Morally/legally: should I pay this lawyer?

insurgente

Hi there. First of all I have no idea where to post this, so please feel free to move it!

Basically, I need to sort out some documents between Brazil and the UK. As I'm poor, don't have cash for a lawyer and don't know any in the UK, I got in touch with a distant relative in Brazil, who has a friend who is a lawyer.

We started talking a little bit by e-mail, and she gave me the odd tip regarding my situation, which was very nice of her. She'd never brought up the issue of money. I had, perhaps naively, thought she was taking a couple of minute out to help a friend. As she'd made phone calls/enquiries for me I asked her if there was anything I could do to help cover her expenses, send some money to Brazil....

Eventually I found out I needed to get a certain document done (by a lawyer). As we'd been talking I asked her IF that was the sort of thing she could do by e-mail and IF SO how much WOULD it cost...

usually it'd take her a few days to reply (i assume she had better things to do) but in this case she got back to me the next day (over the weekend) with the document already done... saying as I was a relative of her best friend, she'd only charge me the equivalent of €720!!!

which essentially I don't have.

Problem is, if she'd told me that was the price before doing, i would've said thanks but I can't afford it... But now she's already sent it, I can't really turn it down. There's no way of her being sure I haven't used it.


So I'm confused, if money was going to come in to play, is a lawyer not ethically required to make that clear from the outset? The cost?
Am I somehow liable to pay this arbitrary amount (I'll ask for an itemised bill) even though price was never discussed?

I know lawyers are expensive and she spent time on me, but this document is tiny (400 words) and not even fully filled in.... plus the fact I'd assumed she'd previously been just giving me some advice by e-mail. I guess the whole time those e-mails/services rendered were racking up...

Equaliser123

Question is - do you wish to risk a falling out?

Hintza

You know the answer to this (morally) so why ask. Unless you want your relatives to pay.

adam.mt

Also potentially two sides to the story!

Obviously you can refuse (and I'd guess you'd have to if you genuinely haven't the money) but I can see one side or the other getting upset over this. Probably best to talk to your relative that recommended the lawyer and ask them to explain your situation with them; then see where it goes from there.

Not sure anybody on here can make a better suggestion than that!

terryw

Old joke time:

Man to Lawyer: How much will you charge to answer two questions?

Lawyer: £50. what is your second question?

Equaliser123

Need to know what was done. May be standard price for certain things (e.g. in England and Wales - £5 plus £2 per exhibit for swear fees, etc).

insurgente

thanks for the replies all, useful

well 'morally' should a lawyer not mention payment at the outset, rather than dropping a large figure out of nowhere?

maybe 'morally' isn't the right word here....perhaps manners

but yea she's the 'best friend' of a member of my family, so don't want to !!!!/rip her off.

i'm waiting on a response from my relative; not to intervene, more to explain to me "what the f*ck" :eek:

i'd actually mentioned money before this document as I didnt want her doing all this and not getting anything back (how stupid i was, haha). but what i could send her is considerably less than 720 euros... she didnt seem to respond. now that she;s actually done the document, the amount I could pay is sort of insulting.... and even if i dont use the document; she's already sent it, she has no idea if i ripped her off and if i used it

i think i'm essentially asking if she can get that amount out of me legally if it came down to it? she's a lawyer, i'm sure she has her ways. however, considering payment wasn't set out at the start....i'm not sure

Equaliser123

What sort of document is it anyway?

CapJ

I think there's a few things to consider:

Is this document definitely worth all this money? Can you check what other lawyers would charge? Remember the 720 could include costs of her own.

English may not be her first language, so she could have taken you saying that you will cover her costs and later asking how much something would cost as an instruction to do it.

Is the amount definitely what you think it is? Brazil uses commas for decimal points and points for 1000 seperators (the opposite to the UK). So 7,20 is 7.20 (or in Reals 1,600 or 1,60 is 1.60 not 1600). You should check there has been no confusion here...

Do you really need the document? If so and 720 is a fair price for it then in my opinion you would have to find a way to pay for it, as you would have done anyway.

insurgente

still waiting to hear back from this relative with some reassuring words before I go hat in hand to the lawyer, hmmm

Not sure about 'worth'. I'm not a lawyer but I'm sure they're expensive (even in Brazil...stupid exchange rate). From my amateur's viewpoint, the document itself is very small and pretty much a template (i need to fill in the details myself)

well I wrote to her in Portuguese as she doesnt speak english...you could be right about that breakdown of communication. I offered out of courtesy to pay her a bit for the phonecalls etc she made (I even naively thought I'd send a nice bottle of Chilean/Argentine wine, haha). But if such a large figure was going to come out of nowhere, I would think there'd be some mention of it beforehand, no?

it seems I'm not in such a massive rush to get this document as I thought...

Fuzzy_Duck

No real advice I'm afraid but I would question her professionalism. Who writes and sends an important document before they'd been paid any money for it, or without any written agreement? With that in mind I would politely explain that you had asked for the price, not for her to do the work, and you simply don't have that much money. You could offer what you can afford as a goodwill gesture, but imo you didn't do anything wrong to feel personally responsible.