Any "gina ford" followers out there?

Rainey_LB

I loved the Gina Ford book, although I didn't follow the routines to the T, used it as a guide.

My DD was breast fed and went about 3 hours between feeds, my DS was bottle fed and went 4 hours.

I just made sure I started each day at 7 and started bedtime at 6.30 so my DD was in her cot at 7pm and didn't let her sleep through/past any feeds......at 7 weeks she was going through the night, until she was about 12 weeks I would give her a dream feed at about 10pm, but she never woke for this.

I didn't read the Gina Ford book til my DS was about 4 months, he had no proper routine and I couldn't get him to settle. The book to me made so much sense, I did do the controlled crying, I found it very difficult at first as your instinct is to love and protect them and not them get upset. However within 10 days he was in his routine at bedtime and did not cry just knew after bath it was bedtime and went down in his cot it was like a miracle to me.

With my DD I started when she was a few weeks old and I never had a problem putting her down for a nap and the routine followed very quickly.

My sister-in-law, on the otherhand couldn't bear to let her baby cry always gave him a bottle or cuddle him to sleep.....baby is now 9 still has no routine and still finds it difficult to sleep, not to mention having to have all his top teeth removed at the age of 4 beacuse or erosion from the juice at night......I would go for a few days of controlled crying any day.

Thing is when you have a baby EVERYBODY has advice, I found it quite overwhelming all the conflicting advice from well meaning friends, family, health professionals etc...I would have gone mad if I had not read that book, it really worked for me becuase I took the bits from it that were right for me and my baby. You'll find your way. Good luck

JBD

Hi, I have never read Gina Ford but I did look after my babies according to a routine.
When you say your baby is taking 6 oz's do you mean formula? Really, feeding once every 3 hours is quite normal for a baby this age. If you want to stretch it to 4 hours you will possibly need to try a 'hungry baby' formula. I don't know how this will affect the reflux.
Pigpen is right, leaving your baby to cry for up to an hour will probably make the trapped wind worse. She may also get too upset to feed properly. I also agree, you may actually be giving her a little bit too much at each feed. Perhaps try her with an oz less and see how she gets on?
Best of luck, hope she settles soon.

Rainey_LB

JBD wrote: »

Hi, I have never read Gina Ford but I did look after my babies according to a routine.
When you say your baby is taking 6 oz's do you mean formula? Really, feeding once every 3 hours is quite normal for a baby this age. If you want to stretch it to 4 hours you will possibly need to try a 'hungry baby' formula. I don't know how this will affect the reflux.
Pigpen is right, leaving your baby to cry for up to an hour will probably make the trapped wind worse. She may also get too upset to feed properly. I also agree, you may actually be giving her a little bit too much at each feed. Perhaps try her with an oz less and see how she gets on?
Best of luck, hope she settles soon.

Although I followed Gina Ford, I never left either or my babies to cry for more than 10 minutes, an hour is excessive. My DS was a really sucky baby and I ended up giving him a dummy. He would of drank as much milk as I gave him I think he just found the sucking motion comforting, but was equally happy after a full feed with the bottle being replaced with a dummy, thus meaning his stomach wasn't being overfilled and not so much then needing to come back up!!

bylromarha

gratefulforhelp wrote: »

Tried it and still feel guilty about it, DD1 is 7 now...

Seriously still feel guilty 7 years on? Why? Is your child mentally, emotionally and physically scarred from the experience? Let it go.

OP - we Forded both ours, but neither had reflux, so I can't offer advise on the specifics. Hopefully Golden Swan will be back when they have a bit more time.

I do agree that it's a shock the first time you try to access GF website and find you have to pay :eek:

All the best.

Rockporkchop

I am a huge fan of Gina Ford but I didn't start her routine properly until my LOs were 20 weeks, and we are still on it now they are 2 years old. As you said, she recommends going 4 hours between feeds but my babies were never able to go for more than 3 hours and there was no way I was going to let them cry with hunger. I remember too well the pain of hunger from when I was pregnant and couldn't get something to eat straight away and I would never put my baby through that pain. Stick to the 3 hours if that's what your LO needs, just adapt her routine to suit you. I wouldn't use a dummy either to try to stop her hunger as that will make her take in more air.

Two of mine had severe reflux and trapped wind and I can highly recommend using Dr Browns bottles, which saved my sanity, and also using a tummy tub to bathe her in every day (they start burping literally the minute they sit in it). You can get them from Mothercare or sometimes on ebay, or if you are anywhere near E18 you are very welcome to have my one as it is just taking up space. Also I found that changing formula helped immensely (I was using Aptamil and swapped to SMA Gold which seemed to work better with the Gaviscon for us). There is also a reflux support thread on www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum which is a huge source of advice and support.

As she is 7 weeks old you can also use gripe water for the trapped wind, either put it in her bottle or get a little syringe from the chemist and give it to her after the feed. Also remember that with a reflux baby you should never lie them flat - try to feed them almost upright, put a cushion under the head end of their changing mat so it is not flat, raise their cot at one end or get a special reflux pillow, and even when you are cuddling them, keep their top half raised. I do feel for you as it is awful having a reflux baby but I found that by doing all of the above it did become manageable.

chumbasmum

I have to say I also followed Gina Ford. I tried too hard with my first and it could be quite stressful but had a watered down method with my second (neither had colic though).

I think that some of her sleep routines are actually more impressive than her feeding routines. Both of my two went for a nap in afternoon and are both still good at going to bed (now 4 and 6 years.)

I met a good health visitor who was the mother I could have done with. When I thought that my child wouldn't eat/ sleep at times when I knew he was tired etc she just looked me in the eyes and said he is mucking you about 'just kindly but firmly put him to bed'. It was the down to earth support that just worked wonders.

I like some of the books (baby whisperer lots of people swore by) because unlike people's advice you had time to read it and make your mind up whilst people offering advice could tend to become a bit miffed if you decided to smile but ignore them.

I never left mine to cry but then there is a difference between settling them back and then leaving them.
Good luck. It will get easier.:o

hurricanewyn

I don't know much about Gina Ford, but can recommend the Dr Brown's bottles - they were expensive, but I'd have paid three times as much to keep DD painfree - you can buy a single one if you want to give them a try without paying out for a lot of them at once

moo842

i too followed gina ford, and had alot of abuse about it from other Mums who thought it was cruel!! My DD slept from 10pm till 7 at 2 weeks old, and from 7-7 at a couple of months old! It was wonderful as she is the youngest of 3 thre routine gave me my sanity!
it was hard to keep her awake when she shouldn't be napping, and to stretch her feeds but once she was used to it, and fell into the routine it worked a real treat. I could take the kids out to the park and know when she neede to sleep and feed, so i could avoid these times.
She too had reflux and would not slreep in her buggy as she couldn't bear being on her back, so i could avoid her being in her buggy sat nap times.
If you want to try the routine then ignore others and give it a try. The only advice i would give anyone is to ignore all advice YOU KNOW BEST!! If it will be best for you then it will be best for baby!!

GoldenSwan

Hi Cookie Monster,

I have a feeling this post may end up being an essay and long winded but it is written with the best of intentions. Apologies in advance. I have edited my post so much as i had loads of my own experiences and horror stories about the way i and my dd were dealt with but on rereading felt it wasn't relevant or helpful.:o

As i said in my earlier post, both my eldest two had severe silent reflux, i have full empathy that you and your little one are going through this too.

With regard to those who have negative opinions or comments to make about Gina just ignore them, i truly believe that unless you have lived through reflux, it is impossible to have any comprehension of how hard it is.

Yes, most new parents get by using mothers instinct but by the time my eldest was diagnosed i had no instinct left, due to sheer and absolute physical, mental, and emotional exhaustion.

There are shedloads of parenting schools of thought out there, but none of them are any good if your baby is in persistant, repetitive pain.

The key to getting through this is managing your babies pain. To help you with this some more history would be useful, to gain an idea of how severe the reflux is.

When did you first recognise that something wasn't right?

When was the reflux diagnosed?

Don't want to teach you to suck eggs but do you understand the biology of reflux? This can help you figure out how to optimal positioning etc.

Who diagnosed it?

Who prescribed the gaviscon?

How much gaviscon at each feed?

How long have you been using it and have you found it helps?

What pattern does the reflux take, ie is it after each feed? How soon and for how long?

How upset does your baby get? can you put a score on it eg if normal baby hungry cry is 1 and if 10 is that you think your baby is in absolute agony what level would you put your babies cry at?

Describe your babies body behaviour during an episode of reflux.

Have you got a follow up appointment to increase meds if gaviscon isn't enough?

I had a nightmare to get anyone to listen to me that there was something wrong with my little one and her reflux was so severe she only slept for a max of 20mins at any time for a total of about 2hrs per 24 hr period. The rest of the time she was screaming apart from the actual feeds.
She needed a lot of meds to control her pain.

Other than meds there were a few things i found helped with breakthrough pain.

Positioning is of utmost importance. Keep upright for at least an hour after each feed. I found my dd slept much better in her car seat but hated putting her in it due to concern for her back. When i discussed this with a consultant he reassured that if it meant i got some sleep and therefore better able to cope with her to just let her sleep in it. As he said, she spent 9 months curled up in your tummy after all.

You can put books etc under the legs of her cot at the head end so her mattress is still flat but her head is higher than her tummy, IYSWIM. I had numerous blankets etc between the base of the cot and the mattress to increase the angle further. With careful folding and placement you can minimise the bend in the mattress itself.

Babies with reflux generally sleep much better on their tummy as their body weight stops the feed/acid coming back up. Obviously this goes against cot death advice so last resort and after discussion with professionals.

Putting pressure on the babies tummy also helps when they are in pain. It acts as the top stomach sphincter should. If you have a shelf like bussom put them looking over your shoulder as though you are burping them. I don't have a shelf like bussom and eventually realised that the following holds gave my dd some relief:

1) Put baby sitting on one knee facing to your side, with their legs between your two knees. (Ie so the babies two feet are pointing towards your thigh of the leg they are not sitting on) Place your hand across their chest, so that your thumb would be under one armpit and first finger under the other if your hand was big enough. Sit them slightly forward but upright so that your hand across the chest is supporting their weight. This is using their own body weight to act as enough pressure to stop that acid bubbling up the oesophagus and burning. It also stops any worry that you may be applying too much pressure. You can with your other hand rub their back in a gentle rthymic circle. This can help wind them, comfort them, and i do think it calms them form both a physical and emotional point of view. I also found it helpful as it gave me something to focus on when i was fit to tear my hair out in desperation. Don't do the patting thing, it can cause that acid to slosh about and cause more pain.

2) This hold is useful for when you need to get something else done, as it leaves you with one hand free and while babe is little its easy to walk around with them in this position. It uses the lower arm to apply that pressure on the top stomach sphincter. With babies head at your elbow, and your hand holding them on the nappy area between the legs, put baby lying face down on the inside of your lower arm. It sounds odd, and its really hard to describe but it works really well. To get into this position sit baby on your knee, with her back to you. From over babies shoulder put your hand between the legs, with their head on the inner side of your arm. Your inner arm will be against baby. Gently lean forward, stand up and you should end up with babies back and bum facing the ceiling and them looking at the floor. you should be able to distribute the babies weight so you feel secure holding them this way. Again it is important to hold your arm so your hand is lower than your elbow to keep the babies head above their stomach, minimising that acid flowing back up.


Don't jiggle baby up and down they way they do on tv. This will only slosh that acid around and cause them agony. It is what any well meaning person does with a crying baby to settle them but its one of the worst tings for a reflux baby.

I underestimated how long it would take me to type this, and its late, i need my bed. I have more pointers on reflux and Gina, if this post and my waffle hasnt put you off:o i have focused on how to cope with the reflux until you get the pain managed as there is no point trying to put a routine in place when baby is in agony. Its akin to go to a heavy metal gig when suffering with a migraine!

I am happy to add more over the weekend but if you could answer my questions above and give more history it would be useful. I would love to help you as i felt so alone and rubbish when we were going through it and its just not recognised enough. Through experiencing it, and talking to others i have realised how common it is but how little support for parents there is. i often vowed to set up some kind of support group but life got in the way. One day...when my babies are older and i can do it efficiently....
Please forgive any typos, eyes say its bedtime!

Golden Swan.

Cookie_monster_7

Thank you so much for staying up and typing all that when you were so tired, that is really kind of you. It sound like you had a much harder time of it that I am having but it is still hard so I really appreciate all your help. I have answered you questions. When I have managed to space out the feeds a bit more (because we've been out and about and on the move) she has coped with her feeds betterso I'd like to replicate that at home but it is difficult to get onto the gina routine.

GoldenSwan wrote: »

When did you first recognise that something wasn't right? When she was about 2 weeks old

When was the reflux diagnosed? At 5 weeks

Don't want to teach you to suck eggs but do you understand the biology of reflux? This can help you figure out how to optimal positioning etc. My understanding is that the sphincter is immature and the stomach contents just goes back up the oesophagus, so keeping them upright and with their back straight is the best thing to do. Is that right?

Who diagnosed it? HV and then gp

Who prescribed the gaviscon? GP

How much gaviscon at each feed? One sachet

How long have you been using it and have you found it helps? I've been using it for about 10 days and it has helped with the reflux but she can only have 6 doses in 24 hours and she's on 7 feeds a day so we have one feeds where she is still really sick! She is still suffering with terrible pain from trapped wind (I think). The discomfort has been going on since birth. I breastfed for 3 weeks and the pain started after a few days.

What pattern does the reflux take, ie is it after each feed? How soon and for how long? With the gaviscon she's not really refluxing (I think) I'm assuming the pain is from trapped wind but now you have me thinking it may still be reflux but because she's not bringing anything up I thought it was wind. After a feed she starts to moan and make pushing noises and arch her back and her tummy goes really hard, after about 10 mins of this she starts to cry and this can go on for a couple of hours when I eventually get her to sleep.

How upset does your baby get? can you put a score on it eg if normal baby hungry cry is 1 and if 10 is that you think your baby is in absolute agony what level would you put your babies cry at? 5

Golden Swan.