BT Argument

gills19190

Phone line dead on 2 separate occasions. Never had any problems until 2 months ago when line went dead on a Friday afternoon and fixed by Monday after logging fault by mobile. Happened again on Friday but this time fault logged on online and engineer booked. This time I have been told fault is internal wiring problem due to extension connection and am now being charged call out fee.
Q. Can the short cause the line to go down only and not effect
internet connection? Why was this not detected 2 months ago?
Would a problem at the exchange be more likely and if so what is
the best way of proceeding with a complaint to avoid fee?

Mark_In_Hampshire

Did an engineer visit and/or make any changes at your property the first time?

What was the specific reason for the fault which determined your own extension wiring was to blame?

Mr_Oink

A 'loop' (aka 'short') can stop the dialtone / ringing but leave the dsl working. It's not uncommon. BT and most comminications providers make it very clear when a fault is reported that if it's your equipment or wiring, you are liable to be charged. It's that simple. They provide a guide to testing your installation in the BT Phone book and online at their faults reporting section. They even offer a downloadable guide:
http://www2.bt.com/static/i/media/pdf/repair_guide.pdf

Following these steps will, in many cases, spare the blushes and charge of some £130 *and* get the line working again pronto.

Just for the archives / search engines out there:

You can get a break on one leg of the line and the DSL side will still work. You can get a fault on the PSTN (voice) line exchange equipment and still have the DSL work. The BT telephone network is a very low tech thing at a local loop level - battery and light bulb type stuff. Before reporting any fault make sure it is *not* your equipment or wiring. It's not uncommon for filters/sky boxes/anything plugged into the line to go faulty and knock off the dialtone. It's not uncommon for a bit of diy, window cleaning, gutter clearance, hedge cutting, digging, garden bonfire or even insects/ants to cause damage to underground, overhead or external wiring. Most of which BT Openreach perceive to be chargeable.

For those who don't want to run the risk of getting clobbered with a huge charge be aware there are always a number of BT and former BT engineers looking for 'cash' type work to solve these problems for a fraction of the 'official' cost. I know of a few around the country and I'm considering setting up a website listing some of them not currently working for BT. Whilst I appreciate Openreach is a business that needs to make money, you cannot really justify £130 for unplugging an extension lead and walking out of the door. I qualify that by comparing it to skilled trades and domestic appliance repair engineers who don't come close to this for a few minutes work.

gills19190

No engineer visited the property the first time round. Once fault was reported via mobile (not online), I heard nothing from BT. I just kept checking my phone and the line had been restored on the Monday. There was no explanation from BT as to what caused the fault.
Therefore, I assumed that there had been a problem with the Exchange and not my phone socket/extension connection.

Second time fault was logged online which automatically books an engineer to come to your property. Engineer takes off master socket casing and states that external connection was the cause of line failure. He disconnects the extension and says line is fixed.

I just find it odd that both faults occurred late on a Friday afternoon!! Or am I just being paranoid!!!!

Mr_Oink

First of all it will be Openreach that visit. Whilst they are part of the BT group, they are not BT. It's important to understand that concept because they are a separate company. Their customer is BT (who they charge if there is no fault with their network), in turn you are BT's customer - if that makes sense. Think of it like the Electricity Board. They take care of it up to the meter, after that it's yours.

As for the fault itself it easy for an engineer to turn up at a property, access the line at the wall block and see the fault is internal. To be quite honest with most line tests it's really easy to see where the fault is. No matter if the line is miles long, internal faults really stand out. The 'DT' team (diagnostic testing) will *often* close faults off where a line tests OK, but they have spats of doing it if the fault is proved internal and can't gain access. They also charge if the end user makes an appointment, but the engineer cannot gain access. (not in, door not answered etc). They are supposed to 'ring ahead' but it depends on the 'quality' of the engineer you get. Statistically it's good for an engineer to 'comp off' a job and raise a charge - being that Openreach are driven by stats. However, it's also a very bad statistic if you keep re-reporting the fault (at the risk of a charge each time).

The crux is this. If pulling out your extensions or equipment makes the line work again, it's your problem and they are quite justified in charging you. If they have misdiagnosed this then they need to come back and solve this for you if you are sure it is not your issue. Openreach are only responsible up to the NTE5 (master socket) no matter if all the wiring in your home was originally put in by BT or on their behalf. If pulling the extension off of that socket and unplugging your kit clears the fault - it's your issue I'm afraid.

Can I ask where in the UK you are? I may be able to explain the Friday thing.

gills19190

The Exchange would be in the Cambuslang Area, Glasgow.

Mr_Oink

Can't find anything to suggest Edward Scissor hands has been working there of Fridays ;-) and I don't suddenly see any new services being offered at sam knows: http://www.samknows.com/old/broadband/exchange.php?ecode=WSCAM