How much rent should I expect to get back

Pickle_123

Hi,

I moved out of my rented 2 bed house a month ago following a relationship break up. We'd heard nothing back from the landlady and then when I got home from my holiday yesterday I had a message from my ex to say that she had been in touch and would be returning £592 of our original £1080 deposit.

We'd lived in the property for 4 and half years and had looked after it. We got it professionally cleaned before we left. I haven't spoken to the ex yet so don't know the exact reasons for holding back £500.

I don't know anyone else who has lived somewhere for as long as we have so am unsure what we should have expected to lose. Is £500 a reasonable amount for that long? (this maybe a vague question!) The frustrating thing is that we know she's planning to have a mass of building work done including rebuilding the kitchen. So for example one of the items I do know she's charging us for is a catch on a window that broke in the last few days of our tenancy. Its a window that I know is being removed and replaced anyway!

Anyway if we aren't happy with what she's taking off us is there any way of disputing it without it costing us a fortune?

Could of really done with out having to deal with this as well as the break up!

Any advice greatly appreciated!

G_M

1) there is no amount you should 'expect' to lose/
2) you should return the property to the landlord in the same condition you found it in, less wear and tear. If you do this, nothing should be deducted
3) If the LL deducts anything from the deposit, she should a) specify what it is for and b) show quotes/receipts for any work ie repairs, cleaning, whatever
4) did you only sign one contract initially, and them move to a periodic tenancy, or have you signed subsequent contracts? Reason being that since April 2007 any new tenancy needed to have the deposit lodged in a recognised scheme. Was yours?
5) if your deposit is in a scheme, there is a dispute resolution process
6) if not, and you cannot reach agreement with the LL over deductions, you can go to the small claims court

Pickle_123

Thanks for those tips. Had a bit of an update and now found out what she's trying to take the money off for.

1. Bins not being emptied (which is fine although it was just our general bin bags as the bins are on a 2 week cycle so hadn't been collected)
2. Curtains needed cleaning (fine I forgot about these)
3. Oven, dishwasher and washing machine need cleaning (we got these professionally cleaned but if she wants to get them cleaned again it shouldn't be much to do)
4. The garden hadn't been looked after and needs revamping for a new tennant (disagree, I tidied the garden up, weeded and pruned back the shrubs - it definitely dosen't need a revamp!)
5. Window catchment broken (fine although it was on a window we'd been told was being removed)
6. Downstairs carpet needs cleaning (despite her telling us not to bother cleaning this carpet because of the renovations we got it cleaned. The carpet was pretty grubby when we moved in and she said she would replace it but never did it)
7. Upstairs carpet has marks on it and needs replacing (this is the one I'm most annoyed about, it has general wear and tear marks on it following a clean and if the downstairs carpet doesn't need replacing then upstairs definitely doesn't. It was brand new when we moved in.)

She's changed her mind on doing the renovations because they are too expensive and it feels that we are getting the raw end of the deal because of that.

The ex is going to speak to her and see if she'll negotiate on any of it but I'll get him to ask her about receipts because she's not provided any quotes its all based on what the person who did the check out inspection said.

We got the property with an agent and then renewed the contract a year later in 2007. In 2008 we transfered to just renting directly from the LL but never got a contract to sign (I know I should have pushed for one) so I'm not sure where our deposit was held. I had a look on the Tennacy Deposit Scheme and it seemed expensive to go through the dispute process.

We had a good relationship with our LL but sometimes she can be a law unto herself! She tried to blame us when the bath floor needed replacing following a leaking bath that we had told her about constantly for 2 years!

Fang_3

Pickle_123 wrote: »

Thanks for those tips. Had a bit of an update and now found out what she's trying to take the money off for.

Right.

Pickle_123 wrote: »

1. Bins not being emptied (which is fine although it was just our general bin bags as the bins are on a 2 week cycle so hadn't been collected)

Dispute. She can't expect you to pay to empty the bins when the council tax pays for this.

Pickle_123 wrote: »

2. Curtains needed cleaning (fine I forgot about these)

Fair enough. Tell her to present you with a professional quote and then check it out.

Pickle_123 wrote: »

3. Oven, dishwasher and washing machine need cleaning (we got these professionally cleaned but if she wants to get them cleaned again it shouldn't be much to do)

If you have the receipts for this tell her to whistle.

Pickle_123 wrote: »

4. The garden hadn't been looked after and needs revamping for a new tennant (disagree, I tidied the garden up, weeded and pruned back the shrubs - it definitely dosen't need a revamp!)

If she wants a revamp then she can pay for it herself out of her own money, not yours.

Pickle_123 wrote: »

5. Window catchment broken (fine although it was on a window we'd been told was being removed)

Again, get a quote and see proof that the window's been fixed before you pay.

Pickle_123 wrote: »

6. Downstairs carpet needs cleaning (despite her telling us not to bother cleaning this carpet because of the renovations we got it cleaned. The carpet was pretty grubby when we moved in and she said she would replace it but never did it)

You have a receipt from the carpet cleaners so tell her to whistle.

Pickle_123 wrote: »

7. Upstairs carpet has marks on it and needs replacing (this is the one I'm most annoyed about, it has general wear and tear marks on it following a clean and if the downstairs carpet doesn't need replacing then upstairs definitely doesn't. It was brand new when we moved in.)

She can whistle for this.

Pickle_123 wrote: »

She's changed her mind on doing the renovations because they are too expensive and it feels that we are getting the raw end of the deal because of that.

The ex is going to speak to her and see if she'll negotiate on any of it but I'll get him to ask her about receipts because she's not provided any quotes its all based on what the person who did the check out inspection said.

We got the property with an agent and then renewed the contract a year later in 2007. In 2008 we transfered to just renting directly from the LL but never got a contract to sign (I know I should have pushed for one) so I'm not sure where our deposit was held. I had a look on the Tennacy Deposit Scheme and it seemed expensive to go through the dispute process.

We had a good relationship with our LL but sometimes she can be a law unto herself! She tried to blame us when the bath floor needed replacing following a leaking bath that we had told her about constantly for 2 years!

Effectively a new tenancy was created in 2008 so she should have protected your deposit. She will be liable to return three times that amount in compensation for not doing so, as well as the return of your original deposit and interest and court costs, so threaten her with that.

G_M

Fang makes some good points, but I disagree with some.
You should indeed be requesting how much the LL is claiming for each item.
And yes, you should be requesting quotes/receipts.
I also agree that where you have receipts for cleaning YOU have done, you should send her copies to show further cleaning is not necessary.

Additionally though, consider whether each item is a) justified (ie not just wear and tear and b) provable. Is there an inventory, with photos, describing the condition when you moved in? If not, how is the LL going to prove that, for example, the curtains and carpets are dirtier now than at the start? Or that the garden is messier? As for the window - did you break the catch? If yes, fair enough you should pay. If not, you should not.

As for the contract, I disagree with Fang. You last signed a new contract as I understand it in 2007. If this was BEFORE April 4th, then the deposit does not need to have been registered (if after April, it should have been).

In 2008, the landlord ceased to employ an agent. However this has no effect on your contract which was with him, not the agent. The contractual arrangement between the LL and the agent is not (legally) your concern. It is only of practical concern to you inasmuch as you presumably paid the LL VIA the agent, and the LL dealt with repairs etc VIA the agent.

When your 2007 fixed term contract expired, you moved to a periodic tenancy which is simply a continuation of the contract you signed in 2007. The date then, is April 2007 - did you sign before or after?

tbs624

Good post G_M but just a couple of add ons:

G_M wrote: »

As for the contract, I disagree with Fang. You last signed a new contract as I understand it in 2007. If this was BEFORE April 4th, then the deposit does not need to have been registered (if after April, it should have been).

my highlighting. *6th* April is the relevant date

G_M wrote: »

When your 2007 fixed term contract expired, you moved to a periodic tenancy which is simply a continuation of the contract you signed in 2007. The date then, is April 2007 - did you sign before or after?

It's whatever date the deposit was received by/on behalf of the LL.

Pickle_123

This is all proving very interesting!

I'll get all our receipts together and also ask for receipts from her.

I'm intrigued to know who would have to prove or asess "wear and tear" or whether the items are "justified"? I have a horrible feeling this is all going to come down to differing opinions of wear and tear.

G_M there is an orginal inventory that I have (we've been told that the checkout was done using this and taking in to consideration the garden and bathroom revamp she did 2 years ago) There aren't any photo's. The green downstairs carpet is mentioned as having grey traffic wear and marks on it. I find the inventories and checkouts a bit hit and miss. Our first place the checkout was great, we were there and the guy went round and told us things we'd missed and could do there and then, all we ended up loosing was a £5 for a missing baking tray we'd binned because it was disgusting. The next place we lived in the check out report we got given made it sound like we'd destroyed the place and I barely recognised it as where we'd been living! The Landlord ended up giving us all our money back because when he went in he said it all appeared to be nothing more than general wear and tear!

Pickle_123

Latest update is that the ex has finally spoke to her (if you want a job done and all that!) and she has point blank refused to talk about it! We decided since we'd had a good relationship with her we would try appealing to her sensible/decent side but she seems to be of the opinion that she's right and there's nothing to talk about.

Not sure what to do know - whether putting it in writing will help but not sure.

sequence

Sue her for the rest. Small claims court is what you need.

RAS

Put it in writing as a Notice before Action.

That should wake her up.

clutton_2

send her a letter before action, giving her 7 days to return the deposit, otherwise you will issue a small claims court action against her

you do have her home address do you ?