Help with Grievance

Frazer01

I am about to put in a greivance actually requesting a redundnancy payment. I know this is not the norm!, but I feel my employer has tried to avoid making a payment due to redundancy, as I have 27 years service.

I want to word the greivance correctly, and wondered if there is a statutory right to a redundancy payment that I could quote?
They are saying they do not consider that a recent reduction in my team from 8 to 5 was a redundancy situation as they found us all alternative roles.

Problem is the alternative role for me is on less pay, less hours etc., different area of the business, and would quite happily taken a redundancy package.

They followed consultations, meeting etc and we applied for our jobs, they followed a set criteria/pointing system etc, then just politely, offered us alternative roles and did not end our previous contract. Only option was to leave or take new job, they did not offer redundancy as an option.
There was no appeal to their decision.

So, now I've got over the shock and stress, I want to appeal their decision not to offer a redundancy option via a Greivance, and I need to know if a redundancy payment is a 'right of employment'?
Have they breached my contract?

advice is much appreciated.

getmore4less

How long have you been doing the new job?

patman99

Making people re-apply for thier jobs seems to be the standard way to get shot of them without the need to pay redundancy.

snowmaid

If you can afford it, seek legal advice otherwise go see CAB.

Frazer01

getmore4less wrote: »

How long have you been doing the new job?

I held out til 18 Jan, originally I was supposed to start 4 Jan.

They gave us their policy doc on redundancies back in Nov 09, and they followed the policy, but then did not issue us with dismissal notice, just an offer letter of a new role on 17.12.09- with new contract.

This policy states, if offered an alternative role, we would have 12 weeks to try it out. Now they're saying it is permanent, with no right of appeal, which is why I want to raise a greivance asap.

getmore4less

Did you make it clear at the time that you were not accepting the job as a suitable alternative but were willing to a 12 week trial.

A legal trial period is normaly 4 weeks but it might be OK since it is in the policy doc.

Did they make it clear that you have to reject before the end of a trial period if you do not agree it is a suitable alternative.

Assuming you accepted the 12 trial on the 18th jan then you have untill 9th april(fri) to reject the job then to start I think something along the lines of

Having trialed the new position for x weeks out of the 12 week trial I reject this as an suitable alternative employment, please advise of any other potentialy suitable positions that may be available, failure to provide a suitable alternative will obviously result in my redundancy since my old position is no longer available.

Does the company have an enhanced redundancy policy, statutory redundancy maxes out at £11400 with 20years service over 41.

You need to get ACAS or an employment expert to look at this since they are likely to refuse the rejection.

ceridwen

I'm no lawyer - but I know the basic idea is that an employer is allowed to offer an "equivalent" job in a redundancy situation. There are various different ways of looking at whether an alternative position is "equivalent". I dont recall exactly where I saw it - but one of the factors that says a position is not deemed to be "equivalent" is if its on lower pay.

You have said that the alternative position is on lower pay - therefore it is not "equivalent" and they have to give you the option of redundancy.

They will obviously try and con you that they can make you do this other job - but ignore that and start taking appropriate proceedings against them.

I would imagine a grievance is the first step in this?

Good luck.

ceridwen

Don't know if theres anything on here of use to you as to the definition of an "equivalent" position:

http://www.tuc.org.uk/tuc/rights_main.cfm

There is a time limit for putting in a grievance - you need to check what that is. From memory - I think its 3 months - but you need to check that.

They are obviously hoping that you will all remain in shock long enough for that time limit to expire - at which point it would be too late and you would all have been duly successfully conned by them.

ceridwen

snowmaid wrote: »

If you can afford it, seek legal advice otherwise go see CAB.

or - even more to the point - ring ACAS.

NB: I just noted the date this new job started - you had better get a move on fast - or they will get away with this.:eek:

Atelier

ceridwen wrote: »

They will obviously try and con you that they can make you do this other job - but ignore that and start taking appropriate proceedings against them.

I would imagine a grievance is the first step in this?

Make sure that you follow the grievance procedure before going further. Employment tribunals are not very happy if you come to them without going through it.

I recommend giving ACAS a call. My experience is that they are very helpful and do appreciate that you are just a normal person and not fully up on HR legislation. Good idea to write the whole story down before you speak so it is easy to recount.

HTH