Court Residency Order - Costs?

Pimpslider

Bit of a long shot this one, as it could be seen as a bit personel, but, I was wondering if anyone has applied for a Residency Order through the Courts?

The first thing I was thinking about was overall costs? (Solicitors etc). I have also read in places that it can take 6-12 months to obtain it. I would not be eligible for legal aid. I understand the recommended Mediation process prior to this but, again, not the potential costs.

Would be handy to know as I just have one of those feelings I need to be building up a database of information for a future explosion...!!

I am a NRP (Father) with PR, regular access and I pay my dues.

Feel free to PM me if you would rather not divulge to the world.

Many thanks...

HeatherH

I have a joint residency order in place for my son. At the time I was able to recieve legal aid, but I remember the costs being about £5,000. This was all the court and solicitors fees from start to finish. From when I first contacted the solictor to when the final hearing was finished it was 7 months.
Mediation was tried, but ex didn't turn up so was deemed unsuitable. Went for an initial hearing with caffcass, but nothing could be decided between us, so it was sent to have a final hearing. A contract was drawn up between us and the solicitors between hours before the court case, and the judge just had to decide who my son would live with.

Time frame wise, I think it all depends on how co-operative you and your ex are, as well as how busy the solicitors and courts are in your area. If you've got any questions, I'm happy to answer any I think I can help with.

Goodluck

Pimpslider

Holy Moley!!!

Thanks HeatherH.

I am pretty sure that she would not turn up to a Mediation. Did you have a Solicitor at the Mediation? What was the Caffcass process?

clearingout

my costs were around £8k and the whole thing started mid March 09 and ended mid February 10.

Mediation - can be a solicitor with appropriate training but they will not be acting in a legal context in mediation. It is good to try mediation - works for some people.

CAfCSASS is essentially the court social work service. You will need to attend a first appointment with them to see if an agreement can be reached - if it can't, a judge will decide what to do but likely order a report. There are different kinds of report depending on the concerns - some more intense than others. You will see a CAFCASS officer, likely at their offices and likely also at home so they can see you with your child(ren). However, my understanding is that a home visit is not obligatory and doesn't always happen. After the home visit, my ex and I ended up back in separate interviews at the CAFCASs offices and then a report was produced. The report was about 10 pages in length and I felt was quite clever - it reflected all my concerns in a very intelligent way - and then there were recommendations. It is usual that a judge will go with the recommendations if it goes to a final hearing. My ex decided not to fight and we drew up a consent order at this point so didn't have to go to the final hearing. The costs for that would have probably been at least another £1.5 - 2k.

CAFCASs are not a particularly well respected organisation. Few people have good things to say about them. I found them fine, but slow, but I got what I thought was 'right' at the end so I guess I'd be happy with them. They are renound for being biased towards the mother. They are overworked and understaffed - which is why reports are taking months and months. And frankly, in mine and my ex's case, it should never have gone to court. I suspect a good percentage of cases reflect stupidity and stubborness on the part of the couple involved!

Why are you thinking you will need to apply for residency?

Pimpslider

clearingout wrote: »

...I suspect a good percentage of cases reflect stupidity and stubborness on the part of the couple involved!

Couldn't agree more on that front.

All I want is regular consistant contact, but she keeps 'changing the routine' which can't be good for my child. She has now stopped one of the days I see my child and I cannot handle not seeing them as much. I have a meeting with my solicitor in a weeks time.

I guess I feel that if it had to go to court just for me to get regular contact, then surely I may as well go for full custody.

clearingout

...in which case you need to be familiar with the concept of 'status quo'. Judges and CAFCASS are generally reluctant to change things unless you can prove that the way things are being done currently are somehow not in your child's best interests.

Acheiving full residency would therefore be an uphill battle and you'd be very unlikely to win...if your child is at least 8 (you seem to be saying that) her wishes would very much be listened to, although she is perhaps a bit too young for her wishes to be followed contrary to what the parents want.

I guess what I'm saying is don't let a solicitor see the pound signs when you speak to them - this is what happened to my ex. He got himself a fancy solicitor who quite clearly told him what he wanted to hear. And of course, the ex never told him the full story and forgot the papertrail of evidence he was spewing out behind him! It was a disaster waiting to happen - you need to be quite careful about how you go about things and what you intend to acheive.

That said, there are those who would advise you that you should apply for more contact than you're willing to settle at so that you get what you want - if you apply for what you want, you run the risk of ending up with less.

either way, if you had more contact and now have less, a new status quo is being established - the sooner you get to court the better, some would say. Suggest mediation continually - never let anyone say you were a bully and weren't willing to discuss. Don't bring up money - money and children are dealt with entirely separately by the courts. Not paying is not seen as sufficient reason to now allow contact. There is far more to bringing up children than the financial side, however important that may be. Focus on what is best for your child, be child-focused in everything you say, think or do and avoid mud-slinging. Contact is about you and your child, not problems between you and the ex.

Have you spoken with Families Need Fathers? (I think they're www.fnf.org.uk but not totally sure, you could google it if it's wrong). They would be able to advise for free although I have heard some quite radical things come out of one of their branches local to me!

clearingout

and stop with the 'my child', she's 'our' child....!!!!

Pimpslider

clearingout wrote: »

and stop with the 'my child', she's 'our' child....!!!!

Apologies. Just the way I'm feeling at the moment coupled with the way she treats me and 'our' child.

speedster

Pimpslider wrote: »

Couldn't agree more on that front.

All I want is regular consistant contact, but she keeps 'changing the routine' which can't be good for my child. She has now stopped one of the days I see my child and I cannot handle not seeing them as much. I have a meeting with my solicitor in a weeks time.

I guess I feel that if it had to go to court just for me to get regular contact, then surely I may as well go for full custody.

a word of sound advice.

you are barking up the wrong tree mate. a RO will only be granted if there are welfare issues. a bit of messing around with contact is not a welfare issue.

i'm sure the money grabbing leech will tell you otherwise and that a RO is achievable, and thet it will set you back between 10-15k. then when you're potless and you STILL have no RO, they'll tell you that nothing is gauranteed etc, etc. then he'll drive off in his nice new convertible jag.

the best thing you can do is file a C1 (£175) represent yourself (LIP) and get a defined contact order. how old are your children and do you have PR? if not you can tack the application onto the C1.

feel free to pm me if you need any help.

clearingout

Pimpslider wrote: »

Apologies. Just the way I'm feeling at the moment coupled with the way she treats me and 'our' child.

it's really, really hard, I think, in these situations to think of the children as anything other than yours. however, if you're going to court for whatever reason, you need 'our child' to be tripping off the tounge without any trouble. If you correct yourself each time you think or say 'my', it will help! I also found that when I started to correct this, I was much more able to see where my ex was coming from (and he was coming from somewhere way, way, way off the map!). If he'd have been prepared to discuss, things would have been easier for both of us. Sadly, he didn't see the point in mediation - but that was the way he was advised by his solicitor.

As both Speedster and I have said, do we careful with what your solicitor says and make sure they're not telling you the story you want to hear. It's horribly expensive to end up with even less contact than you had.

Pimpslider

speedster wrote: »

...The best thing you can do is file a C1 (£175) represent yourself (LIP) and get a defined contact order. how old are your children and do you have PR? if not you can tack the application onto the C1.

Self representation...interesting, although a daunting thought. Yes I have PR (signed document as never married) and our child is 10.

Where are these C1 forms available from? So feasibly I am looking at obtaining a 'Contact Order' only. Is there a standard/typical format to access? e.g. "you will get one day midweek and one day of the weekend at least".

I think I spoke to my solicitors about 6/7 years ago (when asking about PR) and I asked about residency, and in fairness they simply said I would not get it unless our child was deemed to be in mental or physical danger.