No swingeing cuts in first year, says David Cameron

Thrugelmir

chucky wrote: »

people are kidding themselves about this, it's a romantic idea but the economy isn't like that - if you make the cuts during a recovery period or a stable period the results are NOT the same.

The budget deficit has to be rectified.

Tory plan max pain.

Labour plan service higher debt for longer - less pain but for far longer.

People are kidding themselves that the economy alone is going to fill the void. We won't even be back to 2007 GDP levels until 2011 ( Labour pre budget figures). So growth alone will not suffice.

The Nanny state has backfired. People are going to have do something for themselves! Though many seem not to realised it yet.

chucky

Thrugelmir wrote: »

The budget deficit has to be rectified.

Tory plan max pain.

Labour plan service higher debt for longer - less pain but for far longer.

People are kidding themselves that the economy alone is going to fill the void. We won't even be back to 2007 GDP levels until 2011 ( Labour pre budget figures). So growth alone will not suffice.

The Nanny state has backfired. People are going to have do something for themselves! Though many seem not to realised it yet.

so that's it then - you've determined the future and you've decided what's going to happen. the tories have the answer. well done :T

Rochdale_Pioneers

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Spending reductions are coming. Whoever is in power. Whether the Tories cut in 5 years or Labour in 10 years the net result will be the same.

Personally I prefer the quicker approach, not for political reasons I should add. As possibly the economy will hit another recessionary period in the 2020's. Despite MR B's claims the economy is cyclical and for different reasons will go through periods of boom and bust. Though not of the scale of today.

And a debate about quick cuts vs longer is absolutely fine. I might disagree with the Tory policy (and looking back at Davos I'm not alone) but I have no problem at all with them having that as a policy.

Where I object is when they are talking down the economy for political reasons. Cameron and Osborne both stated explicitly that Britain was following Greece down the about-to-collapse-tomorrow route. When challenged on this by various economists, with these comments then picked up by Robert Peston and others, we then have Hammond stating explicitly that noone is comparing Britain to Greece.

Either he is lying or he is ignorant of what his boss in the Treasury team and his party leader said. Regardless, he can't change what CamerOsborne said at the weekend or the reaction to it by economics commentators. If the FT report on this that is reportage, not spin by anyone.

As I said, the Tories may well be the government after an election which could be as soon at the end of next month. It is absolutely right and proper to scrutinise what they are planning to do. The time to criticise the many mistakes made by government without demanding any detailed answers at all from the alternative government is long past. If its right to demand from Labour what they would do - and it is - then its also right to demand the same from the Tories.

Thrugelmir

chucky wrote: »

so that's it then - you've determined the future and you've decided what's going to happen. the tories have the answer. well done :T

So are you suggesting that Labour is currently being decitful and untruthful. And if re-elected will actually be as harsh as the Tories in cutting back.

treliac

baileysbattlebus wrote: »

In a few years the school leaving age will be 18 - potentially all children could go into the sixth form and potentially most of them could do "fine" - does that mean we will need as many university places as high school places?

Is this more short term trickery, designed to distort unemployment figures?

Pointless, I hope a change of government halts it.

As it is..... they can't even keep vast numbers of 12 year olds in the classroom and off the streets!!

Emy1501

What does swingeing cuts mean, 1m 1B 10B? With no real explanation DC can do what he wants when he gets into power. Boy George has already said the Tories will do what ever it takes to preserve the AAA rating. I notice he palyed on that comment that the UK has a 80% chance of a downgrade etc.

The markets will determine what cuts happen this year and next and I suspect it won't be pretty especially if the 0.1% growth we saw is anything to go by. We have a choice as has already been said limited cuts and in the end likely higher rates or more cuts and hopefully lower rates. Which ever way we go will be painful and who knows which will be the best outcome.

Also who knows whether DC and his party want the markets to put pressure on Labour? The rating agency have been happy to wait until the Tories get in before making noises, also one of Pestons recent pieces uses the argument that maybe the price the UK is able borrow at the moment is determined by Tory potential polices. It may play in DC hands if people start to think the Tories maybe are no different to Labour on cuts in the short term.

Thoses who think there will be no pain are living in a dream world. The pain will come within 6-12 months of the new government regardless of who gets into power. Just liket the sub prime borrower you can't delay your problems for ever. We are not Greece yet but we maybe if we don't sort things out and the Tories will be able to play on that in due course.

Rochdale_Pioneers

Emy1501 wrote: »

What does swingeing cuts mean, 1m 1B 10B? With no real explanation DC can do what he wants when he gets into power. Boy George has already said the Tories will do what ever it takes to preserve the AAA rating.

The markets will determine what cuts happen this year and next and I suspect it won't be pretty especially if the 0.1% growth we saw is anything to go by. We have a choice as has already been said limited cuts and in the end higher rates or more cuts and hopefully lower rates. Which ever way we go will be painful and who knows which will be the best outcome.

Also who knows whether DC and his party want the markets to put pressure on Labour? The rating agency have been happy to wait until the Tories get in before making noises. If they think the Tories are going to be no different to Labour maybe they will make their noises now which may play in the DC plans.

Which is why he keeps describing Britain as Greece. Spook the markets now, provoke a credit crisis before the election then blame the whole thing on Labour.

As for your earlier paragraphs, is it not astounding to hand economic policy over to the markets? They get to dictate Britain's actions by threatening the AAA whenever they want something. Did Cameron not learn from watching his boss in 1992? Then for AAA rating read membership of the ERM, and the markets took billions out of the Bank of England.

Thrugelmir

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Which is why he keeps describing Britain as Greece. Spook the markets now, provoke a credit crisis before the election then blame the whole thing on Labour.

As for your earlier paragraphs, is it not astounding to hand economic policy over to the markets? They get to dictate Britain's actions by threatening the AAA whenever they want something. Did Cameron not learn from watching his boss in 1992? Then for AAA rating read membership of the ERM, and the markets took billions out of the Bank of England.

The 2 most indebted countries in the world are Japan followed by the UK. By indebted thats Government, Corporate and Consumer.

The debt levels will impact recovery there's no hiding from this.

So what rabbit can either Brown or Cameron pull out the hat?

bouche

chucky wrote: »

it looks like if the Tories do win the election, they won't be making all of those drastic cuts many on here are expecting for quite some time :eek:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8490024.stm

Why would anyone listen to Dave, he's the opposition, not in power so what's the point unless it's the tories propopganda being aired and printed.

I can see right through it, can't anyone else. 45 posters obviously can't:T

Thrugelmir

bouche wrote: »

Why would anyone listen to Dave, he's the opposition, not in power so what's the point unless it's the tories propopganda being aired and printed.

I can see right through it, can't anyone else. 45 posters obviously can't:T

That's a constructive contribution to the debate. :think: