Positive action - what do you/can you do?

tomterm8

Hm, I was hoping that this thread would be about something different than house prices. As an individual, there is booger all you can do about house prices. As a collective, this pressure group isn't ever going to match the property developers lobby group. It's a waste of time.

I guess all you can do is arrange your life so you make more money, and can buy outright.

House prices are what they are... ya just got to live with 'em.

carolt

JonnyBravo wrote: »

I'm afraid I won't be joining that group carol.
I don't mind points 2,3 & 4 of their "manifesto" but couldn't support their wish to see the end of interest on the mortgage being offset against tax (point 1).
Sorry.

I did ask daddybear a while back if he put as much effort into "postive action" as to countering Hamish and he admitted he didn't as he felt it would have no impact.
Politics in this country needs more active involvement, so if one believes in this then they really should sign up and actually "do" something.


As a positive I will be spending some of the money I receive in rental in the wider economy. That's as much support as I can lend I'm afraid.

I think your post was about as close as this thread has come so far to my original intention - that of suggesting as many way as possible of improving the current situation.

My OP was only an example of something that interests me - but I'm sure there must be loads of other suggestions out there that people have to improve things.

I am just not willing to believe that we are good only at moaning! I feel utterly sure that between us we must have loads of ideas as to how to improve our economy or country or world in many wonderful ways.

And that absolutely includes you, chucky, and even Hamish.

Even (maybe!) amcluesent and Asheron!

So please give us all your positive ideas, however great or small, so we can all benefit from them...

carolt

tomterm8 wrote: »

Hm, I was hoping that this thread would be about something different than house prices. As an individual, there is booger all you can do about house prices. As a collective, this pressure group isn't ever going to match the property developers lobby group. It's a waste of time.

I guess all you can do is arrange your life so you make more money, and can buy outright.

House prices are what they are... ya just got to live with 'em.

I think that's defeatist rubbish.

ukcarper

carolt wrote: »

I think that's defeatist rubbish.

Unfortunately the world you live in is not the world you would like to live in. The chances of any party with a sense of social justice getting elected is zero. Do you think Labour would have been elected if they had kept faith to their old labour roots?

tomterm8

Yes, you are entitled to think whatever you like, Carol. As am I. And I think the pressure group you linked to is totally ineffective, and will remain so. One of us is right. It isn't you.

carolt

I agree it's currently ineffective - it's kind of self-evident, or it would have nothing to protest about and would cease to exist.

However, equally self-evidently, if everyone had your admirable sense of communal duty, or 'realism' as you would label it, then nothing in the world would ever change for the better.

All the truly great changes for the good that have happened in the world, from the abolition of slavery to the ending of child labour, introduction of equal rights for women etc etc, came about as the result of the committed actions of a few brave and passionate individuals, without whom the world would be a worse and sadder place.

I'm not saying the actions of the group mentioned in the OP will change the world at all, let alone to that degree. I am saying that if you decide not to even try, you will certainly never succeed.

I know which attitude I'd rather have. And it's not yours.

JonnyBravo

I agree with tom in that I too don't think that group will ever be an effective lobbying group.
It will very probably never hold any power and I agree that it is highly unlikely any such group is going to outweigh all the vested interests held by those in power (and those of some of the public supporting some of them).


But even more than this I agree with carolt.
People moan endlessly about the situation. Do the majority do ANYTHING about it? No.
A letter to their MP? No.
A letter to a paper? No.
Attend a rally? No.
Propose alternatives to MP's? No.
All too much effort, much easier to have a good ol' moan on the interent.


I asked daddybear (sorry daddybear I'm only using you as an example as I remember our brief conversation on this matter) and he seemed resigned to the future. It all seemed he felt he could have no influence and I suspect it was all a bit too much trouble.

I back carolt 100%, it may seem difficult and unlikely but then many causes start like this and only if enough people who feel this way get up off their !!!!!! and start lobbying the people in power will anything change.

So how about me? I too fell into this rather blase group about everything really until recently. (I s'pose it comes of the fact that ultimately very few of us struggle to actually survive in this country??)
I felt strongly enough to write to my MP with some questions a few months ago. He sent out an unsolicited round robin affair moaning about how the council was wasting money and that wasting taxpayers money was a disgrace...... just as the local rag ran a piece on his expenses. It was about a month before it all kicked off in the national papers.
He chose not to reply to me. I have since chosen to tell everyone I know about this fact and will be voting to throw him out in the coming election.



Get up off your comfortable behinds and do something if you want it to change!

carolt

Good on you, Jonny.

I had an amusing spat with my MP on Wikipedia when the expenses stuff started coming out - I edited and redited and redited his page until he gave up removing all the stuff about his wasting of our money on his personal expenses - about his huge property empire elsewhere, too, BTW.

I also wrote to him - he also ignored my letter.

Strange, that.

Stiil, it had to be done.

Come the election, I shall be keeping a close watch on that Wiki page, and possibly dropping a few choice leaflets.

Cleaver

Graham_Devon wrote: »

We actively campaign the Government to increase housing affordability by:

• Increasing taxation on buy-to-let and multiple home ownership;
• Building more homes;
• Improving tenants' rights;
• Improving the sustainability of the housing market, preventing a further boom in house prices.

Can't say I can argue with the four main points. Seem rather sensible to me.

Points two to four seem very sensible and I think any sane person would sign up to them.

I just can't agree with point number one. If it's legal to open a small businesses in this country then the tax rate for all of those businesses should be the same, and should follow the same rules. If you increase the tax on one business where do you stop? I don't like Tesco (as I'm sure you well know). The answer to me not liking them is not using them, not insisting that they pay more tax because I'm opposed to their business model.

BTL landlords pay the same tax as any other business owner. If their customers like their product then they'll make a profit and will then pay tax on it. If there isn't a market for rental properties then less and less people will buy properties to rent out - it's basically up to the market to decide.

Anyway, number one is a moot point as if the government implemented points 2 to 4 then only the shrewd, organised and good landlords would make money. Rather than the situation we've had for 10 years when pretty much anyone owning a few bricks and a tin of white paint could make huge profits year on year.

carolt

I think the argument for point 1 is that buying a property is not a productive business - or at least it's not counted as such when you buy one to live in.

If it's a business buying a house (and potentially selling it on later), then everyone who buys a house should get the same tax benefits (which is what happened under MIRAS).

Since they got rid of MIRAS, potential landlords have an unfair advanatage over someone buying a home to live in - that the homeowner pays the mortgage interest out of taxed income, but the landlord doesn't.

Given that surely it is socially desirable for people to have the opportunity to buy their own house - a view I think all parties officially subscribe too - that state of affairs is inequitable and undesirable.