Is this legal? Expected to travel on Sunday for no pay?

inmypocketnottheirs

lucylucky wrote: »

I am all for give and take in the workplace, but don't like to see people being screwed over.

I wholeheartedly agree!

Employers give wages, employees take them.

If there is anything within the workplace environment that is unacceptable to the employee, if they can not be negotiated around, and it is to the employee's disatsfaction then they can show their contempt in the usual manner.

I don't mean to appear heartless or unsympathetic to the OP/their OH, I have been on both sides of this argument in the past.

In these times of economic strife, where often companies are struggling to survive (we do not know what sacrifices the Directors are making - I know one guy with a firm employing 50 staff has not taken any salary since May in order to keep the business going) sometimes we have to bite our lip and be grateful for having a job.

lucylucky

inmypocketnottheirs wrote: »

I wholeheartedly agree!

Employers [STRIKE]give[/STRIKE] pay wages, employees [STRIKE]take[/STRIKE]earn them.

If there is anything within the workplace environment that is unacceptable to the employee, if they can not be negotiated around, and it is to the employee's disatsfaction then they can show their contempt in the usual manner.

I don't mean to appear heartless or unsympathetic to the OP/their OH, I have been on both sides of this argument in the past.

In these times of economic strife, where often companies are struggling to survive (we do not know what sacrifices the Directors are making - I know one guy with a firm employing 50 staff has not taken any salary since May in order to keep the business going) sometimes we have to bite our lip and be grateful for having a job.

A bit of respect on both sides goes a long way.

Can't work out why you used the word contempt?

There are many people making sacrifices in order to keep businesses afloat and I would hope that he OP's OH and his employer can reach an amicable compromise.

SarahLou

Thanks to everyone who has taken the time to reply here - "thanks" are coming your way once I've replied to this

Agree with practically everything that has been said - of course my hubby is pleased he is still employed, especially in these difficult times. He's done nothing but help this company he works for - often going out of his way to do helpful things for them (certainly not in his job description). Even going out of his way to help raise money for the charity that essentially oversees the premises his office is based in (don't want to give too much away about where he works!) But yes, my hubby is pleased to be employed and has done nothing but been helpful. He isn't the type to kick up a fuss - but to answer one persons question - his colleagues aren't either. The longer this is going on, the worse it is getting (as per those who've seen the original thread I posted some time ago - these issues have been ongoing and are, quite frankly, getting worse).

His colleagues are all keen on whinging/b*tching to one another but when my hubby suggests they get together and actually tell the bosses about their concerns, thats when they all chicken out. Probably one major reason why things aren't improving.

I personally think that the OPs partner is being taken for a ride. Does he enjoy his job apart from this, or is it ruining it for him?

My hubby loves his job, on the whole, his occupation is his first and only choice since leaving school to start his degree some years ago - he is very lucky to be employed in the field he always wanted to be in. Many people aren't so lucky. But, I must say, I've never seen him quite so annoyed/angry/upset by it all as his recent problems with his bosses - it really is getting him down. In his words "they've got me between a rock and a hard place".

Can you give us more info on the company - does it have an HR dept or is it unionised for example? Also, what are the chances of getting the other people to agree to stand behind your husband so the complaint is a 'group' one?

Sadly there is no HR dept (the company is only small - employing something in the region of 15-20 ish people roughly at any given time). There is no union. Re the bit about people standing up together as a group - see above.

As for whether he's been job hunting for the past year or so - he certainly has been, more so the past few months when things have got considerably worse than the problems posted in that original thread I started some months ago. Like everyone though, he hasn't had much luck finding any other jobs to go for.

Well I guess I'm in the minority here but I really can't see what the problem is and tbh, it sounds as if you and your OH are nit picking.

You've admitted in your other post that OH works in a field that has been hit by the recession hard so surely he would prefer to be working (where ever in the country) than be sat in the living room unemployed.

I'm also guessing that whoever is employing the services of your OH's firm, then they want the work starting first thing monday morning and not after the boys have managed to work their way through the traffic.

Whilst I can understand the inconvenience of him going sunday, I can also understand why his employer won't pay for him to go in his own car.

Re: that last sentence - I can see their point too BUT surely they should recompensate my hubby (and his colleagues) for their time to travel on the Sunday? Given they arent contracted to work weekends routinely, why should they have to do this? He'll be setting off at about 1-2pm on Sunday unless something changes in the meeting he is having today with his bosses about this. So essentially half of a Sunday will be wasted by travelling down with his colleagues in the works vehicle. Why should he do this for free? I really don't understand why he should be expected to.

Also, just to add another point, he had a message from one of his colleagues late last night (one who has been doing this job for 5 weeks now, travelling down each Sunday), this person said he'd have to get himself to a train station some 12 miles away for 1pm ish on Sunday for him to be there for them to pick him up in the works vehicle. And guess what? He won't get paid a penny towards his parking fees for the week either as his car will be there for a week unless I can sort out a way to pick it up (and as I'll be at work on Sunday, I can't just give him a lift to this "pick up point") - the pick up point of choice (by them) will come with a fee in the region of £7 a day!!

grastgirl

Possibly a strange question, but why are they going so early? I would have thought that 280 miles on good roads would be about 5-5.5 hours (especially with more than one driver, so they don't have to stop for long), leaving at 2pm means they get there at 7.30 at the latest. Surely 2.5 hrs more at home would be preferable for them all, and might make it possible for you to take say an hour off from your job to sort out the child care.

Personally I'd have thought they should be meeting at their notmal place of work, so they can park there for the week if necessary.

dizzyblonde82

Pete111 wrote: »

Oooo Look! - a parrallel (inverse) universe!!

If your company pays out for you on that basis DB then kudos to you for having your boss wrapped round your little finger! - most employers would laugh the 'before 8.50' demand out the room! I know I would...

I don't have my boss wrapped around my little finger. I work for the NHS and there are policies in places stating that any extra time travelling outside of normal working hours can be taken as time in lieu.

The 8:50 time is not a demand, it takes me 10 minutes to get to my regular place of work so any meetings which require longer travel time I take the time back at a later date, this is also written in a policy and is applicable to all NHS staff within my organisation.

DKLS

£10 subsistence is a ruddy joke, In the past 3 roles I have always had £28 evening subsistence and up to 1k or more if entertaining clients, not that I always spent that, some night I would just fancy a bag of chips, but thats not the point, if a company is sending you to work from home you should have the same levels of comfort as you would at home and some compensation for being away from your family.

SarahLou

Hubby has just phoned...

Re: the bit about meeting at their place of work - thankfully that is now happening so that at least saves him a fortune on parking fees at their original planned pickup point. So thats a small relief.

As for why they're leaving so early... that has been resolved too, they're now leaving at 5pm ish. So thats better and also means I can just about be home to take over the child minding. Phew.

However. Get this. The vehicle they're going down in (the works vehicle) isn't having the petrol paid for either because (and you'll laugh at this) - his bosses are claiming that because one of his colleagues' parents lives in this particular part of the world that they're travelling to, they don't need to pay petrol as its in her interest to go and see them while shes down in the area(!!!!!!!!!!!) So they're not paying for the petrol for that reason - what a cop out.

Sure, I dare say she will visit her parents while she's in the area but why not pay for the petrol? The job is still going ahead - and why should the other colleagues going in this vehicle have to chip in for the petrol? It makes no sense.

Sadly my hubby isn't able to have a meeting today with his bosses about all these problems as all three bosses are out of the office all day for some meeting somewhere else. :mad: (Despite it being a planned meeting that has been arranged so that my hubby could express his concerns and problem with this Sunday arrangement).

And to top it off, hubby had a phone call this morning from the boss in question who has organised this particular piece of work those 280 miles away. This boss told him that he could travel down in another works vehicle on the Monday morning but he'd have to set off at 1am. And, although they'd allow him to fill up at the local garage which would mean it would be free to get down there (assuming he could do it on one tank of fuel), they weren't going to compensate for his journey home on Friday - so it would cost him even more as this vehicle is a gas-guzzler.

And leaving at 1am is a bit ludicrous if you ask me - how many of us leave at 1am and not get paid for it? Or time off in lieu? I know I wouldn't be best pleased about that.

So hence hubbys decision to just go with the flow and travel down on the Sunday. (Just a shame he won't get any compensation for this inconvenience).

It is very annoying to hear that his bosses haven't even made the effort to go ahead with this meeting with him.

Also, apparently this boss has claimed that "the fact that you can't afford the petrol to get yourself to site is of no consequence to me" (fair point - but fact is, they've made it very difficult for him to go down with the works vehicle on a Sunday when they shouldn't even be giving their time up on a Sunday!!)

And that he claimed he didn't know I worked weekends. (Which is a complete and utter load of twoddle - I know this man myself, he's known about my job for about 2 years now). So thats a cop-out in itself.

lucylucky

The business will not pay for a company vehicle to be fuelled while travelling to a place of work?

Very odd.

How is the fuel normally paid for?

SarEl

Ah, now that would be slightly different - no employee can be forced to pay out of their own pocket to fuel a company vehicle. So the company would need to pay for that, or arrange suitable reimbursement (I think I'd want money up front - I wouldn't trust them, to pay up after the event).

SarahLou

I know! Its ludicrous! Its like 12 months (ish) ago when they suggested two members of staff had to stop at one persons families house as they lived in the area. (And no, I'm not joking!)

Person A (parents lived in a certain part of the country) and Person B stopped at persons A's parents house (and the company didn't pay any money to the parents - and saved the company putting them up in a B&B) :eek: If I'd been those parents I'd have told the company to stick it. I suppose they must've been happy to do it or else they wouldn't have done but how ludicrous is it that the company even contemplated this arrangement? Hubby and a colleague has recently been on a 3 weeks job in Wales where my parents live - I was quite relieved when they weren't asked to put hubby and colleague up for 3 weeks as my dad would've told his bosses exactly where to stick that plan :rotfl:

Normally, if its in the area, they fill the vehicles up at a certain local garage where they have an account so thats how it works locally. Otherwise, if its nationwide travel, they get the money put into their accounts by BACS so one person on the job is responsible for "paying" for the diesel that way - normally works out OK but for whatever reason on this job that isn't happening. (Excuse from his boss is that on the whole, he didn't cost the job properly when he tendered for the work). (This happens quite often).

The other regular problem with this company is that when they say they'll pay by BACS for things like petrol, the £10 subsistence a night, etc, they often don't pay it in advance. The hubby has had it through today for his subsistence of £10 a night. But chances are, it'll not actually clear until Mon/Tues so thats another ongoing problem. Often they don't get paid it into their accounts for weeks (sometimes months) meaning they're out of pocket for x number of weeks/months. This is the norm.

Re the person who says £10 subsistence is stupid.... you'll laugh at this. £10 is the best they get - £10 is normally only paid if they're in self catering accomodation (so they can get breakfast, lunch and dinner or £10) - if they're in B&B, they normally only get £5 a day because the company claims that because they're getting their breakfast then £5 is normally sufficient for lunch and dinner. I would love to know how you're meant to get 2 meals for £5 a day. This is the norm though. So £10 a day for them on this job is actually relative "luxury" :rotfl: