Funeral costs

Diane_Tarnawski

My Father-in-law passed away last year, my husband was devastated, and to cut a long story short thought the funeral would be paid by the local council - his father was in his 80's in care and the council were very unclear asking for a copy of the funeral bill to 'take care of things'. When my husband questioned them about whether it had to be cremation he was told, just do what you need, and send the costs to them. My husband was in a really bad way and genuinely took it that they would pay the funeral, we arranged everything (basic), and informed the funeral directors to send the bill to council. After 6 months we received communication from funeral directors informing us they required payment, the council denied telling us they would pay, saying we had misunderstood them, so now we are left with the debt and under threat of court action. We have been paying a small amount each month are obviously distressed as it is our father's funeral - we don't want to not pay it, but we cannot afford to pay much at all as we are struggling to keep up financially as it is. The funeral directors said they have no facility for reduced payments. What will happen? Even if taken to court we physically cannot pay anywhere near the amount they want (they agreed to £600 a month), we don't have that to live on. I am so worried, is there anything we can do to prevent it going to court?

jamesd

Assuming cremation and use of an undertaker a basic funeral would cost around a £2,000-£2,500. More for extras like cars. DIY instead of use of a funeral director would reduce the cost. Assuming the bill you have is around that level a small personal loan may be one way to approach this.

If his estate had any value, the funeral costs would come before any distribution of the value of the estate, so you might seek repayment of any money distributed from the estate as one way to help cover the cost.

This county court form and some Payplan guidance is what you would use to support a claim that you could not pay more than a certain amount, so I suggest that you make a copy and fill it out to get some idea of the difference between income and expenses that helps a court to decide what to order you to pay. Note the Payplan guidance that "It is unwise to list any luxuries such as gym memberships, satellite TV, smoking or social activities here as the creditors will not accept these".

The funeral director will normally have had one or more people sign a form saying that they accept responsibility for the funeral cost. That or those people are the ones who are responsible and whose income and expenses should be used.

If you like the result of the calculation you could then inform the funeral director that you've carried out this exercise and offer to pay them the resulting payment amount.

A loan and/or use of 0% credit card for purchase deals followed by 0% balance transfer deals is another way of spreading out the payments to keep them at an affordable level. For the 0% for purchases cards you put as much of your regular spending as possible on the card and use the money you would have spent to pay off the bill.

Virgin, MBNA and some other credit card providers offer the option of a balance transfer from a current account that will pay the money to a current account. Using one of those cards can get a loan for 4% charge that lasts for 14 or 15 months. If that's not long enough a balance transfer can be used at the end of the deal period.

Fruit_and_Nut_Case

Sorry to hear about your problem. I don't think that the "stoozing" area is the best place to ask your question, though. You might like to ask for the post to be moved somewhere where there is the expertise to give you the best answer. Good luck.

margaretclare

I've never heard of 'the council' being made responsible for paying for a funeral - at least, not one where there are relatives. It sounds a bit like the old days, a century or more ago, and pauper graveyards. Even in those cases it would really be the destitute who had no living relatives.

davidbaa68

Hello,

I am an independent funeral director. You say that the funeral director wants £600 per month. How much is the invoice?

It is very unusual for a council to accept responsibility for funeral costs even if the person who has passed away is a resident of a social services care home, and if they did you would have not been involved in making the funeral arrangements as they would have been carried out on a contract basis with a nominated funeral director.

If I was accepting a funeral on the basis of what you proposed I would have made sure that the council were paying the bill before I took the funeral on so this begs the question why did the funeral director take on the funeral without confirming that?

Also a responsible funeral director should ensure that the family can afford the funeral package that they provide for a family.

As the previous poster mentioned if there was any value in the estate that would pay the funeral account first.

Are you receiving any benefits? Is so you would have been able to claim for a funeral payment at the time of the funeral, however you have to have submitted a claim within 3 months of the death occurring. The funeral payment consists of £700 towards the funeral directors charges plus the cremation fee and doctors fees for cremation or the burial fee for burial. If you didn't claim and you feel you were mis-advised you may be able to appeal to the Benefits Agency.

Again as the previous poster implied the person who signed for the funeral arrangements is responsible for the costs if there isn't any value in the estate.

I hope this helps.

David.

Fruit_and_Nut_Case

Very interesting and useful post, David. I hope Diane Tarnawski comes back and sees it.

Shelldean

Just to add when I arranged Nan's funeral a few years ago the funeral director made sure i was aware that by signing on the dotted line I and I alone was responsible for the bill ( i wasn't next of kin) She made this point several times so that even in my greif I was aware that if none of the other rellies or the Insurance didn't pay, it would be me they would chasing for the debt.
So maybe the funera director should've been clearer too??

Ladywriter1968

Diane_Tarnawski wrote: »

My Father-in-law passed away last year, my husband was devastated, and to cut a long story short thought the funeral would be paid by the local council - his father was in his 80's in care and the council were very unclear asking for a copy of the funeral bill to 'take care of things'. When my husband questioned them about whether it had to be cremation he was told, just do what you need, and send the costs to them. My husband was in a really bad way and genuinely took it that they would pay the funeral, we arranged everything (basic), and informed the funeral directors to send the bill to council. After 6 months we received communication from funeral directors informing us they required payment, the council denied telling us they would pay, saying we had misunderstood them, so now we are left with the debt and under threat of court action. We have been paying a small amount each month are obviously distressed as it is our father's funeral - we don't want to not pay it, but we cannot afford to pay much at all as we are struggling to keep up financially as it is. The funeral directors said they have no facility for reduced payments. What will happen? Even if taken to court we physically cannot pay anywhere near the amount they want (they agreed to £600 a month), we don't have that to live on. I am so worried, is there anything we can do to prevent it going to court?

I am sorry for your loss and sorry the council have put you thru this as well.

Ladywriter1968

jamesd wrote: »

Assuming cremation and use of an undertaker a basic funeral would cost around a £2,000-£2,500. More for extras like cars. DIY instead of use of a funeral director would reduce the cost. Assuming the bill you have is around that level a small personal loan may be one way to approach this.

If his estate had any value, the funeral costs would come before any distribution of the value of the estate, so you might seek repayment of any money distributed from the estate as one way to help cover the cost.

This county court form and some Payplan guidance is what you would use to support a claim that you could not pay more than a certain amount, so I suggest that you make a copy and fill it out to get some idea of the difference between income and expenses that helps a court to decide what to order you to pay. Note the Payplan guidance that "It is unwise to list any luxuries such as gym memberships, satellite TV, smoking or social activities here as the creditors will not accept these".

The funeral director will normally have had one or more people sign a form saying that they accept responsibility for the funeral cost. That or those people are the ones who are responsible and whose income and expenses should be used.

If you like the result of the calculation you could then inform the funeral director that you've carried out this exercise and offer to pay them the resulting payment amount.

A loan and/or use of 0% credit card for purchase deals followed by 0% balance transfer deals is another way of spreading out the payments to keep them at an affordable level. For the 0% for purchases cards you put as much of your regular spending as possible on the card and use the money you would have spent to pay off the bill.

Virgin, MBNA and some other credit card providers offer the option of a balance transfer from a current account that will pay the money to a current account. Using one of those cards can get a loan for 4% charge that lasts for 14 or 15 months. If that's not long enough a balance transfer can be used at the end of the deal period.

I have read this and you seem to know a lot of stuff. I have asked various people but not getting a real answer, I guess they dont know what the answer is.

Ok alas to the thread and what the council did to these people.

I am concerned about this area. My Father is 80 years old in a care home. Dont get me wrong, I am not being morbid, just realistic basically. Myself and my husband are in similar situation to as described by persons above with their situation. Husband has debts, Only earning a certain wage and bla bla bla, We to just about manage to keep a roof over our heads to.

My Dad has no money and no assets. He went from council house into the care home with dementia.

We wont be able to afford funeral expenses for him, when his time is up, he is not insured. No one wants to lose any one but its worse when you know you wont have the money for it. I thought I would try and find out in advance, as when it happens I would be to messed up and upset to be able to ask or find out this stuff??? The funeral directors I asked at said they would set up monthly payments with us, but we struggle as it is.

I asked numerous people that if family cant pay will the council or social services pay then? but no one knows for sure. The funeral directors said that the councils wont pay nowadays.

People have sent me sites where you can claim, but you have to be on benefits to claim and we are not. I have been trying to put a little bit a way each month in a bank for this time, but I know I cant save two grand up.

Now I have explained my situation. question is, if family are poor, will the council pay or not?

thanks for your help in advance.

Ladywriter1968

davidbaa68 wrote: »

Hello,

I am an independent funeral director. You say that the funeral director wants £600 per month. How much is the invoice?

It is very unusual for a council to accept responsibility for funeral costs even if the person who has passed away is a resident of a social services care home, and if they did you would have not been involved in making the funeral arrangements as they would have been carried out on a contract basis with a nominated funeral director.

If I was accepting a funeral on the basis of what you proposed I would have made sure that the council were paying the bill before I took the funeral on so this begs the question why did the funeral director take on the funeral without confirming that?

Also a responsible funeral director should ensure that the family can afford the funeral package that they provide for a family.

As the previous poster mentioned if there was any value in the estate that would pay the funeral account first.

Are you receiving any benefits? Is so you would have been able to claim for a funeral payment at the time of the funeral, however you have to have submitted a claim within 3 months of the death occurring. The funeral payment consists of £700 towards the funeral directors charges plus the cremation fee and doctors fees for cremation or the burial fee for burial. If you didn't claim and you feel you were mis-advised you may be able to appeal to the Benefits Agency.

Again as the previous poster implied the person who signed for the funeral arrangements is responsible for the costs if there isn't any value in the estate.

I hope this helps.

David.

After reading above, I will get straight to the point. I am only child, Fathers family don't want to know. Just myself and husband. My Father is 80 years old in a care home, he has no assets nor any money. He went from a council house to the care home. He is not insured.

I wish to find out in advance where I stand exactly with this, cause I will be to upset at the time of it happening to be able to ask advice or questions.

My husband works but I am not. but we dont claim and cant claim any benefits. We just about manage on keeping a roof over our heads and husband has debts. who doesnt these days. Basically we are poor.

My question is. When its his time, who will be liable for the funeral payments?

How can we pay for something if we simply dont have the money?
Do the councils help out or not?

Since you know a lot about this area your opinion would be appreciated.

Any advice you can give me in this area.

I tried to put a bit of money away a month for I doubt I will ever be able to rake it up to 2 grand as we have our own bills and rent goes up every year etc, well you know how it is.

thank you in advance.

Ladywriter1968

Diane_Tarnawski wrote: »

My Father-in-law passed away last year, my husband was devastated, and to cut a long story short thought the funeral would be paid by the local council - his father was in his 80's in care and the council were very unclear asking for a copy of the funeral bill to 'take care of things'. When my husband questioned them about whether it had to be cremation he was told, just do what you need, and send the costs to them. My husband was in a really bad way and genuinely took it that they would pay the funeral, we arranged everything (basic), and informed the funeral directors to send the bill to council. After 6 months we received communication from funeral directors informing us they required payment, the council denied telling us they would pay, saying we had misunderstood them, so now we are left with the debt and under threat of court action. We have been paying a small amount each month are obviously distressed as it is our father's funeral - we don't want to not pay it, but we cannot afford to pay much at all as we are struggling to keep up financially as it is. The funeral directors said they have no facility for reduced payments. What will happen? Even if taken to court we physically cannot pay anywhere near the amount they want (they agreed to £600 a month), we don't have that to live on. I am so worried, is there anything we can do to prevent it going to court?

£600 is a lot of money, we dont even have that to live on either. I believe that even if you are paying a small amount they will have to accept it, the court will say, as long as you are paying something. You should tell the funeral directors that this is the amount you can afford, if they cant accept it then let them pay all the court costs of taking you to court then, I think you will find they will back down and accept your small amounts, they are trying to frighten you into paying to get it cleared up quickly, but honest, you cant pay what you dont have. My husband has debts, he said to them, I can only afford to pay this back monthly, take it or leave it, we also have trouble with the our own council on a previous housing benefit overpayment, they said we would have to pay over £40pm, by time we paid out everything we couldnt, So I said to them, its £20pm or nothing. They do not want to take you or I to court cause it would cost them far more money.

Maybe you should consider going to a solicitor as well and see if you can get legal aid. But I think that if you offer a small amount they will have no choice but to accept this. "as long as you are paying something" I have had friends of friends be in thousands of pounds of debt and only paid a small amount back each month. Just consider this and dont let them bully you. They tried to bully my husband when he owed money. I hope this has helped a little bit. I am no expert but can only advise on own and others experiences of what I know.