can't bill for/claim for much for that because there are people that will do data input for peanuts.

As a web developer myself IMO he should remove his link and leave her to it. You can only demand the link stays if it was written in a contract which was signed. I don't think he would win if he took it to small claims court because the client was never told [as far as I know] and never agreed to have a link to the designer's site. Also generally when a developer creates or designs something for a client, the work usually becomes property of the client who paid for it. The client can just claim that she has been mislead due to assuming that the work she paid for would be owned by her (except the Zencart part).

If it was written in a contract prior to the client accepting, I don't think she would have agreed to have the work done if it said that the designer owned everything and she has no rights over the work she paid for, plus no rights over the designers link at the bottom.

The client doesn't sound particularly pleasant but I do feel that your husband has not protected himself by a contract and I think it is unreasonable to demand the link stays and he retains sole ownership of the design if the client never agreed to this.