Incorrect HIP/EPC - discovered after moving in

jamestap

Hi All,

I purchased and moved into a new property a couple of months ago - everything pretty much fine and I'm enjoying living in the new place.

One issue has arisen though. The EPC in the HIP states that the property has walls of the type "Cavity wall, as built, no insulation (assumed)" and then goes on to recommend that I have Cavity Wall insulation installed as it would save me ~£106 a year and increase the efficiency of my house, obviously being good for the environment and making it more attractive when I sell it on in the future.

Anyway, I've had a company round to give me a quote for cavity wall insulation and apparently my walls are solid brick with no cavity. Obviously this means I can't have them insulated, save any money on my bills, be kinder to the environment or make my house more efficient and therefore more attractive to future purchasers.

I took the 'assumed' bit from the HIP to mean the insulation status was assumed, not the type of wall.

Do I have any claim against either the seller or the HIP provider?

Thanks,

James

poppysarah

But what's the U value of solid stone?

How old is the house? Does it look like it's modern brick?

silvercar

I thought the HIP providers are liable for what they write.

jamestap

The house was built in 1935.

I guess I'm questioning the value of the EPC if they can either get away with making false claims or using 'assumed' as a get-out-of-jail free card!

I would presume I've got some kind of claim against either the seller (who commissioned the EPC) or the company that produced it?

Thanks,

James

johnson293

When we viewed the house (1975 built) we bought last year, the HIP said that there was no loft insulation. Upon checking in the loft on a viewing, we could clearly see insulation to the underside of the roof. When I queried this with the estate agent, he said that the EPC in the HIP was often a guessing game, based simply upon knowledge of similar aged properties in the area, etc.

However, the house I sold last year was an early 30's semi-detached property, but it did have cavity wall construction, as I had cavity wall insulation installed a few years earlier.

In terms of who is liable (if anyone for this) I would suggest the surveyor or the HIP/EPC provider. I'm not sure how this could be the sellers fault?

clutton_2

if you are to sue someone you must demonstrate a financial loss... what loss have you incurred ?

johnson293

An example of an incorrect EPC on the Q&A's on the link below...

http://www.prodea.org.uk/content/view/28/39/

The EPC is wrong – its says I have wooden floors when they are flags!

The software results can sometimes throw up anomalies especially for very old properties or homes with non-traditional construction or heating systems.
It is not the assessor that awards a rating personally. The software makes some assumptions based on its age and the building regulations in force at that time. These assumptions cannot be overridden by the assessor. Hopefully s/he will be able to talk you through the reasons for the results. They can also submit a side letter to go with the HIP.

So unfortunately looking at that, it appears that some of the assumptions are not human input, but by the software used.

pawpurrs

Sue for what, A potential £100 saving a year on bills, with an outlay that will take many years to recoup, and I really dont think to the majority of people it will make a blind bit of difference to what they will offer on your property. Jeez whats the world coming to, no wonder surveys are so useless when people want to sue and cause trouble over the slightest thing.

alanmilstein

The EPC within the HIP should accurately reflect the construction of the property, assuming that it can be determined.
In most cases the pattern of the brickwork gives the best guide to the type of construction, but this is never 100% accurate nor always possible. If, for instance, the outside walls have been rendered then it might not be possible to determine the construction positively.
In most cases, however, the energy assessor should be able to accurately determine the construction of the property and based on the age of the property the EPC software will decide (based on contemporary building regulations) whether any insulation may be in the walls. Where there is evidence of retro-fitted insulation then the assessor indicates that to the software.
All energy assessors are required to be members of an approved accreditation scheme. The first step, therefore, is for you to follow the instructions on the EPC as to how to make a complaint if you think an error has been made. The assessors scheme will be able to ask the assessor to provide evidence to substantiate the data they used to produce the EPC.
As an auditor for one of the accreditation schems I do see a wide range in the ability of assessors to make accurate assessments of building construction. Sadly this is a function of the deregulated nature of the industry and the poor regulations surrounding companies offerring training to energy assessors.

jamestap

Hi ,

Two losses I can think of:

1) Annual cost of heating the property which will be greater because I can't insulate it

2) The fact I've paid for something that I haven't got. I thought I'd paid for a house with cavity walls whereas I've bought a house with solid walls which, I believe, are generally considered inferior

I'm not necessarily interested in pursuing a claim because of the costs involved and the risk of failure, but I am interested in people's opinions from a technical perspective.

It's annoying that as a buyer/seller you have to pay for numerous surveys/searches if - as it appears may be the case here - they aren't worth the paper they're written on!

Thanks,

James

Milliewilly

jamestap wrote: »

Hi ,

Two losses I can think of:

1) Annual cost of heating the property which will be greater because I can't insulate it

2) The fact I've paid for something that I haven't got. I thought I'd paid for a house with cavity walls whereas I've bought a house with solid walls which, I believe, are generally considered inferior

I'm not necessarily interested in pursuing a claim because of the costs involved and the risk of failure, but I am interested in people's opinions from a technical perspective.

It's annoying that as a buyer/seller you have to pay for numerous surveys/searches if - as it appears may be the case here - they aren't worth the paper they're written on!

Thanks,

James

You will have to work out the increased heating cost minus the cost of cavity wall insulation then decide if its worth pursuing. I would have thought that the wall construction would have been mentioned in your own survey anyway?