Asbestos Question

dawnofwar

Hey everyone,

I hope i've put this is the right section and that someone could help me.

We are in the process of having our attached garage extended and converted into a downstairs bedroom and bathroom for our disabled daughter. We are about 5 weeks into a 12 week build.

The build is being financed through the Disabled Facilites Grant and partly by ourselves. As it is through the DFG, the council has a Project Management company that they recommend (part of the council but not if you see what i mean).

We decided to use the project management company as things were getting busier at work for DH and it was not something that i felt i could do by myself. The promise of a stress free build with them taking care of everything seemed too good to be true

Now onto the problem, we have found out that out carport roof is made of Asbestos. The Technical Officer who drew the plans and surveyed the house put the boards down as "superlux", well the builders came to start tearing it down to find that its not Superlux its actually Asbestos Insulating Boards. This means that according to the builders we need professional removers and the HSE involved.

My question is, should this Asbestos have been tested before the builders started work?

We have paid the project management company a sizeable fee (DFG full grant here is £30k, and we have paid on top of that and they take 10% of the overall cost as their fee), and we have had to negotiate and sort everything out with the builders as the project company haven't seemed interested dispite their booklet saying that they will work with contracters to take the hassle away from us but thats for another day.

Obviously i will be looking at their complaints procedure but if someone could help me with my question it would be appreciated.

never_enough

Why would they if it was thought to be superlux? I'm coming from a totally non technical point of view, but surely if it's listed as a certain material the builder would expect it to be that?

It might not be as massive an issue as you may think to get rid of it, for example my council take asbestos at the tip as long as it's bagged & tagged properly. There was a thread last week about asbestos, worth a look.

dawnofwar

Thanks for the reply. My concern is that it shouldnt have been assumed that it was Superlux by the Technical Officer without actually looking at it properly. Unfortunatley its not as easy as you suggest, they will take Superlux bagged up but definetly not this. After the lab test results came back the asbestos content was that high they had contact the HSE and get a professional company in to remove it.

never_enough

dawnofwar wrote: »

Thanks for the reply. My concern is that it shouldnt have been assumed that it was Superlux by the Technical Officer without actually looking at it properly. Unfortunatley its not as easy as you suggest, they will take Superlux bagged up but definetly not this. After the lab test results came back the asbestos content was that high they had contact the HSE and get a professional company in to remove it.

Sorry, I didn't realise that Superlux was asbestos. Neither do I know much about asbestos in general. In fact it's pretty much limited to the fact that it is not always necessary to get specialist removers in (which I'm not sure is common knowledge).

iamcornholio

It depends on the contractural relationship between you all.

The plan drawer may be just that, a plan drawer and not there to point out asbsetos or anthing else. But he is wrong to note the roof as superlux (a modern asbestos-free propriatary product). He should term it as "fibre cement sheet" or "asbestos cement sheet" depending on which is most likely or suspected.

The Project Manager may be just there to manage, but more often than not, he should plan the work and as part of this - this would include checks for potential asbestos.

The builder is expected to look out for asbestos, and I would expect him to have seen this (if the roof was visible) on a pre-start visit or even when he turns up on site. But it's not his job to identify asbestos before he starts work. In fact, if a project is being managed by others (a firm or professional) then a builder should ask for an asbestos survey - or the firm or professional provide one as a matter of course with the other pre-contract documents

The management company are at fault, not only to you but more seriously in failing their duty to the builder.

For information, any professional working on buildings should be aware of asbestos and the likely places it will be. A garage roof would immediatly ring alarm bells and checks done at a very early stage.

muckybutt

never_enough wrote: »

Sorry, I didn't realise that Superlux was asbestos.

Superlux is not asbestos !

As I pointed out in the other thread asbestos can be taken and disposed of at local council waste sites, normal stipulation is that it is bagged twice in clear bags and is clearly marked ASBESTOS.

The council have hazardous materials depositories on all household waste sites.

asbestosexpert

Just to inform you early superlux boarding could contain asbestos as when they changed over from Asbestos insulation board the machinery used was stlll caked in asbestos. T he only way to find out is to have it analysed by ukas accredited laboratory There is a website that sends you a sampling kit which includes two sample analysis for less than £40. I had some artex and cement garage sheets sampled and my marley floor tiles Got results back within a week. Have a loook for yourself there website is asbestossamplinghome.co.uk
I was pleased with the response and price

jason_nevin

A couple of points;

Removal of the asbestos

If this is a private house and you are the owner then you can remove any asbestos without a license as long as you don't get anyone to help you. As a disabled person I'm guessing you're unlikely to do so. A contractor must use a licensed removal company to remove any medium-high risk products such as AIB.

If its rented accomodation (including local authority) then the landlord must use a licensed contractor to remove AIB as the building is classed as a commercial property.

Waste disposal

It is illegal to transport hazardous waste (AIB qualifies, cement doesn't) without a licence. You're unlikely to get stopped but I'm raising the point.

Identification of asbestos

This is a bit of a grey area. If you employ a contractor then strictly your house becomes a place of work which means its your responsibility (as the dutyholder) to identify the asbestos before works start. This side of the regulations is unclear and open to interpretation. On the flipside it was the responsibility of the project manager (as outlined by iamcornholio) to identify asbestos before allowing HIS contractor to start works. This part is solid stone. He has exposed the builder to asbestos and is in breach of the law.

My advice

Get a removal quote from somewhere like http://www.asbestosregisters.co.uk so that you know what you're dealing with. The chances are that if you are disabled you can get a grant to get this removed too but I'd approach the project management company first. They're probably making £6k+ on this job so a £2k removal still makes them profitable. Remember this reflects on them badly as they've made a very bad assumption.

Best of luck

dawnofwar

Thanks everyone for taking the time to reply.

Jason, you have raised the point that i have most concerns about. I personally feel that the Project Management didn't survey the house properly in the first instance, if they had (and the area in question is fully visable) then this wouldnt have cropped up part way through the build and be costing us a ridiculous amount of money!
I suppose we are going to have to find a way to say this to the PM company, and questioning whether this should come out of the fee that we paid them to supposedly take care of all this.