Northern Rock Re-Mortgages - Best out there?

dwight-van-man

mleonard79 wrote:

Hi Dwight and KFT,
As far as the fees go when I said 'fees free' that was probably a bit confusing. I meant that with the help with costs payment I would end up with no fees to pay at all. The two mortgages I'm talking about are fee saver options so there is no arrangement fee. As far as I've been told the valuation fees including NR's facilitation fee would come to £455 and the legal fees approx. £200 which makes £655 so taking into account the help with costs of £750 that leaves me with them paying me £95. However as I'm not asking for a straight balance transfer and am adding a little onto the mortgage I will be charged a fee of £95 for this making the sum total in my case £0. Hope that explains it KFT.

Hi Michelle - this is where using a local broker is definately the way to go. The fees you've been quoted above are technically correct - but only for English remortgages. The situ in Scotland is a bit different.

First off - the legal fees of £200. This is the Rapid Remortgage service, but it costs £350 in Scotland as the process is different.

Second - the £455 val fee. This is made up of 3 seperate fees, the val fee, a £220 facilitation (!) fee and a £75 application fee. In England you pay all three to NR who then instruct the survey. In Scotland you are better off getting the survey done independently (cheaper & quicker) and adding the other two fees to the loan. Even if you want to pay off your fees, these are non-refundable so you are better adding them then paying them off once the mortgage completes.

Thirdly - the £95 additional borrowing fee does not apply on the fee save range.

The net effect is a fee free remortgage, or as near as, but the process differs and being aware of this should make the application process easier.

Hope that helps!

mleonard79

Hi MM,
Sorry was very busy last night. Ok so I phoned the two other brokers back.

1 The broker at L&C told me his main reasons for recommending nationwide was that its a better deal in his eyes than NR and Nationwide are a better lender who are better to their customers but he admitted that if it was purely price I was going on then the NR deal was probably better. He told me that its easier with nationwide as there's only the one upfront cost but with NR you have to pay the costs out and then get it back on completion which I know and am not really bothered about. Also if you want to move its cheaper with Nationwide (but with only 5 years left on the mortgage and wanting to go for a 5 year deal to see it out this isn't really a concern for me) and the deeds release fee at the end is £160 more with NR. He also said that since the mortgage I'm looking for is on the small side any rate increases wouldn't affect me so the lifetime tracker is the best bet. However I disagree with him on this as I do feel rate increases would affect me - he says my mortgage would go up £15 with an increase of 1% which wouldn't be disasterous I admit but it would then be £30 for 2% and with money being tight that is quite a hike to me. I don't know maybe he's right that the tracker's the best option.

2 The Chase De Vere broker apologized and said his system must be wrong as regards the Woolwich tracker but said it would still be possible for me to get the 4.79% rate by taking the £75,000 and then simply repaying the extra as soon as it completes. I asked him about NR and he said that he hadn't mentioned it as the Woolwich tracker rate is better (4.79% lifetime as opposed to 4.79% for 5 years) and he hadn't thought I was looking for a fixed so didn't search for that. He also said that the 5.29% fixed product from NR with no fees was the best he could think of and that NR are good to deal with and he could put that one through for me if I wanted. He told me to have a think about it over the weekend and decide whether I was more comfortable with the tracker or fixed.

So both have said the NR 5.29% is the best fixed but L&C were less complimentary about NR in terms of service. Basically rates would have to rise 0.75% (so 3 times) for me to worse off with the tracker but I'm still worried about it so leaning towards the fixed. There doesn't seem to be a better 5 year fix with no fees out there - if anyone knows of one feel free to share! What do you think so far?

Michelle

mleonard79

Hi again Dwight,
Thanks for that fees run-down, I guess the advisor I talked to wasn't taking the Scottish part into account. If I do decide to go with this mortgage I'll def use a broker. Do you think I should go with the Chase de Vere broker or the local one that contacted me from Moneysupermarket? Thanks again.

Michelle

mleonard79

Hi Dwight,
I've just had the advisor I talked to at NR on the phone following up. When I said that I was going to take the mortgage but go through a local broker she said that this would slow things down and may end up more expensive and I'd be better doing it direct as I could no longer phone them and see what was happening and would have to get in touch with my broker who would get in touch with them and it makes everything harder. She also said that the £350 rapid remortgage fee would apply if I used a broker's solicitor and not one of NR's panel. I personally think she must be getting comission for me taking the mortgage and is saying all this because of that but just wanted to see what you think? I've not got things started with the local broker yet as yesterday was a bank hol in Glasgow. Thanks.

Michelle

dwight-van-man

Hi Michelle,

Yes - she is targetted on conversion, hence the slightly misleading information she's given you. First things first - I too work for NR and deal with brokers, but not in the area of the country you are so there is nothing in this for me.... I also have to say that there is nothing wrong with going direct but my personal feeling is that you will recieve a more personal service from a broker...
Re the points raised:
Using a broker will slow things down. In the sense that you might need to visit their office it might slow things down but if the broker is familiar with NR procedures and using the online system then there should be no difference. One of my broker contacts advised me yesterday of a case he submitted on July 3rd for which he received offer papers on July 6th.

It might be more expensive. It might if the broker charges a fee but even if they do, you're getting a broker making a recommendation of a mortgage with all the safeguards that go with that, along with independent advice on any other products you may be considering. If you use the brokers surveyor, it may actually be slightly cheaper than going through NR (certainly faster...)

You have to phone your broker for case updates. Well you would need to phone NR direct for updates anyway, and if the broker is good and using the online system, then they will know what position your application is at before you phone them. In fact, I would expect a good broker to be phoning you.

£350 Rapid RM fee is for using brokers solicitor. This is blatantly untrue. You can use a broker recommended solicitor if you want and pay whatever they charge. However, the Rapid Remortgage scheme involves NR appointing one of our panel solicitors on receipt of your application. This firm will complete the basic remortgage transfer work for £350, as long as there is no transfer of title or other non-standard requirements involved.

Your NR adviser is targeted and bonused on case conversion, she is also targeted on referals to our L&G reps to discuss life, critical illness insurance etc with you so she will be doing what she can to keep your case. As I say, my personal preference would be to use a broker, but ultimately go with whichever you feel most comfortable.

One final thought in favour of the NR adviser - if she did a decision in principle for you when you first got in contact, then there will have been a credit check run on you. Submitting the case through the broker means a second search will be run as he/she will have to start from scratch.

mleonard79

Thanks so much for such a detailed reply Dwight. The advisor I talked to is very nice and helpful but I did think she was trying to keep me due to her own comission. The credit check isn't a worry as I made sure I didn't get it done while talking to her. As for the local broker, he is fees free. I think I will just go through him after all as I agree with you that it affords me more protection and with his extra knowledge I actually feel he may be able to speed things up if anything goes wrong as opposed to me trying to deal with it myself. Thanks again for all your help.

Michelle

MortgageMamma

HI Michelle

Sorry I didnt respond to your run down of the advice you were given from chase devere and L & C I have been on my holidays. I'm glad you have decided to go through to local broker you contacted via moneysupermarket.com. I hope you get much better service from him and you use him again in future. did you knwo if you make contact with a broker through moneysupermarket.com the broker could have paid between £15-100 for your details? These sort of costs can cripple a small firm if they don't convert the case, I know, as when I first started off I had to buy leads in to build up my client base. Anyway, I don't think you have said but, which are you going for the fixed or the tracker?

mleonard79

Hi MM

No problem, hope you had a good holiday. I decided on the fixed in the end for the added security.

I have an urgent question for you, Dwight and anyone else in the know. As you know I decided to go with the local broker as it seemed the best way to go but I've got a problem now. NR told me that I would end up after fees with £70 left over (£75 valuation application fee, £220 valuation admin fee, £160 for valuation itself, £200-300 legal fees and £25 insurance fee for not taking their buildings so £680-£780 all in and then £750 help with costs so I gain £70 or if legal fees are a little higher I at least get the mortgage pretty much fees free.) Anyway I did the whole application process with the broker yesterday and he got a decision from NR instantly and it all went well. He said that the fees would come to £655 so I would have £70 left over which was pretty much the same as NR so I was pleased with that. He even dropped the papers we needed to sign off at the house last night.

Anyway while reading through the papers I looked at the fees and he added the £220 fee onto the mortgage which we'd discussed on the phone and I was fine with as I thought I'll just pay that off with the help with costs when I get it. The problem is the other fees say £500 solicitors and £155 valuation. I'm fine with the valuation fee but with a £500 solicitors fee that brings the total fees to £875 meaning I'm paying more than I thought. He was oviously not counting the £220 fee when he told me the fee would come to £655! I know its a paltry amount in the whole scheme of remortgaging but it was a bit disappointing. From the NR illustration if they can do it for that then they clearly can do it cheaper. I've phoned the broker and he says that the fees are correct but if I wanted to he could put it through NR's rapid remortgage service for £350 saving £150 but he's never used it before and says he's not sure about their guarantee to have it done in 4 weeks. He says it amounts to a free legals service from the bank and they
can be slow. He also said I could phone any solicitors in Glasgow and wouldn't be able to get the legal work done for £200 as the fees they have to pay out come to at least £295 just for sending away for title deeds etc. I know his solicitor is good - he even sent away for the title deeds straightaway yesterday. I'm hoping to get the mortgage pushed through as quickly as possible due to a lombard loan which a kind lady at lombard has frozen for me for a few weeks but if I don't pay it in that time it'll be £200 more to settle it. However to pay over £200 more for remortgaging in order to do that kind of negates the saving!!

Dwight - is the rapid remortgage service working the way it says it does?

What do you guys think about the fees, what should I do? I could use the broker and take his fees or ues the broker and do rapid remortgage with NR or just go back to NR direct and do it through them??

I need to decide quickly as I'm taking the papers into the office this afternoon. Thanks a lot for any help.

Michelle

MortgageMamma

Hello Michelle

Personally I would never have agreed to the brokers fee's anyway, there should be enough in the commission he is being paid? How much commission is he being paid?

I'm not sure what to tell you to do. If you feel you have been misled by the broker its best to have it out with him, but I would not start the whole process again as you say you need to move quickly. I have used NR's rapid remortgage service and had a completion in four weeks but no case is ever guaranteed to go smoothly!

I think its a lot of messing around going direct again to save yourself £200 espeically since the girl at northern rock blatantly lied to you on your initial conversation.


I would just let things be.

mleonard79

Hi MM

Sorry just re-read what I wrote earlier and it looks like the broker is charging me £220 for his services when he's not charging me at all. He's a fees free broker, the £220 is NR's valuation facilitation fee which you can add to the mortgage. From what I can see on my illustration he'll be getting £700 comission from NR for handling the case so that's not bad for him and I certainly wouldn't be expecting to pay a fee having brought him that sort of comission!!

I didn't feel misled, I think we just got crossed wires to be honest because in every other way he's been very good so far. When we talked about adding the £220 onto the mortgage I wanted to do that so I could pay it off once the help with costs were paid but after that i think he wasn't counting it in the full cost of fees and I was hence why I felt there was a discrepancy when I read the illustration. To be fair when he talked about which solicitors to use he did say we could use NR's but told me he usually uses a local solicitor he works with often and I agreed to that but as I'd got mixed up on the fees didn't realise that the solicitors charge was £500 on its own.

Anyway, you're right I wouldn't want to start the process again as I've been credit checked and the application's been approved. So I talked to my broker again and told him I'd rather go through the Rapid Remortgage Service to save the £150 and he was fine with that. He contacted NR this afternoon and instructed them to do that. I also had the surveyor out this afternoon - so that was done in double quick time! The broker left a message on my machine while I was out saying that the surveyor was very impressed with the flat and actually valued it at £40,000 more than I'd valued it at myself so that was a pleasing bit of news!!

So to cut a long story short I'm much happier with the whole process now and just hope it can get put through as quickly as possible to get this loan paid off before I incur that extra charge. Fingers crossed anyway. Do you think I made the right decision plumping for the fixed at 5.29%? I'll keep you up-to-date with how it goes. Thanks a lot for your advice.

Regards

Michelle