Potential loss of entire rental deposit

N79

pyueck wrote: »

This is outragous!!! Two landlords ganging up on the person trying to protect tenants. Please fill me in on my lack of experience of the law and what incorrect information I have given. What gives you the right to make presumptions about me?

I'm sorry you feel it is outragous (sic). We all make presumptions about each other - its part of life. You presume in the above post that I am only a LL (I am also a T) and you presume that my only aim is to undermine Ts protections. See - we all make presumptions.

pyueck wrote: »

Enough of the hate mail against me, I always back up my opinions with statute, something that most posters never do.

pyueck wrote: »

The agent is definately the agent of the landlord and not the tenant. See http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/finding_a_place_to_live/renting_privately/letting_agencies#2 where it explicitly states Letting agencies act on behalf of landlords, not tenants.

I know you will see this as outrageous but I just thought I would give you an example of that attitude (not the contect of your post, which is quite correct). Shelter is not statute, nor are they a legal authority on anything. So where is the statute that you always post to back up your opinions?

I'm sorry if this is teaching you to suck eggs but I would also point out that under English law we have common law. This means that statute is only part of the picture. We must also have reference to custom and practice as indicated by precedent judgements handed down by the courts. Much of English LL and T law comes from cases. For example, the right to repair comes from Lee-Parker vs Izzet - a very important case for the rights of Ts faced with a LL who refuses to carry out repairs.

schnide

N79 wrote: »

[T]he OP has seen a solictor and therefore now has professional advice. Although I don't understand the advice as relayed by the OP I am well aware that I do not have the full facts of the case and I am not going to be unprofessional and comment or question the advice given by a lawyer under the terms of a professional relationship while only in possession of a fraction of the facts.

I am happy to relay any facts that you would further wish to know. To my knowledge I didn't tell the lawyer I saw anything different from what I've said here. Most importantly I would like to know where your advice differs and specifically what it is you're unsure of that was relayed.

The same lawyer was quite happy to tell me that his fees would be £200p/h and although I am confident of my case from everything I've heard so far, I would naturally like to proceed without paying that where possible and as such all your viewpoints are invaluable.

clutton_2

here are some thoughts from Tessa Shepperson on Agency Law (LL&T Specialist solicitor whose book "renting - the essential guide to tenants right" is a very useful source of info)

"If an agent is acting on behalf of a disclosed principal (ie if it clear that he is acting on behalf of a landlord rather than letting his own property) then if the third party wishes to bring a claim then it will be the principal whoh is liable not the agent. So if an agent acts in the letting of a property which subsequently turns out to be in poor condition, and the tenant wishes to make a claim for compensation, then it is the landlordd who should be sued and not the agent""

and

"if an agent makes an agreement with a third party in respect of something which would appear to be within his authority as agent, then the principal is bound by this, even if the agent acted against the principal's instructions." ..... A third party is entitled to rely on an agent's assurances, as it is not his fault if the landlord and agent have not sort our properly what the agent can and cannot do"

so... as we have been saying... go for the LL

schnide

Don't worry - I'm going to! Thanks for everything so far.

I've written to the agent and the landlord to confirm their correspondence addresses. The landlord has not yet replied and the agent has said he will confirm them - but also that he cannot understand why I would need them!

clutton_2

if you have a couple of hours spare you could do worse than read Eagerlearner 's thread on here about her mammoth battle to get her deposit back through the courts .... its salutary reading as to some of the difficulties faced by tenants with difficult/ignorant landlords......

schnide

Still waiting on the agent to confirm the addresses, but I already have the agent's so may send two copies to him and two copies to the address on the contract for the landlord.

If I my application to the small claims court does not seek the 3 x penalty as you have recommended, am I right in thinking the court may still award that? All I want is the money back that's ours, but aside from how nice financially the penalty may be, it would also be something of an incentive for other agents to behave a little more reputably. No-one should have to go through this.

schnide

Letter issued, as of today! Here we go..

clutton_2

good luck.. do let us know how things progress..

schnide

Given how strong it looked like my legal position was, and how much of a scumbag my previous landlord and agent were, I am almost - almost - disappointed to have been denied my day in court.

Nevertheless, having sent two copies of the letter to both the landlord and agent several weeks ago, I yesterday came home to find a letter with the following from my landlord:

"The full amount of your deposit (£2,310) has been transferred into your bank account today.

As you are aware, your deposit was paid to and held by the letting agents. At no point did we have access to this deposit, yet it seems the agents did not pay this money into the Tenancy Deposit Scheme and have not returned this money to you despite your requests to do so. Therefore, the responsibility has fallen on us to repay this deposit.

Please acknowledge receipt of this letter and the return of the deposit."

I do indeed acknowledge that my bank account is now £2,310 better off. And how nice of them to recognise their responsibility once they were threatened with court action!

Needless to say, this is a fantastic outcome that I simply may never have achieved if it wasn't for this forum. I am incredibly grateful to all who contributed to this thread, and who guided me through to a solution for a situation which could otherwise have been even more stressful than it already was.

In particular, I am grateful to N79 and clutton, and would like to make a donation to a charity of your choices - please let me know who either on here, or by PM.

On top of already having once personally taken a bank to court over bank charges and won, my lesson from this would again be to fight your corner, arm yourself with knowledge and don't let yourself be intimidated!

sequence

Excellent outcome! Particularly like your last paragraph too!