MONEY MORAL DILEMMA: Should Theo tell the boss about Wayne and Jermaine?

wildthing01

this is a difficult one for me - i work for the public sector, so if this were happening in my organisation, i'd feel honour-bound to alert the boss, as it would be public money going to waste. however, i have less sympathy for large private companies, esp if they make enornous profits while paying their staff peanuts, so i might think, fair enough. if theo is just doing this as a 'job', ie he isn't on the career ladder, he should prob keep quiet, but, if he wants to aim for the top, he should tell, as he'll prob reap rewards later...

RuthnJasper

I would tell the boss, but in an anonymous note. That way, the glitch could be detected and corrected. If the boss decides to investigate, hopefully, all staff records would be looked at - Jermaine and Wayne might not be the only culprits. I know that they are mates, so I would feel really bad. But what they are doing is stealing and that is wrong.

Also, their naughty actions (as they seem to have successfully worked thair way through several £100s of company money) could well have a knock-on effect on company profits and, therefore also on future pay increases for ALL staff (including Theo); the company's share price AND whatever the company charges the public for their services.

Also, the longer Jermaine and Wayne get away with their new careers as tea-leaves, the bolder they will get and that may put everyone at risk. Even Nick Leeson started relatively small...

pineapple

If I thought the company was struggling I might say something. Whatever, I wouldn't outrightly accuse my colleagues of knowingly taking the extra - I would find a way of pointing out the flaw in the system.

SomethingWitty_2

Tricky one this.

I once left a job in the public sector and they paid me for a number of months after. For the first couple of months, I thought they were paying me overtime and for unusued holiday that I was rightly owed. Checking my records confirmed this to be the case. So far, so good.

The thrid month it happened was clearly a mistake. I owned up immediately and sent a cheque for the full amount to pay the money back. They responded with a threat of court action and a demand for the other 2 months of salary, plus another £500 on top, for whatever reason, they believed I had been overpaid massively. Naturally I challegned them, showed them my records, payslips etc, which disputed their version of events but nothing was enough to prove to them I didn;t owe them the full amount they were asking for. Eventually we settled on a reduced figure as I was very young, in poor financial shape, had no solicitor, and was desperate to resolve after numerous threatening letters. I had no idea who to turn to even though I had documentary proof i was in the right. I also wanted a positive reference and was terrified my career prospects would be ruined. My honesty ended up costing me money that was rightfully mine, (though granted significvantly less than their original demands) because I was too weak to fight my ex employer and scared it would affect my future prospects.

As I settled, and I didnt fight (as I now would), I can;t complain, but to me it showed a huge level of incompetence and that honesty is not always the best policy.

In this case though it seems there is a deliberate attempt to defraud which is wrong. One option is to gently mention to the employees that you have heard from the office they are investigating the scam, and they would be wise to stop. A "friendly" but strong warning if you like.

If you are in this for a career, and it is not a dead end job, take the full story to the boss but this is people's livelihoods we are talking about here and I would have to think about how to approach this. They in theory would not get the sack - they could own up and agree to pay the cash back in installments and indeed the employer is bound to accept these conditions (certainly that is what I did in my case)

Annette_Jones

Good move suggesting Theo do overtime and then report that he has been paid too much. Honesty is the best policy, W & J will be found out, somehow, not worth lying and showing off.

Clark58

Yes.

I am afraid it's the old 'Sir Alan Sugar' for Wayne and Jermaine... 'You're Fired'!

MissMills81

W & J are the ones that are running the risk by not owning up to the overpayment, the chances are that the company will realise the error and take appropriate action.
Theo should keep out of the situation, there may be a part of him that generally doesn't want the company defrauded but i would bet there is a bigger part that is driven by the green eyed monster.
Plus there is also the negative impact it may have on his relationships with his colleagues in the future, rightly or wrongly he would be shunned if it was found out that he blew the whistle.
I think he should keep quiet and let the situation resolve itself.

Mary_Hartnell

This was discussed in: Attorney-General’s Reference (No 1 of 1983) – The defendant, a policewoman, was overpaid. The money was credited to her bank account as a result of an error by her employer. The evidence suggested that having discovered the overpayment, the defendant simply allowed the money to remain in the account. She was charged with theft of the sum overpaid but the trial judge directed the jury to acquit. The question of whether a charge of theft was possible in such a situation was referred to the Court of Appeal. It was decided that provided there was sufficient evidence of mens rea, a charge of theft could succeed in such a situation. The defendant had got property (the excess payment) by another’s mistake and was under an obligation to restore the debt (a chose in action) to her employer. Further, Lord Lane CJ suggested that s5(4) only started to operate from the moment the defendant became aware of the overpayment.

Exactly this situation happened to me - I got a months pay that I could see was bigger than it should have been by about 300 GBP. I tussled with my concience for about 24 hours and then went to see my boss and my bosses boss and blamed "the system".
I was in part motivated by wanting to "do the right thing" but also by the possibility/probability that the internal auditors would find it. In the event, it turned out that my boss had had finger trouble keying in my overtime and the rubbish system had failed to query him getting the decimal point in the wrong place. I paid back the over payment at a rate of 100 GBP per month.

Now had I been working in the European Union's subsidy department I would not have bothered - the auditors gave up trying to sort out that corrupt mess years ago.

Now in one household we both have been given incorrect notices of coding. In my case I have been given back a "use of own vehicle" allowance that I stopped getting about 10 years ago.
My other half appears to being over charged by reduction of code based on "information supplied" which is absolutely meaningless; but as he on self assessment presumably it will come out in the wash eventually.

Can anyone offer a future govenment of this country that will cut back on the incompetent nanny state that is stealing more and more of our money - robbing the poor to give to the rich?

BobbinAlong

Either send anonymous letters or an anonymous email (account from hotmail or similar) and tell both the boss AND the payroll department that a software issue has led to overpayments of overtime.

jgriggle

lots of companies take the attitude that if you know about some theft/fraud taking place and do nothing, then that makes you an accessory.

I would tell, and feel good about it. I wouldn't be bothered about being seen as a 'grass' as I'm over 12 years old.

A few months after I started in my job, I was paid too much so I immediately brought it to my bosses attention. He was appreciative of my honesty. In fact, I'm pretty sure it was some kind of test to see what I would do.