section 59 - outrageous highway robbery?

liam8282

Also IPCC is for all complaints regarding the police, be that their conduct, decisions they have made, it covers just about everything.

So there is a way that you can appeal and take things as far as you want to go.

A previous post mentioned the officer in charge at the issuing statement not being impartial, well the IPCC is totally indepedant from the police and would be able to come to an impartial decision.

Phlik

liam8282 wrote: »

^ I think that is the whole idea of the S59 though, to stop these petty driving offences getting to court and clogging up the system.

Aye, to combat youngsters tearing around on parks, roads on mini motorbikes etc.
as I said, it's a good idea in principle, just very badly implemented.

It looks like the majority of people admit that they have committed an offence, but just don't like the punishment.

Who does , and 9/10 it's probably justified, it's the 1/10 that bothers me.

Although if I know I'd get a s59 instead of a speeding, I'd tear round like a nutter as it would only cost £150 every 2nd time I got caught, and no points to worry about :T:D

Phlik

Phlik

liam8282 wrote: »

Also IPCC is for all complaints regarding the police, be that their conduct, decisions they have made, it covers just about everything.

So there is a way that you can appeal and take things as far as you want to go.

A previous post mentioned the officer in charge at the issuing statement not being impartial, well the IPCC is totally indepedant from the police and would be able to come to an impartial decision.

but that's effectively using the IPCC as a court room.

Phlik

liam8282

Thats what they are there for, so why not?

It is just a solution for people that think that can't appeal a S59, when actually they can.

If the S59 was a £40 on the spot fine, I don't think there would be a single post about this.

Paradigm

liam8282 wrote: »

Thats what they are there for, so why not?

It is just a solution for people that think that can't appeal a S59, when actually they can.

Taken from the IPCC website...

The IPCC can only deal with complaints about the behaviour of police officers and staff. You have the right to make a complaint if:

• you believe you have been treated badly by a police officer or a member of staff working for the police
• you believe a member of police staff was rude to you or used excessive force
• you were present when the alleged inappropriate conduct occured, close enough to see or hear the inappropriate conduct or have been adversely affected* by the incident
• are distressed as a result of a friend or a relative being treated badly by the police
• are acting on behalf of any of the above (for example, a member of an organisation who has written permission by an individual to make a complaint on their behalf)

None of the above covers appealling a S59 which, at the present time, is legally issued on a Police Officers "say so"!

If you take it to the IPCC you are actually making a complaint about the officers conduct, not an appeal under the law & as far as I can see the IPCC have no powers to overturn a legal document!

gsmmad

I have a Question....

The police for some reason have targets to meet for the amount of seized cars and i did read somewhere that they missed there target last year. Apparently they make money from this. Is this just a new way for them to meet there targets? Therefor having more funds?

Police are becoming like parking attendants! I do see that this S59 seems like a brilliant idea, i do not doubt this. However certain officers will use this just to increase there vehicle seizure numbers larger.

Anyway this is a way for the government to get some more money, and also this just allows for them to boost the number of criminals that they caught however they are just criminalizing people who would not have been criminals if this law wasn't in place.

The UK is becoming very hard to drive in. Rationality says that we should all not drive because of the risks of becoming criminals and spending shed loads of cash just to speed up trips.

Mankysteve

And where did you read they have targets to seize cars

Lum

anewman wrote: »

The police need to use these powers at McDonalds in Blackwood and on Blackwood High Street (South Wales). They cause a right menace to other road users and I am sure if this was the result of their offensive behaviour they wouldn't do it again. http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/cardiff-news/2009/09/17/police-to-clamp-down-on-blackwood-boy-racer-cruisers-91466-24711068/

The traditional police punishment of a slapped wrist just isn't enough, hitting the idiots where it hurts, in the wallet, so they can't buy crap rear spoilers and tinted lights, is just what's needed. It sounds very much like the OP's son was up to something other than not indicating at a roundabout. Whatever it was he did wrong I am sure he won't be doing it again anyway.

I live in Blackwood. The cruisers aren't that bad.

Yes their cars look ridiculous and are mostly crap and I do not share their tastes, but each to their own they probably think my Volvo looks like crap. They've never given me any hassle on my own trips to McDs.

They aren't speeding, at least not in Blackwood itself, they drive up and down the town centre and congregate in McDonalds or Halfords car parks for a chat. The town centre itself is not a residential area and consists entirely of pubs, nightclubs and takeaways at that time of night so it's not like they're disturbing anyone.


What is annoying is the measures the police have taken against the cruisers. We have a town centre full of back breaking speedbumps, then we had them set up an impromptu vehicle checkpoint on the McD's/Asda roundabout that caused a massive tailback through the town centre and now they close the high street to traffic every Thursday night.

So the other week, I'm down with an illness, but really need to pay in this cheque so that I don't get hammered by bank charges the following morning. I'm with the Halifax so I can use a cash machine to do it, but no thanks to the police I've got to park up outside and walk in the !!!!ing rain to pay it in. It also means that when I want to go to my prefered Chinese takeaway I have to detour through residential streets to get there. I'm sure their delivery driver loves having to make that same detour 20 times a night too!


Back on the topic of S59. Wasn't there a recent article in MCN accusing North Wales police of blanketly handing them out to bikers visiting North Wales on a weekend, regardless of their standard of riding?

anewman

Off topic.

Whenever I've been at McDonalds (only once at night I admit, I was scared off by the boy racers) they just drive round and round in circles for hours on end often at excessive speed. I'm sure McD's has lost lots of business due to people not wanting to go there because of the idiots driving round the car park. The best one was a girl racer who managed to stall her car :rotfl: Noisy exhausts and music are sometimes evident too. They're probably not so bad now due to the police crackdown on them. I've always thought the ideal way to deal with it would be a pay to enter barrier where you get your money back when you buy something, as I am sure the true idiots don't buy so much as 3 chicken nuggets.

Lum

Do you live in Blackwood then?
In other areas they can be worse but I've never seen illegal speeds in Blackwood, it's not really possible. The worst I've seen is them using the ridiculous speed bumps (that are basically two 45 degree curbstones back to back) to do wheelspins on. I don't blame them. I hate those speedbumps too.

Also, have a read of this for an example of Section 59 abuse

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18023121

I've always been polite with the police as I've always been treated fairly but the ***** I dealt with today must be some sort of new breed.

I was issued with a Section 59 warning for overtaking a coach and a Volvo estate in front of the coach. The volvo was unmarked and he pulled me 1/2 mile later, after driving into town. Was a bit perplexed to see the lights but I had crept over 60 for the manuever so I was expecting a warning from a bored copper.

It was nothing to do with speed he said, although he knew I was over 60 as that was his speed. It was the overtake itself, which he then tried to explain could have caused distress. I asked if the manuever was safe and he said (twice actually during the conversation) that it was fine apart from the "manner" of the overtake which when pressed he could not really expand on.

When I asked if I could appeal, he offered to change it from a warning to an actual offence and have the car seized then and there, so I obviously dropped it. Signed the notice, breathalysed and left. Bit galling really as if had been around Friday he could have done some real work and maybe done something about the bloke who chucked a bottle at me (other thread).

Anyway, can these things be appealed and whats the name of the site people use for appealing motoring offences? Ta.

This guy drives one of the new Nissan GTRs and is hardly a chav.