Made redundant whilst off sick

jdturk

whilst I don't think you acted proper I would suggest that if you have a letter from your Doctor that you look at starting Employment Tribunal for the amount of money owed. i can't see you losing unless theres something you haven't told us.

Even though you felt screwed over you should have informed the company you were fit to work again IMO

ceridwen

I understand your thinking on this OP - and that you would not expect to work out your notice - because others didnt.

I'm not quite sure what your position will be because you didnt actually turn up at the workplace when your sickleave was over. I think you might well get asked why you personally didnt do so. I have to admit that - in your position - I would have gone back to the workplace expecting to work the next workday after my sick note expired. They might well have sent you straight back home again - telling you not to work your notice. However - you would have demonstrated by your presence there that you were fit for work again and intending to do your job as normal (having the "back-up" of a note from the doctor signing you back as fit to work as an added precaution). I'm not sure what the position is whether doctors normally sign a "fit to work again" note - as I've certainly never had one or been asked for one - nor has anyone else AFAIK. I thought the fact that the doctor hasnt given you a further sicknote means that its automatically recognised that you are fit to work again??

I'm not sure how things will pan out for you now because you didnt do that.

Roobarb73

I am confused -

so you did not go back to work after your sick note expired?

are they taking the view you were therefore on unauthorised absence?

lasergirl123

ceridwen wrote: »

I understand your thinking on this OP - and that you would not expect to work out your notice - because others didnt.

I'm not quite sure what your position will be because you didnt actually turn up at the workplace when your sickleave was over. I think you might well get asked why you personally didnt do so. I have to admit that - in your position - I would have gone back to the workplace expecting to work the next workday after my sick note expired. They might well have sent you straight back home again - telling you not to work your notice. However - you would have demonstrated by your presence there that you were fit for work again and intending to do your job as normal (having the "back-up" of a note from the doctor signing you back as fit to work as an added precaution). I'm not sure what the position is whether doctors normally sign a "fit to work again" note - as I've certainly never had one or been asked for one - nor has anyone else AFAIK. I thought the fact that the doctor hasnt given you a further sicknote means that its automatically recognised that you are fit to work again??

I'm not sure how things will pan out for you now because you didnt do that.

Thanks for that. I've now been back to CAB & got some advice from an employment lawyer - both suggest I ask for full pay for the whole 3 month notice period & if they don't agree to issue for ET1 to take them to an employment tribunal.

lasergirl123

Roobarb73 wrote: »

I am confused -

so you did not go back to work after your sick note expired?

are they taking the view you were therefore on unauthorised absence?

No I didn't go back as I had been made redundant. I've been advised to take to an employment tribunal if they don't pay my full notice. The redundancy letter said I should only go back if requested to do so & I wasn't.

Roobarb73

Hmmm....

Will your doctor give you something retrospectively to confirm you were fit to return as of the end of the sick note? They might not (ours wouldn't I am sure!) but if you explained the circumstances they might...

Ultimately if you were signed off sick for the notice period they are entitled to pay SSP only for that period. You would therefore need to establish that as of the end of the sick note period, you were no longer sick, were able to return to work, and had effectively been told you were being PILON and this is why you did not go back.

I do not agree that you should be able to recover the full 3 months' notice, however and am not sure of the rationale behind that. You were signed off sick for the first month of it, and so they were surely entitled to pay SSP only for that period? If you had gone back to work when the sick note had expired, been told on that day you were being PILON for the remainder of the notice period, they wouldn't have had to pay you full pay for the month's notice you had already been off. So I don't think you've been advised correctly there. Wouldn't surprise me from CAB though...

Uncertain

Remember that a doctor's "sick note" only ADVISES you to refrain from work and is, strictly speaking, for SSP purposes only. It doesn't prevent you from working.

If an employer wants you to get more from your doctor he is quite entitled to charge for it as it is not an NHS matter.

So, tell the employer to pay for a doctor's report if they want one. The doctor will of course need your permission to write one and you have a right to see it before it is sent. It will cost the firm about £180.

lasergirl123

Uncertain wrote: »

Remember that a doctor's "sick note" only ADVISES you to refrain from work and is, strictly speaking, for SSP purposes only. It doesn't prevent you from working.

If an employer wants you to get more from your doctor he is quite entitled to charge for it as it is not an NHS matter.

So, tell the employer to pay for a doctor's report if they want one. The doctor will of course need your permission to write one and you have a right to see it before it is sent. It will cost the firm about £180.

Good advice - many thanks. They have been an horrendous firm to work for & have treated their staff (both current & ex) with utter contempt.

lasergirl123

Roobarb73 wrote: »

Hmmm....

Will your doctor give you something retrospectively to confirm you were fit to return as of the end of the sick note? They might not (ours wouldn't I am sure!) but if you explained the circumstances they might...

Ultimately if you were signed off sick for the notice period they are entitled to pay SSP only for that period. You would therefore need to establish that as of the end of the sick note period, you were no longer sick, were able to return to work, and had effectively been told you were being PILON and this is why you did not go back.

I do not agree that you should be able to recover the full 3 months' notice, however and am not sure of the rationale behind that. You were signed off sick for the first month of it, and so they were surely entitled to pay SSP only for that period? If you had gone back to work when the sick note had expired, been told on that day you were being PILON for the remainder of the notice period, they wouldn't have had to pay you full pay for the month's notice you had already been off. So I don't think you've been advised correctly there. Wouldn't surprise me from CAB though...

My doctor's view was that any employer who makes someone redundant whilst off sick (particularly whilst off with depression/work stress) is, in his words, 'a complete b****rd' and he will do everything he can to help me. He has given me a 'sign off' sick note from the day after I was made redundant.

Uncertain

lasergirl123 wrote: »

My doctor's view was that any employer who makes someone redundant whilst off sick (particularly whilst off with depression/work stress) is, in his words, 'a complete b****rd' and he will do everything he can to help me. He has given me a 'sign off' sick note from the day after I was made redundant.

Excellent....

A doctor's duty is to his patient. They are not fools and if it is obvious that the work situation is genuinely making the patient ill, then there is a lot they can do to help.

In a vaguely similar situation where an employer was demanding "medical records" (which of course they cannot get - only a report if the patient consents) a doctor smiled as said to me "Well that can easily take three months if it helps"......