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seedlessgrape
Posts: 7 Forumite
We've been good tenants, a few late rent payments but nothing more than that.
A few weeks ago, our landlord came round unannounced at 9pm. He said he was testing keys? When he came in, wasn't too happy with the state of the property. Now, bear in mind that this was an unannounced visit, 2 days after a 21st birthday and we're students in a student area. There were a few hundred beer cans, most of these were in bin liners (until we ran out and had to use tesco bags), but some were still in the kitchen and on the tables. Other than there being a lot of bins around the place, there was plenty of washing up stacked up and the washing up bowl in the sink had some beer poured into it which didn't look that nice.
He just said 'guys, please try and keep it tidy' and we said that we understood, and it was just a bad time for him to come round. We cleaned up and everything was spotless, clean and nice again. Several weeks later it was bad again... nothing too serious, just a lot of washing up and a lot of bin bags in our kitchen. The estate agents showed people round and then gave us a letter which was a section 21? It said that we had 3 months to leave the property. Obviously this came as a shock as our tenancy doesn't end for 6 months, so we went to the estate agents to find out what was going on.
The first lady we spoke to said it was due to our rent being late, I said that we're completely up to date in our rent and then she said she didn't know. So we had to wait for the manager or legal person of the estate agents to turn up. When she arrived, she said it was due to the mess in the flat. I explained that it was just a bad time and that nothing was that serious, no health risk, no damage, nothing of that sort, just a lot of washing up (although there's only 2 of us) and about 3 bin liners in the kitchen.
She then said that she had seen pictures (?) of our flat. We immediately asked why we weren't informed that they came into our flat to take pictures and they said it was for advertising purposes (eventhough they were complaining about the mess?). This is extremely annoying as my flatmate repairs game consoles to make some money, this means we have about 8 PS3's and 5 Xbox 360's on show in our living room, next to our 50" plasma. We also have a few Apple Mac Laptops, so there's about £5000 worth of easily sellable goods in our 2 bedroom flat, which they had taken pictures of, supposedly for the purpose of advertising on the internet, all without us knowing or our consent.
I still don't know whether they were allowed to issue us a section 21 notice, and this lady didn't seem to give us any concrete answers. I didn't want to delve into it further and cause more trouble so we just agreed to allow them to inspect our flat.. We then got a note through the door saying "we will be coming round on Friday, at 10am", but we realised that this wasn't a good time for us as we both wanted to be here so we sent them an email on Wednesday morning stating that we'd like to rearrange. As we didn't get a response, we sent another, and then on Thursday, we sent another (we sent the emails to 2 different addresses, including the one left on the note). Then on Friday morning we decided to call them. The lady over the phone said that the viewing (?) had been switched to 11:30am instead. This was obviously news to us as they never told us either that there would be a viewing, or that the time had been rearranged, and no word on our emails that we'd sent either.
Obviously by this point we were quite annoyed that they weren't responding to us and were doing all this without our consent. At 10am, the 'legal' lady came round to our flat by herself. We said that we weren't prepared to do a inspection and that we'd made multiple forms of contact over the last few days to inform them. She said that it was all news to her and said we sent the emails to the accounts lady, to which we said that we also sent the emails to the email address on the note. I then said 'we also just found out that you're planning to do a viewing at 11:30am" to which she said "yes, I'm here to tell you that we rescheduled" to which I said "we had no knowledge of this viewing, and don't you need to give us 24 hours notice?" and then after it being a little tense she walked away saying "well, if you're going to be difficult about it then that's fine" in a kind of threatening manner. I also don't understand why she would come round to tell us that they changed the time, instead of just calling us (which is what they normally do).
I don't know what to do now, we're not bad tenants! The place tends to go from extremely messy to extremely clean a few times a month depending on how much work we have on. We've been a little late with rent payments every so often, but nothing too serious. I just don't think it's right that they think they can come in whenever they'd like, take pictures without us even knowing and ignore our emails. Does anyone know what to do about this? Are they allowed to do this?
A few weeks ago, our landlord came round unannounced at 9pm. He said he was testing keys? When he came in, wasn't too happy with the state of the property. Now, bear in mind that this was an unannounced visit, 2 days after a 21st birthday and we're students in a student area. There were a few hundred beer cans, most of these were in bin liners (until we ran out and had to use tesco bags), but some were still in the kitchen and on the tables. Other than there being a lot of bins around the place, there was plenty of washing up stacked up and the washing up bowl in the sink had some beer poured into it which didn't look that nice.
He just said 'guys, please try and keep it tidy' and we said that we understood, and it was just a bad time for him to come round. We cleaned up and everything was spotless, clean and nice again. Several weeks later it was bad again... nothing too serious, just a lot of washing up and a lot of bin bags in our kitchen. The estate agents showed people round and then gave us a letter which was a section 21? It said that we had 3 months to leave the property. Obviously this came as a shock as our tenancy doesn't end for 6 months, so we went to the estate agents to find out what was going on.
The first lady we spoke to said it was due to our rent being late, I said that we're completely up to date in our rent and then she said she didn't know. So we had to wait for the manager or legal person of the estate agents to turn up. When she arrived, she said it was due to the mess in the flat. I explained that it was just a bad time and that nothing was that serious, no health risk, no damage, nothing of that sort, just a lot of washing up (although there's only 2 of us) and about 3 bin liners in the kitchen.
She then said that she had seen pictures (?) of our flat. We immediately asked why we weren't informed that they came into our flat to take pictures and they said it was for advertising purposes (eventhough they were complaining about the mess?). This is extremely annoying as my flatmate repairs game consoles to make some money, this means we have about 8 PS3's and 5 Xbox 360's on show in our living room, next to our 50" plasma. We also have a few Apple Mac Laptops, so there's about £5000 worth of easily sellable goods in our 2 bedroom flat, which they had taken pictures of, supposedly for the purpose of advertising on the internet, all without us knowing or our consent.
I still don't know whether they were allowed to issue us a section 21 notice, and this lady didn't seem to give us any concrete answers. I didn't want to delve into it further and cause more trouble so we just agreed to allow them to inspect our flat.. We then got a note through the door saying "we will be coming round on Friday, at 10am", but we realised that this wasn't a good time for us as we both wanted to be here so we sent them an email on Wednesday morning stating that we'd like to rearrange. As we didn't get a response, we sent another, and then on Thursday, we sent another (we sent the emails to 2 different addresses, including the one left on the note). Then on Friday morning we decided to call them. The lady over the phone said that the viewing (?) had been switched to 11:30am instead. This was obviously news to us as they never told us either that there would be a viewing, or that the time had been rearranged, and no word on our emails that we'd sent either.
Obviously by this point we were quite annoyed that they weren't responding to us and were doing all this without our consent. At 10am, the 'legal' lady came round to our flat by herself. We said that we weren't prepared to do a inspection and that we'd made multiple forms of contact over the last few days to inform them. She said that it was all news to her and said we sent the emails to the accounts lady, to which we said that we also sent the emails to the email address on the note. I then said 'we also just found out that you're planning to do a viewing at 11:30am" to which she said "yes, I'm here to tell you that we rescheduled" to which I said "we had no knowledge of this viewing, and don't you need to give us 24 hours notice?" and then after it being a little tense she walked away saying "well, if you're going to be difficult about it then that's fine" in a kind of threatening manner. I also don't understand why she would come round to tell us that they changed the time, instead of just calling us (which is what they normally do).
I don't know what to do now, we're not bad tenants! The place tends to go from extremely messy to extremely clean a few times a month depending on how much work we have on. We've been a little late with rent payments every so often, but nothing too serious. I just don't think it's right that they think they can come in whenever they'd like, take pictures without us even knowing and ignore our emails. Does anyone know what to do about this? Are they allowed to do this?
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Comments
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seedlessgrape wrote: »We've been good tenants, a few late rent payments but nothing more than that.
So in reality you are bad tenants.
Either way no the S21 is invalid as it can not come into effect before the end of a fixed period. The LL could issues a S8 to evict you other the late rent - are you sure that this is not the case?
In future I suggest you take your obligations seriously.0 -
So in reality you are bad tenants.
Either way no the S21 is invalid as it can not come into effect before the end of a fixed period. The LL could issues a S8 to evict you other the late rent - are you sure that this is not the case?
In future I suggest you take your obligations seriously.
Forgot to mention, it was due to our student loans being late this year, but we kept them informed and they seemed fine at the time. They said it was a common problem this year.0 -
OK, from another viewpoint, your 'flatmate' repairs games to make a living, how would he feel if his client was making payments late "every so often".....
Agree with N79 wholeheartedly - take your obligations seriously and treat the place you are living in with a bit of respect.
Is the S21 eviction date set at the same time your 6 month AST (Assured Shorthold Tenancy) ends, if it's earlier as N79 says, it's not legally enforceable.0 -
OK, from another viewpoint, your 'flatmate' repairs games to make a living, how would he feel if his client was making payments late "every so often".....
Agree with N79 wholeheartedly - take your obligations seriously and treat the place you are living in with a bit of respect.
Is the S21 eviction date set at the same time your 6 month AST (Assured Shorthold Tenancy) ends, if it's earlier as N79 says, it's not legally enforceable.
Not sure why that matters, but yes, he was recently ripped off by a customer who didn't pay, but there's not much he can do.
This is the thing, we do take our obligations seriously. We had problems with student finance this year (which I think every student did? It was covered by the news pretty well). We also happened to have had a 21st birthday party 2 days before the landlords unannounced visit (is he allowed to come round at 9pm without telling us?).
We're very clean for students buy it does get messy every now and again. We do treat our property with the same respect as we would treat our family homes though.0 -
I would think it was very valid - the point is, your flatmate doesn't like being paid late (or not at all) for a service he has provided - I would have thought your LL felt the same. Albeit you did pay and you say you had a legitimate reason for not paying on time (your post crossed with mine on that point, from your initial post you stated you have been late a few times, not just the once waiting for a loan payment).
I did say it was not legal or right for him to come by unannounced - clearly your LL is not happy about you in the property and is 'checking up on you' - like I said, it's not legal - he does have to give written notice of visits and you could remind the LAs (and LL) of that, although they should well know this.
If you do treat the place like you would your family homes then he can't say fairer than that....
One other point, it is stressed time and time again on here, if you wish to communicate with the LL (presuming you have to do it with the LA as you don't have contact details for the LL), then do it in writing and make sure it's sent recorded delivery. You then are backing yourself up should you need to prove anything in court or via a deposit protection scheme.0 -
I would think it was very valid - the point is, your flatmate doesn't like being paid late (or not at all) for a service he has provided - I would have thought your LL felt the same. Albeit you did pay and you say you had a legitimate reason for not paying on time (your post crossed with mine on that point, from your initial post you stated you have been late a few times, not just the once waiting for a loan payment).
I did say it was not legal or right for him to come by unannounced - clearly your LL is not happy about you in the property and is 'checking up on you' - like I said, it's not legal - he does have to give written notice of visits and you could remind the LAs (and LL) of that, although they should well know this.
If you do treat the place like you would your family homes then he can't say fairer than that....
One other point, it is stressed time and time again on here, if you wish to communicate with the LL (presuming you have to do it with the LA as you don't have contact details for the LL), then do it in writing and make sure it's sent recorded delivery. You then are backing yourself up should you need to prove anything in court or via a deposit protection scheme.
Thanks for the advice. Even now, everything is spotless, I go a bit OCD with the cleaning at points and bleach/hoover/polish until it looks like a showroom. This is partly why I'm annoyed and why I agreed to an inspection (just so long as we consented).
Now, the pictures are my main worry... am I able to tell them to delete them? Do they have the right to keep them considering we didn't consent? I definitely don't want them being put on the Internet with our address right under them. Have they broken any laws by doing this?
Thanks again.0 -
You really need to deal with the landlord and letting agency in writing by recorded delivery, if you wish you have the right to refuse any and all visits to your property (inspections or viewings) however this may well put your landlord's back up. I would suggest you write and offer specific times and days when you will allow viewings with twenty four hours notice, and state that you guarantee the flat will be clean and tidy and your valuables away. Saying you are sometimes too busy to tidy is not fooling anyone, with two people you can get a huge amount done in an hour!Declutterbug-in-progress.⭐️⭐️⭐️ ⭐️⭐️0
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I honestly don't know about the photos but there are others on here with much more experience than me. I would guess that because they were taken without your consent (and therefore without your consent for them even to be in the property) then legally they are on a sticky wicket and if you were to remind the LA of this then they wouldn't have a leg to stand on. They have certainly broken the law by entering without your permission - when did they take these photos - any idea?
Might be worth ringing someone like SHELTER - they give advice to tenants on their rights - I'm sure they'll be able to help you or point you in the right direction.0 -
have you checked your contract for a break clause?
i am also a student so understand your loan issue but you need to pay your rent on time
please search the thread and google 'right to quiet enjoyment' you don't have to let anyone in apart from emergency repairs (i think)
so there are already showing around prospective tenants when they think you're leaving in 3 months? seems really early0 -
I honestly don't know about the photos but there are others on here with much more experience than me. I would guess that because they were taken without your consent (and therefore without your consent for them even to be in the property) then legally they are on a sticky wicket and if you were to remind the LA of this then they wouldn't have a leg to stand on. They have certainly broken the law by entering without your permission - when did they take these photos - any idea?.
They were taken on they day they issued us the s21. We were both out at lectures. They definitely didn't inform us and we gave them no consent though.lizzielondon wrote: »have you checked your contract for a break clause?
i am also a student so understand your loan issue but you need to pay your rent on time
please search the thread and google 'right to quiet enjoyment' you don't have to let anyone in apart from emergency repairs (i think)
so there are already showing around prospective tenants when they think you're leaving in 3 months? seems really early
Thanks, I'll read up about that. Yeah, I'm in Birmingham and for some reason everyone starts looking from about xmas time for September, pretty crazy.0
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