Resonable number of visits to show the house

mr1974

Hello everybody

My landlord has just put his house on the market, to sell it.
He initially said he would cluster visits together and disruption would be minimal. However that does not seem to be the case.

He already came around tuesday and thrusday last week, and for more than half an hour each time. Now today he's phoned asking for the house to be available for viewing from 12:00 to 17:00 next wednesday.

I am planning to talk to him about this, but wanted to crosscheck what is reasonable for me to ask in terms of the frequency and length of the visits. I was thinking about once a week, for no more than 20 mins?

This also creates problems in other ways as we share the house but have locks in each of the rooms and people work during the day. So who is supposed to be collecting the keys (house has five rooms) from each other and stay home to open to the landlord and the people visiting? Some of us have already said they don't want to leave the keys with other people entering the room without them being present!

Where do we stand legally? What are our obligations in these circumstances?

Thanks
mr

silvercar

Check your contract, I would guess it says something about reasonable access, with reasonable notice, for viewings during the last month of the tenancy.

If you've asked him to cluster visits and he asks for viewing for the whole of an afternoon, it could well be that he's complied with your request. If you're asking him to combine viewings he is almost bound to ask for a large time slot to accomadate the viewers.

nickinoo

I think 20 minutes is a bit too short, when our house was on the market recently we had 1 viewer in for about 30 minutes as he wanted to examine as much as he could & he also had a lot of questions he wanted answered (needless to say we didn't go with his offer as he seemed a pain in the bum!).

mr1974

silvercar wrote:

Check your contract, I would guess it says something about reasonable access, with reasonable notice, for viewings during the last month of the tenancy.

A more precise definition of the word reasonable in this context is what I was looking for. The contract does not mention the issue.

silvercar wrote:

If you've asked him to cluster visits and he asks for viewing for the whole of an afternoon, it could well be that he's complied with your request.
If you're asking him to combine viewings he is almost bound to ask for a large time slot to accomadate the viewers.

I think that depends also on the frequency with which that happens. I don't think the frequency/length of visits he's carrying out is reasonable. He takes appointments first and then phones in to alert us he will be visiting.

What if no-one is at home? He has a copy of the keys, but is he entitled to use them to get in for this purpose, or is it a legitimate expectation of us to be present when people come around in the house and into our rooms?

He's coming at 12:00 and cannot expect people to be around, 12:00 on a week day - people work!

What about the issue of the locks of the rooms?

Is he entitled to have a copy of the key at all?

THX
mr

clutton_2

your landlord has NO RIGHT OF ACCESS WHATSOEVER, irrespective of what it may say in your tenancy agreement. Tenants have the legal right of "Quiet Enjoyment" enshrined in Housing Acts - this means that a landlord CANNOT enter your home for any reason without your permission. IF this is a HMO house, you may well have difficulty in terms of his having access to the "common areas", but, he cannot force you to open your individual rooms to him or anyone else.

Many landlords put clauses in Tenancy Agreements to try to prove to Tenants that it is legal, but, it has been tested in the courts who have upheld the legal principal of Quiet Enjoyment. Even a CORGI gas engineer cannot come into the building to do a Safety Check without tenants permission. A landlord can enter for an "emergency", but, showing prospective purchasers round is NOT an emergency !!

Show him an auctioneers catalogue in which is often says "internal inspection is not allowed" if he does not believe you.

let us know how you get on

good luck

BenBar

Hi

You could always ask for a discount on the rent if the visits are taking up your time? The person collecting the keys and staying in on a week day could get the discount?

Worth a try to save money?

liney

I'll be honest; if my tenents were obstructing my potential buyers from viewing, i would give them the months notice and take my chances on a buyer with no chain wanting a quick sale.

I am not saying this is the right thing to do, but he would be within his rights. I am suggesting you don't be too awkward about this if you want to remain in the house until it is sold, thats all.

mr1974

You know when the house where you live is being sold you are sort of prepared to be leaving short notice anyway... Err.. You are sort of prepared to be having to move anyway! So a notice wouldn’t look like big news to us.

A house empty also means no money. I doubt you would find someone to fill it up while it's being sold. Also opens it up to squatters, thieves, vandals, junkies etc.

Ours is a joint tenancy agreement which expired some time in the past, so I guess now it has reverted to a periodic tenancy for which you need 2 months notice AND on a rent date, and served in writing. After that he would have to wait for at least one month to get the house repossessed. We would still have approx another month for the bailiff. Of course we may have to pay court costs. Also he wouldn't be able to let *anyone* in during all this time if the situation get this bitter.

I am not thinking of creating problems for the sake of it, but I don't want him to carry out unlawful behaviour and carry on with it. Having the keys of the house and entering at will sounded odd to me, and for what I understand that is illegal. Also he keeps on receiving mail at this address that we keep for him (even though he doesn't live here), and I am just thinking that is illegal as well. Also I don’t want people to enter my room if I am legally entitled NOT to have them entering it, I’m afraid that’s what I call privacy.

Still I am not quite sure of what a reasonable load of visits in a week would be (frequency+length)??

mr

feesh

I really sympathise - I was in the same situation myself a few months back. There was no easy way of resolving it, without aggravating the landlord (which might have reduced our chances of getting our full deposit back).

In the end, we handed our notice in and left, because we knew we were going to have to leave at some point anyway, and quite frankly there was so much wrong with the house that we imagined it was going to be on the market for months and months and we couldn't handle all the hassle.

ginger_nuts

is this likely to be just a change off landlord or will you have to move .
If its a change off landlord well why fight it .

liney

Then why not ask he makes the 12 - 5pm slot on a Saturday so you can all be at home?

I think 'reasonable' will be the amount of viewings it takes to sell. He has no control over whether these people put in an offer after all.