Religion in schools?

elvis86

mintymoneysaver wrote: »

I am a Christian who really wanted church school places for my children, and would have been really annoyed if they had been taken by somebody who admitted they did not believe.

IMO, if you want your child to pray and be preached to, you should do it in the home and take them to church.:cool:

Schools should be secular, unless religious parents want to pay for the privilege of sending their child to a private school. Ditto all this "choice" around schools. Its unsustainable, obviously everyone is going to want their child to go to the "better" schools!

The real issue is that we have such variations in the quality of state schools! The government should be working to ensure consistency across the board, how can we tolerate a situation where some state schools are "better" than others? IMO, as a general rule, a child should automatically go to the school local to them, there should be no choice (there should be nothing to "choose" between!), unless the parents want to pay private schooling fees.

Same with healthcare. This idea of "choice" is only used to appease people and make them feel empowered, it doesn't solve the real problems with public services!

msb5262

"I am not sure why an atheist would choose to send a child to a church school"
quote from mintymoneysaver

Like milliebear00001, I'm an atheist who has sent all three of my children to a church school for the simple reason that it was the village school.

The nearest community school was 5 miles away.

Out here in the sticks (rural Lancashire), many of the schools are small schools with religious beginnings.

It has proved quite difficult for me to find a teaching job without having a faith reference, since this has limited me to applying for posts in non-religious schools; I can't help feeling that those teachers with faith references should perhaps only be allowed to apply at faith schools as the reverse is true for us non-Christians!

Janepig

JodyBPM wrote: »

The thing that gets me most, though, is that with respect to all other religions, information is given in a balanced manner, eg some people believe x, y & z, and we understand and respect their views, yet Christianity is taught as a FACT, eg god makes the seeds grow into plants. Surely it should be, similarly to other religions, some people believe that god makes the plants grow, and we understand and respect their views, as per the teaching of any other religion? Also, atheism isn't taught, as apparently its a belief, not a religion. Not a balanced approach to teaching IMO.

But is "god makes the seeds grow into plants" actually taught as fact in this country? Okay, so a religious school assembly may contain something along these lines or they may be singing hymns such as "we plough the fields and scatter" or something which alludes to this, as may a harvest service, but in school classes, science or whatever, is this what they are taught "AS FACT"? I don't think so.

As much as DD/DS's school seems to be a little heavy on the christianity, the nursery and reception children for instance take a yearly trip to a local garden centre to buy seeds, which they then help to plant, water, feed, etc... and grow flowers and vegetables, with little or no help from god . The last time I looked, creationism wasn't on the curriculum - but I stand to be corrected.

Jxx

milliebear00001

Janepig wrote: »

But is "god makes the seeds grow into plants" actually taught as fact in this country? Okay, so a religious school assembly may contain something along these lines or they may be singing hymns such as "we plough the fields and scatter" or something which alludes to this, as may a harvest service, but in school classes, science or whatever, is this what they are taught "AS FACT"? I don't think so.

As much as DD/DS's school seems to be a little heavy on the christianity, the nursery and reception children for instance take a yearly trip to a local garden centre to buy seeds, which they then help to plant, water, feed, etc... and grow flowers and vegetables, with little or no help from god . The last time I looked, creationism wasn't on the curriculum - but I stand to be corrected.

Jxx

I think this will depend on what kind of school you mean. At our local CofE, they are fairly relaxed about the origins of life etc. At a strongly Catholic school there would be little room for discussion - you are taught that God created man, creates all living things, has a 'plan' for us all etc etc. There will rarely be room for opposing views. Science will also be taught as fact, but that all things 'scientific' are of course, planned and created originally by God.

JodyBPM

Janepig wrote: »

But is "god makes the seeds grow into plants" actually taught as fact in this country? Okay, so a religious school assembly may contain something along these lines or they may be singing hymns such as "we plough the fields and scatter" or something which alludes to this, as may a harvest service, but in school classes, science or whatever, is this what they are taught "AS FACT"? I don't think so.

As much as DD/DS's school seems to be a little heavy on the christianity, the nursery and reception children for instance take a yearly trip to a local garden centre to buy seeds, which they then help to plant, water, feed, etc... and grow flowers and vegetables, with little or no help from god . The last time I looked, creationism wasn't on the curriculum - but I stand to be corrected.

Jxx

It actually was at my dd's school. You're spot on that it was linked to Harvest Festival and "We plough the seeds and scatter" - her harvest festival picture was flowers, rain and the word DOG. We questioned her about the DOG, and it turns out it was GOD, watering the flowers. She's only 5, in reception, and at this age she takes everything she's taught at face value!

pinkandwhites

Where my niece goes to school the children learn about lots of different religions. They celebrate Christmas and Easter, and also Eid, Diwali, Hannakah and Chinese New Year. As far as I know, all the children get involved with all of the different celebrations, with the exception being some Jehovah's Witness children where their parents have chosen to take them out. They do live in a very multicultural area though, so maybe this school is not typical.

I think its important that religion is taught as "some people believe xyz" as its teaching the children how to be respectful and tolerant of other people's faiths, no matter if its different to the faith their own family has. To teach it as fact is dangerous ground in my own opinion as you're always going to alienate a section of the school community.

Tolerance is good - fundamentalism is bad.
In the words of the late Dave Allen "may your god go with you".

Janepig

JodyBPM wrote: »

It actually was at my dd's school. You're spot on that it was linked to Harvest Festival and "We plough the seeds and scatter" - her harvest festival picture was flowers, rain and the word DOG. We questioned her about the DOG, and it turns out it was GOD, watering the flowers. She's only 5, in reception, and at this age she takes everything she's taught at face value!

But to me that's no different to DD doing a book in the run up to Christmas which involved her drawing pictures of the baby Jesus and the various other comings and goings at the stable, and writing out the "Christmas story". Tbh at the age of six I'm not about to sit her down and go into detail about how Christmas would appear to be celebrated when it is because it was originally a pagan festival, etc...... At this age she even believes that Little Miss Birthday and the fairies are going to bring her her birthday presents on Friday when she turns 7, and who am I to burst that little bubble!!

And I'm not sure that any of it is sinking in much with the children of today seeing as I'm sure there's stats kicking around about just how little they know about the reason we celebrate Christmas/Easter, etc... in this country. It would be interesting to know as well how many children in Catholic comprehensive schools believe that god created everything, has a plan, etc.... Not too many I would guess.

Jxx

onlyroz

Woah, seem to have started a bit of a debate here. Considering that I've only had a 4-year-old's garbled explanation of his school's religion policy so far, I'm not going to make any assumptions about whether he's being forced into saying daily prayers. I think I might ask at the office in the morning though.

BTW the school is just a regular state primary, not affiliated with any church. I know that when I was at school we were supposed to have the daily "broadly christian" assembly, but I didn't know that rule was still in place today. I do think that education should be secular (like it is in France, for instance), but I'm not sure that I want to go as far as withdrawing my kids from assembly.

I tried explaining to my son that different people believe in different things - and that not everybody would agree with what the man in school today was saying - but I think it just went in one ear and out the other. I'm not sure he's old enough to comprehend things like "God" or death, or the afterlife (I've already had the "what happens when you die?" question and I'm not sure that I answered it adequately).

Anyway, for now I think I'll just play it by ear and try to help him out as best I can with any "deep" questions he might have. I'd prefer it if he learned about *all* religions and then made his own mind up in his own time about whether he wants to practice one or not...

itsallinthemind

The UK is not a Christian Country. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_atheism#The_UK & 2/3 of teenagers are non-believers.

State schools should teach not just religious education, but CUTURAL education too. However, children should not be expected to worship a falsehood or be excluded from assemblies.

itsallinthemind

Just to add-there is no santa, tooth fairy, birthday elf, easter bunny or any other twaddle in my house. The children celebrate christmas as a fun social gathering yearly, where small presents are bought for each other as we love each other.