Tempt my dog

lostinrates

Fire_Fox wrote: »

Interesting ... Calcium and magnesium oppose/ balance one another in the (human) body. Both are key for bone health, but also muscular contraction and relaxation. If there isn't sufficient calcium in the diet the body will release from stores, i.e. leach from the bones. Long-term this may become a problem. In humans extra protein when 'dieting' has been proven to reduce muscle wastage so his might be a good thing in your dog ... ??

And this is why you need a good eye on your own animals food you know, I know that, and yet have considered the two minerals independantly, relating magnesium mainly to heart health ....calcium (in excess) in large and giant breeds is associate with osteochondritis and IIRC DJD. Not sure about the displasias ...not really read anything as don't relate to me directly. Bone health is a big deal in giant dogs with a huge increase in diagnosis of OCD. I have also noticed a more sister but unsurprising link which I'm not going to say because it is a hunch based on personal figures, and has never been tested. (and I don't want to start a rumour on something that could be totally erroneous!) OCD t the primary line of defence is exercise and nutrition both being appropriate.

Magnesium is a bit of a trend in animal nutrition ATM I think. Mind you, I take magnesium and find it pretty good (that and IronC combo are the only things that I can ''feel'' the difference when taking). I haven't read ANY of the papers behind the magnesium trend, but its in lots and lots of supplements, and annecdotally people rave about its impact with horses (as a calmer)

My personal opinion is that not eating regularly will put more of a strain on the dog's body long term than having a diet that isn't specifically designed for large breeds. If the dog will eat raw, I'd buy in some complete mixes to use up to the point you can discuss this with a veterinary nutritionist. Bozita is complete too and not overly expensive so could be worth a shot.

I agree. (although I have seen interesting theories relating to the giving of irregular diets they are not something I think is appropriate in most breeds and the majority of settings! certainly not this breed).

She showed mild interest in tripe, but not enough to eat it *sigh*

She did get very excited while I was mixing feeds though and tonight she has had cat food (junk cat food sadly) a chicken breast and some mashed potato, and her pills ina sardine. This was a reasonable volume of food, matching her normal portion for the first time, which is in many resects a positive sign.

I did ut down a bowl of soaked kibble with sme sardine in it which she toyed with and ate a little, but I'm going to listen to her and ditch the dried food and not try again for a while....she must think I'm really thick to keep offering it

lostinrates

Fire_Fox wrote: »

Yes I work in the NHS, currently in physical activity :j tho I also 'dabble' in dietetics. Previous incarnations have been hospital pharmacy, stop smoking advisor, university research labs; hold qualifications in health-related exercise, nutrition, pharmacy, microbiology and genetics!!

That isn't meant to sound show off-y: rather to show that I know 'a bit of this and a bit of that' when it comes to biological disciplines. I try to say whether I am making educated guesses or have actually looked something up. Note NO veterinary qualifications or experience.

It doesn't sound showy offy. Its interesting.

Fire_Fox

lostinrates wrote: »

And this is why you need a good eye on your own animals food you know, I know that, and yet have considered the two minerals independantly, relating magnesium mainly to heart health ....calcium (in excess) in large and giant breeds is associate with osteochondritis and IIRC DJD. Not sure about the displasias ...not really read anything as don't relate to me directly. Bone health is a big deal in giant dogs with a huge increase in diagnosis of OCD. I have also noticed a more sister but unsurprising link which I'm not going to say because it is a hunch based on personal figures, and has never been tested. (and I don't want to start a rumour on something that could be totally erroneous!) OCD t the primary line of defence is exercise and nutrition both being appropriate.

Magnesium is a bit of a trend in animal nutrition ATM I think. Mind you, I take magnesium and find it pretty good (that and IronC combo are the only things that I can ''feel'' the difference when taking). I haven't read ANY of the papers behind the magnesium trend, but its in lots and lots of supplements, and annecdotally people rave about its impact with horses (as a calmer)

I agree. (although I have seen interesting theories relating to the giving of irregular diets they are not something I think is appropriate in most breeds and the majority of settings! certainly not this breed).

She showed mild interest in tripe, but not enough to eat it *sigh*

She did get very excited while I was mixing feeds though and tonight she has had cat food (junk cat food sadly) a chicken breast and some mashed potato, and her pills ina sardine. This was a reasonable volume of food, matching her normal portion for the first time, which is in many resects a positive sign.

I did ut down a bowl of soaked kibble with sme sardine in it which she toyed with and ate a little, but I'm going to listen to her and ditch the dried food and not try again for a while....she must think I'm really thick to keep offering it

The heart is a muscle, so you are right in thinking magnesium is important for heart health! Interesting book to read is 'The Magnesium Miracle' - looks commercial, but actually based on research.

I have taken magnesium supplements myself as I struggle with stress/ chronic insomnia/ SAD/ restless legs syndrome, tho I am generally not an advocate of supplementing individual nutrients. Nutrients work in combination with others, taking one can disturb the delicate balance (unless recommended by a state registered dietician or prescribed by your GP). Best to get them from a natural balanced diet wherever possible.

If you are adding potato and chicken breast to a complete pet food then you will be missing out on essential fats as well as minerals, be careful. Great the dog is eating tho!! :T

Mutter_2

Antibiotics can cause the dog to feel sick, therefore not wanting to eat Some drugs apparently alter the taste of food.
It sounds as though your dog wasn't a greedy eater anyway.

There is a list of antibiotic side effects which I wont post, as if you've ever read the leaflet in a prescription drug for humans, it could scare us half to death.
Suffice to say that many mention gastro problems. Humans too can lose their appetite until the course is done.

You may wish to research "probiotics for dogs".

When my dog was ill, he would like a food one day, then the next he'd turn his face away. Duck, pheasant, a little liver, cooked fish. I would have tried anything and did.

Hope something works for you, but hopefully once the antibiotic course is over there will be an improvement.

lostinrates

Mutter wrote: »

Antibiotics can cause the dog to feel sick, therefore not wanting to eat Some drugs apparently alter the taste of food.
It sounds as though your dog wasn't a greedy eater anyway.

There is a list of antibiotic side effects which I wont post, as if you've ever read the leaflet in a prescription drug for humans, it could scare us half to death.
Suffice to say that many mention gastro problems. Humans too can lose their appetite until the course is done.

You may wish to research "probiotics for dogs".

When my dog was ill, he would like a food one day, then the next he'd turn his face away. Duck, pheasant, a little liver, cooked fish. I would have tried anything and did.

Hope something works for you, but hopefully once the antibiotic course is over there will be an improvement.

She had gone off food before antibiotics started, sadly. Normally she is a fairly greedy eater...but not as greedy as her sister! I tend to think of her as the norml weight, normal eater of the house: she eats most things, at a moderate pace with intention, unlike her sister who eats anything, fast, or the other dog, who is fussy (unless its stolen, she'll steal the most amaing variety of things given a chance) and would refer to have her food slowly, over the course of an entire day!

tandraig

Its interesting you said that she had eaten some yoghurt yet refused a sausage.... was it natural yoghurt by any chance? or a probiotic one? perhaps she has studied nutrition and is working out her own ideal diet - clever girl! seriously - perhaps she feels she needs more calcium or those clever tummy bugs which make you better not ill! I think the dog must know exactly what she needs and is capable of digesting - to me she is giving herself a convalescents diet (not that i recommend cat food if you are convalescing - but for dogs it may be the ideal food).

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

Gonna have to ask you to bear with me on this one -

Dog food is saltier than cat food, if I remember rightly, this is one of the reasons that it is bad for cats.

I burned my gum 2 weeks ago on a hot potato. The burn is right at the back of the teeth where it is almost impossible to see. There is a circular blister, which has burst, but there is a large (1 inch strip) of gum which is white and slightly 'loose' around the back of my teeth, right at the edge.

I had a couple of salt n vinegar discos on Monday night without thinking. I crunched down on them as usual. Slight pause. Then OWWWWWWW.

The flavouring has 'burned' my mouth even more than the original hot spud did, whether it was just the salt, or the acidic vinegar flavour, I don't know.

Perhaps your dog has something similar, especially if he has a tiny fragment of meat getting stuck between a sore gum and a tooth?

If so, low salt, low acid, less 'grainy' meat?

Mutter_2

lostinrates wrote: »

She had gone off food before antibiotics started, sadly. Normally she is a fairly greedy eater...but not as greedy as her sister! I tend to think of her as the norml weight, normal eater of the house: she eats most things, at a moderate pace with intention, unlike her sister who eats anything, fast, or the other dog, who is fussy (unless its stolen, she'll steal the most amaing variety of things given a chance) and would refer to have her food slowly, over the course of an entire day!

I found the probiotics interesting. cannot say any more as rules here apply and I respect that.

My late dog would not be interested in his bowl. Bring out the chopping board or grater and he would be at my feet in a shot. And he was deaf!

I'm sure he was a, would be cheese and veggie guy. Cauli being his favourite.

So she went off food before the antibiotics. Assuming then she was unwell to be prescribed the medication.

So unwell dog = not eating.
Antibiotics = not eating.


I so hope she eats after the course has finished. You must be worried sick yourself. Though five days is needed to sort the gut out and see why probiotics is useful after antibiotics.

It is not medical advice, but common knowledge, to know that antibiotics not only kill bad bacteria but also good, which needs to be restored by probiotics.

You say she is playful etc. A sick dog is lethargic. Maybe even withdraw all the feeding fuss. Put down the food and allow her to choose.

I so hope she gets well soon. I can't decide whether I'd prefer to be fretting or as now no dog at all.

ETA. I did see when I was trying to tempt mine, someone suggested a jar of baby food warmed slightly.

lostinrates

Mutter wrote: »

You say she is playful etc. A sick dog is lethargic. Maybe even withdraw all the feeding fuss. Put down the food and allow her to choose..

Yes, I'm very aware that she may well be playing us...hence soe of my concern about getting drawn in prematurely to too much choice, too much coaxing. But she is VERY slight.

I find the probiotic stuff releavnt too....new turn of events this evening in fact THREE new turns of events, but want to call my vet and have a chat....i'll share them ASAP, hopefully tomorrow.

Mutter_2

tandraig wrote: »

Its interesting you said that she had eaten some yoghurt yet refused a sausage.... was it natural yoghurt by any chance? or a probiotic one? perhaps she has studied nutrition and is working out her own ideal diet - clever girl! seriously - perhaps she feels she needs more calcium or those clever tummy bugs which make you better not ill! I think the dog must know exactly what she needs and is capable of digesting - to me she is giving herself a convalescents diet (not that i recommend cat food if you are convalescing - but for dogs it may be the ideal food).

I understand the irony tandraig, but maybe you hit on something when suggesting she is working out her own diet. If only she could reach it.

Beware of probiotic yogs though when taken at same time as antibiotics.
Pro cancels the anti, which is the last thing you want. 5 Hours at the minimum between is I believe the best.

I would love to say "speak to your Vet about probiotics" But apart from say half a dozen enlightened Vets who practise natural alongside of medicinal remedies I would think "short shrift."

It will be fine. She is playful. If it were me, I would be happy with that.