Package holiday

aix

I am planning a holiday, but want to make sure I can get a full refund (inc. accommodation) if we're unable to fly out because of ash.

ABTA web site says:

(a) What if the flight is cancelled?

Customers that have booked a package holiday will be offered an alternative by their tour operator. If this alternative is a significant change to the holiday (generally a change of more than 12 hours on a 14-night holiday is considered to be a significant change) then the customer must also be offered the choice of a refund. This is a refund of the full package price, not just the flight element.

This may sound a little silly, but what exactly is a package holiday?

If I go to a travel agent, and book a flight, accommodation and transfers in a single transaction, would this automatically be a "package holiday" as far as these rules are concerned? Does it matter whether the travel agent is an ABTA member and/or is ATOL bonded?

http://www.abta.com/consumer-services/travel_information/ash-faqs

withabix

This is quite a good reference document, as it studies legal judgments in layman's terms:

http://www.berr.gov.uk/files/file43845.pdf

Basically, it is a package if:

1) you were quoted a single price for the holiday and NEVER the component parts
or
2) the price of the holiday was less than the component parts added together
and
3) it comprises transport and accommodation as a minimum (note that if you booked a package that only included the bus from the airport to your hotel + your hotel, then the obligation would only be to get you back to that airport and not back home)


Your example would only be a package if the travel agent only quoted you a single price for the whole trip and didn't tell you the inividual prices of the flights/hotel/transfer at any time OR the total was less than the sum of the parts.

aix

withabix wrote: »

This is quite a good reference document, as it studies legal judgments in laymans terms:

http://www.berr.gov.uk/files/file43845.pdf

Thanks - this is a great document! :T

I now have little doubt that what we've been looking at is a package holiday. We did choose the (scheduled) flight and accommodation separately, but have been quoted a single price for the lot.

Now, who is actually bound by those rules set out on the ABTA web site (specifically, the obligation to offer a refund if the outbound flight is cancelled)? Is that anyone selling package holidays, or just ABTA members etc?

withabix

Anyone selling package holidays is bound by the Package Holiday Regulations.

They don't have to be ABTA members, but they DO need an ATOL Licence.

ATOL regulations and EU Directives are what really provides the protection in this situation, for flight-based holidays.

ABTA members pay into a Bond which is what gets you home when a Tour Operator who is an ABTA member goes bust.

sandiep

Per TUI at present, the general kind of policy (and it is only a general rule of thumb because it's a pretty unique circumstance) is that if it's just your airport that's closed and there are other alternative airports open in the UK, then they may well bus you to the alternative airport, and your holiday would pretty much go as planned, albeit a bit later. Ditto on return.

If all of the UK airspace is closed, or no alternative airports, then it will simply be a case of cancellation and refund, and rebook an alternative holiday.

withabix

sandiep wrote: »

Per TUI at present, the general kind of policy (and it is only a general rule of thumb because it's a pretty unique circumstance) is that if it's just your airport that's closed and there are other alternative airports open in the UK, then they may well bus you to the alternative airport, and your holiday would pretty much go as planned, albeit a bit later. Ditto on return.

If all of the UK airspace is closed, or no alternative airports, then it will simply be a case of cancellation and refund, and rebook an alternative holiday.

This all depends on plane location though.

Most tour operators' planes do 2-3 routes per day in Europe. That plane to Dominican Republic from Glasgow 'tonight' won't be getting you there if it is stuck under an ash cloud in Manchester waiting to go to Palma this afternoon, for instance.

shudd1967

withabix wrote: »

This is quite a good reference document, as it studies legal judgments in layman's terms:

http://www.berr.gov.uk/files/file43845.pdf

Basically, it is a package if:

1) you were quoted a single price for the holiday and NEVER the component parts
or
2) the price of the holiday was less than the component parts added together
and
3) it comprises transport and accommodation as a minimum (note that if you booked a package that only included the bus from the airport to your hotel + your hotel, then the obligation would only be to get you back to that airport and not back home)


Your example would only be a package if the travel agent only quoted you a single price for the whole trip and didn't tell you the inividual prices of the flights/hotel/transfer at any time OR the total was less than the sum of the parts.

Thanks for that, I booked a holiday a few weeks ago (when the last ash chaos was going on) and I found it via the teletext holidays website, that gave me a holiday from a company called holiday heros who have turned out to be Airborn direct.
When I did the search i was looking under holidays, when I phoned the holiday providor they never said it was not a package holiday - however, they did say the holiday at that price had sold out as the (what I now know to be non existant flights) as those flight times had sold out, but there was a better flight time at a slighter higher price.

It was not until I got my invoice (after paying in full) that I even knew it was Airborn and even worse flying with Ryan air!

So how would I stand? I must admit I presumed at the start it was a package holiday? Not going to phone airborn, still really angry with them over the non existant flights and luggage fully included quotes which I am still trying to get answers from them about! ahhh!
( https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2417393 )

Regards

Sarah

Also lets just hope that we do not get more of the same chaos, good luck to everyone planning on travelling in next few months, I really feel for anyone and everyone who spends so much time building up to a holiday, both financially and emotionally only to have all of the stress of the flight situation, wishing everyone peaceful and happy holidays!

aix

withabix wrote: »

Anyone selling package holidays is bound by the Package Holiday Regulations.

They don't have to be ABTA members, but they DO need an ATOL Licence.

ATOL regulations and EU Directives are what really provides the protection in this situation, for flight-based holidays.

Thanks a lot for this -- your explanation has really cleared it up for me.

Babycakes

Be careful because some companies like Onthebeach.co.uk look like package holidays but are actually not. They provide no protection at all if your holiday is cancelled and you will lose all your money.

Don't book with Onthebeach.co.uk or similar companies.

withabix

Babycakes wrote: »

Be careful because some companies like Onthebeach.co.uk look like package holidays but are actually not. They provide no protection at all if your holiday is cancelled and you will lose all your money.

Don't book with Onthebeach.co.uk or similar companies.

IF the holiday comprises travel and accommodation AND you were only quoted one price for the holiday and not the separate components (or the travel + accommodation cost less than the sum of the parts) then it IS a package and is covered by the Package Holiday Regulations (PHR).

Read the BERR document in my post above.

Onthebeach and others will lose any Small Claims Court/MCOL cases where the holiday booking complies with the requirements of the PHR, because there is legal precedent as described/referred to in the BERR document.

Babycakes

withabix wrote: »

IF the holiday comprises travel and accommodation AND you were only quoted one price for the holiday and not the separate components (or the travel + accommodation cost less than the sum of the parts) then it IS a package and is covered by the Package Holiday Regulations (PHR).

Read the BERR document in my post above.

Onthebeach and others will lose any Small Claims Court/MCOL cases where the holiday booking complies with the requirements of the PHR, because there is legal precedent as described/referred to in the BERR document.

Is this a legal document? Who are BERR?