Paypal Issued Chargeback for Car sold - What can I do?

R4ABigman

Hi there

First time post for me, hoping to seek some advice.

A little while ago, we sold a Renault Espace via Ebay Motors. The buyer paid for the car via Paypal immediately after winning the auction (slightly weird, as they hadn't seen the car yet) to a sum of £500.

When they came to collect the car, there was an issue with the alternator, so we knocked off £100 on the day (by cash), then got a signed receipt, saw the guy's council tax form and filled in the V5C without any trouble.

A few weeks later we received a charge back notice from Paypal because the buyer had not received the goods. Basically, a scam artist. So the full £500 was immediately removed from our account (taking us to -£500 as we had already removed the actual funds based on horror stories of Paypal from the past). We immediately provided Paypal with proof of purchase (the signed receipt, the letter from the DVLA acknowledging the sale, a letter from the Congestion Charge people proving we no longer owned the car), and yet Paypal ruled against us?!

So we are now very much out of pocket, and the accounts frozen. I'm feeling pretty helpless right now, having been screwed over.

We don't own the car any more according to everyone but Paypal, so we can't report it as stolen (nor would want to). I'm considering legal action against Paypal. Is there anything I can do?!

frivolous_fay

It's gotta be small claims... against him, not PP. I take it you made a note of his address?

R4ABigman

The problem is - what happens if a stolen credit card was used, for example. Or a hijacked paypal account? I'm not sure a gung-ho approach to this guy directly is the best way forward...

And even if it is the same guy - there is nothing to stop him taking that line of defense.

Sugar_Coated_Owl

I think your only option is small claims court. PayPal aren't going to be interested as you've discovered.

stebiz

Let them take you to court for the £500, if they think they are in the right.

Stebiz

cyberbob

You were very stupid as you know to except paypal for the car. Ebay motors is the only place you do not have to accept paypal. All Paypal will except for proof of delivery for an item over £150 is online tracking and signature. So you can show them whatever you like but it wont make any difference. If you do your not bring account out of the Negative balance they will put debt collection agencies on and it could effect your credit rating.

Your only real option is to try and take the buyer to small claims court. Paypal have acted in accordance with the T&Cs so you have no comeback there at all.

What I don't understand is if as you said you had heard horror stories about paypal. Why didn;t you spend 10 minutes doing some research. It would have saved a lot of problems and saved you money.

R4ABigman

This has prompted me to pull out the t&c just in case anyone else might end up in a similiar situation. From the T&c:

4.4 Risk of Reversals, Chargebacks and Claims. The receipt of a payment into your PayPal Account does not equate to the receipt of cleared funds. A notification that E-money has been sent to you, does not amount to a receipt of E-money in your Account unless you have accepted the payment. You acknowledge and agree that a payment transaction is completed and received by you even if it becomes subject to a Reversal, Chargeback. Claim, Reserve or hold. When you receive a payment, you are liable to PayPal for the full amount of the payment plus any Fees if the payment is later invalidated for any reason. In addition to any other liability, if there is a Reversal, or if you lose a Chargeback or Claim and you are not entitled to a payment under the Seller Protection Programme, you will owe PayPal an amount equal to the Reversal, Chargeback or Claim and our Fees per section 8 (including a Chargeback Fee if applicable) and PayPal will debit your Balance to recover such an amount. If a sender of a payment files a Chargeback, the credit card company, not PayPal, will determine who wins the Chargeback. You can find out more about Chargebacks by reviewing our Chargeback Guide, accessible via the PayPal Security Centre and the section called: “Selling Safely”. The PayPal Security Centre is accessed via the PayPal website.

10.1 Your Liability.

(a) You are responsible for all Reversals, Chargebacks,!fees, fines, penalties and other liability incurred by PayPal, a PayPal User, or a third party caused by your use of the Services and/or arising from your breach of this Agreement. You agree to reimburse PayPal, a User, or a third party for any and all such liability.

(b) Liability for PayPal Buyer Protection Claims and Buyer Complaint Policy Claims. !Notwithstanding any other section of this Agreement, if!PayPal makes a final decision that you lose a Claim filed directly with PayPal, you will be required to re-imburse PayPal for your liability. Your liability will include the full purchase price of the item and original postage costs (and in some cases, you may not receive the item back). PayPal Seller Protection may cover your liability, see section 11 below.

peter_the_piper

Curious to know if the buyer was dumb enough to register the car in their own name/family name. Useful to know if paypal try to use county court to get £500 off the op.

mrcol1000

If you write to DVLA you can request the detials of the keeper of a vehicle. You have to pay a couple of quid though. You may have to suggest they were in an accident with your car or something along those lines.

trustme_3

Guys, I am new to this. So please bear with me. (I dont know how to post a new thread). Anyways have a BIG nightmare with paypal and need your help and guidance. Basically, a few years ago (when I was a teenager) I saw a really good deal on Ebay. It was a 4 PS3's for £900. I thought this was a good deal and within an impulse I immediately bought them and paid via paypal. However, over the next few days - sense got to me and I got the feeling this was a fradulent transaction. I immediately cut the direct debit off my current account so that no money can be taken/trasnsferred to paypal to pay the seller. I also made a claim to paypal stating that this was a fradulent transaction. The funny thing is Paypal agreed in my favour that that this was a fradulent transaction. HOWEVER... because paypal paid on my behalf now they were out of pocket for £900! And now they were chasing me for payment! So for the past 5 years paypal have been trying to claim the £900 from me. I have had calls from NCO (debt collectors), letters etc. But to this day I have refused to pay. Within the last two years the harrassment has stopped. And all was forgotten. Until recently. The thing is I opened a fresh new account with paypal because I still buy and sell on ebay. All was well for the past year. When a few months ago paypal limited my account, which had £1000 in it. They stated that it was linked to another account which had arrears of £900! They stated my account will only be reinstated when I pay the £900! And I have refused to pay. However, from your expertise I need your help. I refuse to pay. But If I paid the £900 with a credit card. Can I do a chargeback with paypal?

jopwo_87

trustme wrote: »

Guys, I am new to this. So please bear with me. (I dont know how to post a new thread). Anyways have a BIG nightmare with paypal and need your help and guidance. Basically, a few years ago (when I was a teenager) I saw a really good deal on Ebay. It was a 4 PS3's for £900. I thought this was a good deal and within an impulse I immediately bought them and paid via paypal. However, over the next few days - sense got to me and I got the feeling this was a fradulent transaction. I immediately cut the direct debit off my current account so that no money can be taken/trasnsferred to paypal to pay the seller. I also made a claim to paypal stating that this was a fradulent transaction. The funny thing is Paypal agreed in my favour that that this was a fradulent transaction. HOWEVER... because paypal paid on my behalf now they were out of pocket for £900! And now they were chasing me for payment! So for the past 5 years paypal have been trying to claim the £900 from me. I have had calls from NCO (debt collectors), letters etc. But to this day I have refused to pay. Within the last two years the harrassment has stopped. And all was forgotten. Until recently. The thing is I opened a fresh new account with paypal because I still buy and sell on ebay. All was well for the past year. When a few months ago paypal limited my account, which had £1000 in it. They stated that it was linked to another account which had arrears of £900! They stated my account will only be reinstated when I pay the £900! And I have refused to pay. However, from your expertise I need your help. I refuse to pay. But If I paid the £900 with a credit card. Can I do a chargeback with paypal?

Thats interesting seeing as PS3's only came out in 2007